Greta Thunberg

adam cool dude said:
No but he does have a point. Being clean is not economical and doesn't help with growth. Dem are the facts. He knows that while the West go green. China will carry on and become the number 1 global super power.
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This simply isn't true though and hasn't been for a while. The West isn't really going green at any serious rate of knots and the way we are doing what we are is because we are exporting our carbon emissions to China.

China if anything are one of the world leaders in green tech. The future is renewables and building a robust economy around them has made sense for a long time. Same reason infrastructure projects benefit a country even though their headline cost is astronomical. As long as you make sure you don't give the contracts to foreign companies of course.
 
Back when I was in primary school, it was all about the ozone layer, CFCs and recycling. The topic was called global warming. Back then, the ozone layer was damaged and recycling was restricted mainly to bottle banks and paper banks.

Nowadays, we have curbside recycling, use TFTs instead of CRTs, more devices granted but many of them are low powered e.g. tablets, 20W LED bulbs instead of 100W incandescent bulbs, smart metres for usage awareness, double glazing, goodbye to plastic bags, more renewable energy, introduction of heat pumps, less use of CFCs and the ozone layer is now mostly mended.

So we have achieved all of that and it would be great to continue the effort, especially when solar power really kicks off. It's just that it feels we're still being gas-lit by the likes of Greta.

One of my friends was through-and-through Tory but recently lurched to the left and is now 'avoiding' all plastics. All manner of foods like cheese, meats, butter and not being able to keep them in the fridge for long because he's also avoiding clingfilm. I did suggest tupperware boxes because they're reusable, but no, not that either - "because it's plastic". So in my mind, I'm for recycling whatever plastics I can recycle. Otherwise if you dwell on it too much, you become obsessive. Not good for your mind.
 
adam cool dude said:
No but he does have a point. Being clean is not economical and doesn't help with growth. Dem are the facts. He knows that while the West go green. China will carry on and become the number 1 global super power.
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Trump might have a point somewhere, but sadly he can’t grasp or isn’t willing to deal the issue at hand. A policy of a subsidised energy prices at the cost of our future is fine, but at least be honest about the facts and accept we are acting like plebs.
 
fez said:
Thats an awful argument for not taking it more seriously. I don't want to have a world where huge numbers of people have miserable lives because we can't make the changes needed to arrest the worst of climate change. By that wisdom why even bother because we will just adapt to extreme weather and losing large amounts of land mass to rising sea levels.



They haven't set a date for anything. Are you expecting to wake up one day and the ice caps to have disappeared and for your ankles to be wet? Good to know there are people who couldn't care less about future generation if it affects their lives a little though. Exactly the sort of people that have got us into this mess because who cares about anyone else if i'm alright?
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I think you'll find my carbon footprint is much lower than yours.
 
Troezar said:
"Faith" says it all really. Go and read the IPCC report, most definitely not about impending doom. I know many people say the fossil fuel industry has a financial interest in the status quo but fail to mention the green lobby is a huge industry with estimates in the trillions of dollars, it's the new gold rush. Scientists can be bought too, even if it means people quite directly being injured as a result. Everyone is following the money, that's not to say what is really going on climate-wise because no-one knows, they haven't got the foggiest how it all works. If they did they'd be able to clearly explain it which they can't as it's too vast and complex/chaotic a system. I'm absolutely confident they will not be able to influence it one iota, those who adapt will be fine. I'd be far more worried about the geoengineers trying to play god ushering in a new ice age, that would very quickly finish us off.
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You mean the IPCC report that is somewhat conservative because it won't get released without consensus of thousands of dissenting opinions? It's basically guaranteed to be worse than that report.
 
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Troezar said:
"Faith" says it all really. Go and read the IPCC report, most definitely not about impending doom. I know many people say the fossil fuel industry has a financial interest in the status quo but fail to mention the green lobby is a huge industry with estimates in the trillions of dollars, it's the new gold rush. Scientists can be bought too, even if it means people quite directly being injured as a result. Everyone is following the money, that's not to say what is really going on climate-wise because no-one knows, they haven't got the foggiest how it all works. If they did they'd be able to clearly explain it which they can't as it's too vast and complex/chaotic a system. I'm absolutely confident they will not be able to influence it one iota, those who adapt will be fine. I'd be far more worried about the geoengineers trying to play god ushering in a new ice age, that would very quickly finish us off.
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So your saying the global scientific consensus has been bought to the point there are essential no credible dissenting scientific voices? Who managed to achieve this incredible no miraculous feat?

You really believe that we know nothing about how the global climate works and that lowering our carbon emissions is likely to cause a rapid ice age? Clue the world wasn’t in an ice age pre Industrial Revolution when man was effectively giving off tiny wiffs of carbon.

There really is no helping some people in the ‘bored of experts’ camp!
 
Troezar said:
I can't say I've seen one "climate denier", you know the reason that phrase was used initially? To link it in with "holocaust denier", a linguistic tool to close down the debate. I only see disagreements on why and what do do or not do, the climate has always changed and we adapted. We seem to be in an era of doom and gloom mongers, bring back some optimism is what I say ;) If you really want to reduce your CO2 emissions exponentially don't have any children, I'm doing my bit :cry: Oh and stop building on flood plains and go back to clearing fire breaks ;) Climate change is now a catch all for "we're useless/negligent at our jobs so we'll blame the climate". If you want to find negatives it can be found but there are plenty of positives too.
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It's an old tactic that people are getting wise too
 
a1ex2001 said:
So your saying the global scientific consensus has been bought to the point there are essential no credible dissenting scientific voices? Who managed to achieve this incredible no miraculous feat?

You really believe that we know nothing about how the global climate works and that lowering our carbon emissions is likely to cause a rapid ice age? Clue the world wasn’t in an ice age pre Industrial Revolution when man was effectively giving off tiny wiffs of carbon.

There really is no helping some people in the ‘bored of experts’ camp!
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I suspect someone watched the TV series or film Snowpiercer :D
 
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