***Gym Exercise Guide, and Form Discussion/Feedback***

[BennyC]

Nothing wrong with deadlifting regularly provided the load is adjusted to suit.

Have a play around with some drills with 40KG/60KG on the bar and just practice RDL's and getting the thrust/hinge right.

Just standing and bending forward from the hips, keeping your back straight and knees locked slightly bent, will automatically push your hips back. Then push through your heels in to the floor which will bring your torso upright and open up your hips to allow you to push them through.

If you watch my 170KG grip fail it's basically just the first pull. Hips & shoulders rise at the same speed and clear the bar from the floor. From there it's hips and glutes/hammies to complete the lift.

Leg press to tickle your quads while you perfect your DL form shouldn't be a problem either.

 

[RoboCod]

Watched some lads yesterday deadlifting. Only small guys, lifting 140-160kg. Banana backs and dropping the weight from above knees so it made lots of noise. Funny.

 

[Jasebta]

What's the general consensus on ab work? I don't include any in my routine at the moment and never really have apart from the odd sit-ups I used to do in group training months ago as I've always assumed deadlifts and squats were plenty for dem abz.
Did a few weighted crunches last week at the gym and got 3 days worth of horrendous DOMS, so maybe worth me doing a little light work?

 

[Delvis]

What's the general consensus on ab work? I don't include any in my routine at the moment and never really have apart from the odd sit-ups I used to do in group training months ago as I've always assumed deadlifts and squats were plenty for dem abz.
Did a few weighted crunches last week at the gym and got 3 days worth of horrendous DOMS, so maybe worth me doing a little light work?

No.

Do things like planks, pallof presses, dragon flags, roll-out, leg raises etc instead to name just a few.

 

[Jasebta]

Yeah I sometimes plank, side plank and do lying leg raises after light erg sessions but only rarely. Do notice the gym I'm at at the moment has a roll-out wheel so might give that a go as well as the others you mentioned, maybe add it in on a weekend before the usual cardio.

 

[BennyC]

Yeah I sometimes plank

You think you do

 

[Delvis]

No doubt someone's going to tell me my back is rounding

Found an old pic of my back rounding: http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd435/ctdelves/Gym/Squats-Terribleback_zps719883f9.jpg

Tasty

 

[Zefan]

Watched some lads yesterday deadlifting. Only small guys, lifting 140-160kg. Banana backs and dropping the weight from above knees so it made lots of noise. Funny.

Insert "Didn't know you trained with *gymrats member*?" comment here.

 

[Barks]

Found an old pic of my back rounding: http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd435/ctdelves/Gym/Squats-Terribleback_zps719883f9.jpg

Tasty

See it's pretty darn obvious there but sometimes I just can't see it. I'm sure I read somewhere that sometimes the erectors fill part of the hollow of the lower back giving the illusion of rounding/flat spine. Also surely correcting it can't be a simple case of bracing your abs and tensing your upper back, when I do that my back almost mirrors itself from the shape in your photo.

I've read into the hip hinge quite a bit now and I think I get it. Going to hit the gym tomorrow morning. I haven't decided whether to do squats or more DLs yet I'll see how I feel but I'm pretty sure I'm making decent progress. The stretches seem to be helping enormously.

 

[Delvis]

Did you read the Tony gentilcore article?

Put your arms out in front of you and do a squat, what does your lumbar (lower back) do?
Now do the same but hold a 5/10kg plate out in front of you, what does your lumbar do now?

Record both and watch them back, also, read the article again

Edit: yes its boring, yes its tiresome, if you get it right now though you will hopefully continue doing all this for a lot longer

 

[Barks]

I have read it and I'm going to read it again now. Hitting the gym for a Squats session shortly.

I've been practicing the hip movement. From what I understand the way to do it is, despite what some instruction says, break at the knees first and THEN the hip during the bottom of the descent. When I act this out in front of a mirror it seems to look right and my lower back stays hollow. If I try and break at the hips right at the start the whole thing just goes pear shape.

