Poll: How do you game? Upscaling or native? (updated poll choices - 24/12, revote!)

[Nexus18]

As per poll:

- native
- fsr
- dlss
- xess

This is only for upscaling, not frame gen.

And in your post, post your config so for me:

gpu - 3080
res - 3440x1440 and 4k
reason you use your chosen upscaling tech or native - dlss provides better IQ and temporal stability than native in most cases whilst providing a substantial performance boost, it also exhibits less ghosting than native TAA implementations. Also, in combination with DLDSR, it can provide much better IQ than even my 4k display for clarity yet still perform similarly or better than just using dlss or native

As per usual, keep the fanboy crap out and in another thread.

EDIT:

This is purely for how and what you use in your day to day gaming (as in most of the time), not "preference". If you prefer native but use dlss, fsr, xess, you vote for whatever one it is that you use and don't vote for native. In your post, you can explain your preference to use native or upscaling for whatever reason.

 

[Nexus18]

Just a reminder, this is purely for how and what you use in your day to day gaming (as in most of the time), not "preference". If you prefer native but use dlss, fsr, xess, you vote for whatever one it is that you "use" and don't vote for native, if you mostly game at native, then you vote for native, if you mostly game with fsr over dlss, then you vote for fsr and so on. In your post, you can explain your preference to use native or upscaling for whatever reason.

 

[Nexus18]

Problem is that's always going to vary by game. If a game has DLAA I'll use it in preference to DLSS Quality - but most/many don't.

Of course and this poll isn't going to be exactly fit or rather accurate for all scenarios e.g. someone could just be playing 7 days to die all the time thus native will be their only use case and like wise, someone could be playing cp 2077 with path tracing all the time so the only use case for them is dlss. Not sure how else to do the poll, perhaps some other options? Having a "preference" based poll is pointless as everyone would love to do 8k res gaming at 100+ fps but alas that isn't possible and I think we can all agree that upscaling is probably here to stay now.

This is just to get a gist for what people use for their day to day gaming so if for example, you use native 60% of the time for your gaming needs, that should be your vote, if it is dlss for 60% of the time, then dlss is your vote.

 

[Nexus18]

But what do the responses actually tell you?

If I just state (factually) that I mostly use DLSS Quality that's neither my preference nor an endorsement of DLSS/upscaling - it's the least worst option because it's the only decent AA solution available to me in most games.

Basically the point of the thread is to see if people are using native over upscaling tech since a few state that they would always use native over upscaling so I'm curious to see if this translates to the larger community and in actual day to day gaming/usage. Not much else to it really. This is why I said try to stick to this format:

gpu - 3080
res - 3440x1440 and 4k
reason you use your chosen upscaling tech or native - dlss provides better IQ and temporal stability than native in most cases whilst providing a substantial performance boost, it also exhibits less ghosting than native TAA implementations. Also, in combination with DLDSR, it can provide much better IQ than even my 4k display for clarity yet still perform similarly or better than just using dlss or native

Having a poll based on "preference" is pointless and is heavily skewed by certain communities.

I must admit though, I am curious to see what the 4090/7900xtx users mostly use for their gaming needs especially those gaming at 4k since a common thing I see "stated" is they buy these gpus to avoid using upscaling tech.

 

[Nexus18]

I get the intent - just stating that if 50 people tell you that (like me) they mostly use DLSS Quality @ 4k - what does that even mean?

Do people really *love* DLSS? Or are they just using it because that's the best compromise the game they're playing offers?

My decision to use DLSS (or not) is based on:

What AA solution a game offers (if any)
What kind of performance a game demands @ 4k
Whether DLSS is even supported (not a given)

And that varies with every single game I play.

Looking at my Steam list of games I have installed:

Forza Horizon 5: 4k native with MSAA
The Finals: 4k native with DLAA
Starfield: DLSS Quality @ 4k
Cyberpunk: DLSS Balanced @ 4k
Resident Evil 4: native 4k but it's horrible because RE4's TAAU is terrible and there's no DLSS without modding it.