Edit: yes its boring, yes its tiresome, if you get it right now though you will hopefully continue doing all this for a lot longer

I have all the time in the world for the next 3 weeks and then I start a new job soon where I'll have stupid working hours. I'm determined to nail this whilst I have the time so I'm more than happy to trawl through loads of boring stuff if it gets the job done.

 

[Barks]

I'm fairly pleased with this today. I think I'm making some improvement!

To me it doesn't look like my lower back is rounding but I would welcome any comments to suggest otherwise. Ignore the first rep something didn't feel right in my lower back so stopped. My back's quite sore from Thursday's deadlifts so generally tried to take it easy today.

I've integrated Pallof Presses and some other core work into my stretches/secondary exercise routine.

 

[Somnambulist]

You switched to low bar.

/disgruntedhighbarsquatter

 

[Deception]

Feet are too turned out and it could be the T-shirt, but it looks like you've got some anterior pelvic tilt which will add to the butt wink.

 

[BennyC]

Looks like a bit too much hyper-extension.

From a seated position if you roll/push your hips forward and chest up/shoulders back this will give you a neutral spine. Standing up from here should give you a feel of how having a straight back will feel.

 

[Barks]

I didn't realise how awful my foot positioning was in that until you mentioned!

Benny, I think the hyper-extension is probably a result of me consciously trying too hard to prevent my lower back from rounding. From what you can see have I got the rounding cracked?

 

[BennyC]

Well it's definitely not bowing out/rounding as it was. You'll probably notice that you have some 'tucking' going on at the bottom of the rep which can be due to a number of things, tight hips, tight glutes, tight hamstrings, weak anterior/posterior core.

I personally found learning to squat from the bottom upwards, as in starting from the bottom position of the squat, the easiest. I was boosting off an olympic bench and walking out backwards and starting in this bottom position (correctly set up) made me accustomed to driving out the hole on the correct position I needed to be in. and using the right muscles to do so.

It's a different approach and probably not necessary here.

 

[mrthingyx]

I didn't realise how awful my foot positioning was in that until you mentioned!

Benny, I think the hyper-extension is probably a result of me consciously trying too hard to prevent my lower back from rounding. From what you can see have I got the rounding cracked?

Yes, to BennyC by the look of it, and no to you, Scott.

The problem caused by the hyper extension this case is that it eats to your lumbar wiggling around. Note how you stick your bum out before you go anywhere? And then how you hips dip own and round at the bottom? And when you stand back up, your torso stays still but your hips and lumbar keep moving?

You are trying o counter the butt wink without really understanding what is causing it.

So...

As Delvis suggested, take a vid of a body-weight squat with your arms out in front. Then do the same with a 10kg plate held out in front. Then another of Tony Gentilcore's kneeling reverse thrust thing (whatever)...

Bottom line: you are not locking off your lumbar properly.

 

[icecold]

I didn't realise how awful my foot positioning was in that until you mentioned!

Benny, I think the hyper-extension is probably a result of me consciously trying too hard to prevent my lower back from rounding. From what you can see have I got the rounding cracked?

Over extension --> neutral is basically as bad as neutral --> flexion

You're still getting horrible forces on your discs, and you have the added problem that you're resting on end range extension and creating stability with lovely vertebral bone on bone contact, which also turns off your core.

Positional problems aside (your most recent video is much better in this regard), you need to learn how to brace your core with a neutral spine. Have a skim of the core training material in the OP.

Also, whether you break at the knee or hip should not dictate what happens to your spine.

As Delvis suggested, take a vid of a body-weight squat with your arms out in front. Then do the same with a 10kg plate held out in front. Then another of Tony Gentilcore's kneeling reverse thrust thing (whatever)...

Guys, can we please stop referencing that TG article. Cressey is a genious, but Tony will always be the sidekick and thus is stuff is only sometimes good.

That particular squat test is an example of the not-so-good.

 

[Delvis]

Yet it shows he has spinal stability when load is applied? Can you elaborate further?