Hence the:

reason you use your chosen upscaling tech or native

For further explanation on what your preference/reasoning is for using upscaling and native.



It's also to see if the supposed "no one uses upscaling and only games at native" claims are true too, when browsing the forum here and others, you would think that no one uses upscaling and all game at native.

Personally, it's an easy decision for me as based on my own testing as well as evidenced by other sites, dlss usually always offers the better experience "overall" with the games I play and at the res I game at so even if I don't need the extra performance, I'll still use DLSS or better yet, DLSS and DLDSR which provides noticeably better IQ than native, DLAA, DLSS UQ/Q alone.





Regarding the poll, can we not enable the option to see who is voting for what @Stanners ?

 

[Nexus18]

Supersampling (which is what DLDSR is doing) is always going to look better, but since I typically run my 4090 at 60% power, it's just a waste of resources for me.

'Better' is also highly subjective - MSAA in Forza Horizon 5 doesn't completely eliminate jaggies in the image but it is noticeably more 'native' looking than DLSS in FH5 (which is visibly softer).

Overall though, I think the quality of DLSS is excellent and I do miss it when it's not available.

Has a 4090 and runs it at 60% power.... what?

Thing with DLSS as well is sometimes the stock/default option is worse and not as good as native but this is why I like DLSS as you can switch out the files for the newer/better ones as well as changing the preset to what works and looks best, which can be the difference between it looking worse than native or better than native.

RDR 2 first dlss implementation was pretty poor in terms of the edges i.e. shimmering but switching the dlss file to 2.5.1 or above fixed this issue which resulted in it looking better than native in my experience.

It obviously all comes down to what people value for IQ too i.e.

- less shimmering, aliasing, jaggies and better temporal stability and to be the best here, this can sometimes result in a softer looking image and sometimes, ghosting
- 100% clarity and sharpness with zero ghosting and to be the best here, this can result in jaggies, shimmering and aliasing

I'm very sensitive to shimmering, jaggies and overall temporal stability, seeing shimmering etc. ruins the immersion for me so this is why SMAA, MSAA and so on is a complete no go and most games TAA is bad especially at resolutions less than 4k thus dlss is the best out of all options for my needs.

 

[Nexus18]

I think anyone in there right mind would like Native with good AA and high fps. Sometimes fps ain't high enough so upscaling it is or drop settings. Sometimes the AA solution is not up to scratch and upscaling does it better. If you had all three where they needed to be then i doubt anyone is turning on Dlss.

It's all situational to the game your playing but Native is what most people would prefer imo.

Exactly which is why I said this is aimed at what you are mostly using for your day to day gaming, not what your preference is. It would be the equivalent to creating a thread asking what your preferred fps is, obviously everyone is going to want as high of a fps as possible (well except console gamers who prefer 30 fps........ ) but reality is, most are probably gaming at 60-80 fps range or even less, especially if not using upscaling at high res.

 

[Nexus18]

Your doing it wrong that's why

Try DLDSR with DLSS and you will see it is better

He won't be able to as he has an amd gpu




As for thread results, I'm not overly surprised tbf given how this thread went i.e. power efficiency was the most important factor during rdna 2/ampere time yet here we are with ada and rdna 3..... So much like that other thread I would say a large part of it is with people having a preference for amd/amd gpu owners voting native and also because as evidenced, FSR is never as good as native let alone better, much like myself, I would never use FSR and instead reduce settings thus native would also be getting my vote here.

Also, having read through all the posts, I've noticed it's mostly amd gpu users posting native so I probably should have done a better poll in terms of something like:

Native (AMD gpu owner)
Native (Nvidia GPU owner)
Native (Intel GPU owner)

DLSS

FSR (AMD gpu owner)
FSR (Nvidia GPU owner)
FSR (Intel GPU owner)

So I'll change the poll which would give a better insight, it won't change the results in terms of native leading for what people "use the most" (remember not preference) but at least we can see where the majority is coming from.

 

[Nexus18]

@Stanners, is it possible to delete the poll and do the options above as well as enabling so we can see who votes what.

EDIT:

Probably don't bother with XESS since no one voted for it.

 

[Nexus18]

Yes keep doing the poll until you get the results you want.
Maybe run with

What upscaling do you use?
I prefer DLSS
I love DLSS
DLSS in most games
Always DLSS

Then you can check the results later on while putting the cookies out for Santa.

How's it getting results I want? It's not going to influence the overall result of native leading the way % wise..... It's to get a better insight to which gpu band are using what, nothing more as for obvious reasons, fsr is never better than native thus it makes sense that amd users most likely aren't going to vote for FSR (and they can't use DLSS and XESS isn't in enough games) i.e. we look at hubs (outdated now and somewhat flawed results)

It ain't rocket science to read through the thread and see it's mostly amd gpu users voting/posting native.....

It's rubbish posts like yours which drag these threads down and add nothing useful to the topic.

EDIT:

And obviously we have nvidia gpu owners preferring/posting native too, hence why it would be good to see what % of nvidia owners prefer native.

 

[Nexus18]

Power efficiency give me a break. My last two cards are Vega 64 and a 7900xt so clearly my main priority was bang for buck. As is usually the case with people who buy AMD. AMD have been ahead on power efficiency for only one generation in a lot of years so clearly AMD buyers were not looking for power efficiency that was Nvidia users for years. The poll has spoken and you got your answer which is most prefer native but will use upscaling if forced to.

My post wasn't referring to you and your reasons/needs but a general observation on how preferences and so on changes depending on who is winning in certain things.... Which is why I referenced that thread as it was the be all since RDNA 2 was better (at least in terms of raster PE anyway) but alas it obviously wasn't a factor in the end. You've been around this forum long enough to know how things work, perfect example being fake frames, was trashed upon for reasons like input lag, UI issues then amd came along with a considerably inferior version where hdr and vrr wasn't working in 2 games which no one cared about and fake frames suddenly became the best thing ever.

Also, you have potentially confirmed what I thought may have happened and people haven't read the op, this isn't about preference but how you game on a daily basis.....

 

[Nexus18]

Well i get 200-240 in cod so why would i introduce extra input lag with fsr/dlss. Native is king mate.

Fsr and dlss upscaling doesn't add input lag, it reduces it because frame rate is even higher. Frame gen adds lag since it is creating extra frame and inserting it between 2 traditional rendered frames.

Edit:

Looks like dlss is king now

But in all seriousness, poll is going way I expected. Native overall still the same but between native with Nvidia owners and dlss, more divided. Fsr though, well....

 

[Nexus18]

So basically first poll results didn't suit your agenda so delete and tweak to better suit your narrative?

Basically

Have you had a few drinks too then? It ain't rocket science this chaps

The poll choice and outcome is the EXACT same as the poll options before..... the only difference is this time, it's more granular so those who use native more often can and still do vote native except this time they identify themselves as either owning amd or nvidia and what this proves is exactly what I said earlier that amd users are more likely to vote native since amds upscaler is rarely better than native (as evidenced time and time again by several sources)

Is the poll perhaps not showing the results that side with what you want to see now? Even though native is at 58% compared to 38.7% dlss? (which btw native will still likely go up since most people probably haven't revoted and iirc, there were 4 votes for FSR previously so those people still have yet to vote too)

 

[Nexus18]

That posts had more edits than titanic ffs and its only been up 4 minutes.

Still got more to add too

 

[Nexus18]

snip

So 240 fps Native to 240 dlss/fsr has no input delay difference. I don't need any more than what i get. Native is where it's at in competitive. I don't know of any pro gamer that would use upscaling or am i wrong.. Most comepetitive gamers still use 1080p i think.

Personally i find it sad that the guys loving on upscaling are that happy to accept we get way less for our money these days as the jump in performance is crap on a yearly basis. Dlss/fsr is like here's your software instead of hardware. It might be a means for an end but you are paying a lot more for less accepting this crap.

Inflation i here lol nah. We used to get 70-100% jumps each year for similar money. Now we get 50% every two years and a bit of software to boost that number and if you want the best it's two times the price. Some of you guys live on the moon if you think this is good.

I get the fact it's getting harder and slower for gains, i just don't get why we get shafted so much money wise while it would seem other technology ain't going up so much. Dlss is the problem as it inflates numbers to the noobs.

I don't really game competitively but when I played BF 2042 (and still do every now and then), I use a mix of settings so the game doesn't look complete crap and to ensure 100+ fps, however, with dlss, it pushes me closer to 175 fps/hz which in return, reduces lag, increases motion fluidity and smoothness so it's a no brainer for me there, if you're serious about the PVP then yes, you'll be whacking everything to low and gaming at 1080 or even less.

Tna summed it up perfectly in all seriousness. It's here to stay and more and more things like frame gen, upscaling will only come along, Bryan Catanzaro said it best in his interview with DF "raster and native is also a bag of fakeness and if anything PT, frame gen and upscaling is producing a more real experience".

Also, making and owning and improving this software approach is not cheap at all! It's probably the bulk of where the money goes to the staff. The people working on this kind of stuff are extremely expensive especially if big teams are involved.

I've explained my reasons many times why I prefer dlss along with evidence, it simply provides me a better image and experience "overall" than trying to run native especially if/when games have poor AA methods. As I said earlier, had I owned AMD, I would probably sacrifce settings to avoid FSR or if the game had XESS, use it instead but alas, XESS isn't widely adopted.

Ideally this poll should break Nvidia users down by generation. Show that the native users are those screwed by Nvidia who lock their features behind bios locks and screwed by Nvidia.

It would just be more granular data, right?

Edit to add: native, Nvidia, 1440*3440

IIRC, according to steam, aren't most of the nvidia owners and all gamers for that matter using RTX capable gpus? Like 20-30% still using non-rtx gpus?

Also, looking at the native nvidia gpu owners, I think at least 3 own ampere/ada gpus.

BTW, it's been shown that dlss does use tensor cores:

Nvidia's DLSS upscaling really does need those AI-accelerating Tensor cores after all

Investigation into Nvidia GPU workloads reveals that Tensor cores are being hammered, just incredibly briefly.

www.pcgamer.com

 

[Nexus18]

Yeah, the change is a bit silly, and from memory hasn't actually changed the results (approx 1/3 upscale to 2/3 native). I am native where possible, but will turn on dlss to up frame rates where they're not satisfactory. I voted dlss, but it applies to maybe... 1/3 of what I play? So probably about right. I like old and new games, so it's purely performance driven, I don't turn on dlss for the sake of it.

It was never intended to change the outcome and how could it as the options are the same?

It just highlights what we all knew, amd users will use native first and foremost over fsr since fsr is not good. Nvidia is more divided, some of the votes could be non rtx GPU owners? Maybe above post is right, should break it down to rtx Nvidia owners or non rtx owners

 

[Nexus18]

They aren't. There are more.

Or were the originals just upscaled?

The core concept/options are the same, only difference is you identify what you own with your vote for native.

The poll before was just, native, dlss, xess and fsr. Removed xess as no one voted for it in the last poll.

 

[Nexus18]

If no different, why change? What does ownership matter?

One of those things with stats, spin them how you like. Only half of nvidia users use upscaling, no amd users use it. So 75% of users aren't upscaling.

The changes on the surface seem to be to dilute the native vote and improve the look of the dlss bar.

Because it's interesting to see where the votes are coming from?

How's it's diluting the stats? The outcome is still the same or are you suggesting that people can't do basic maths and/or don't like seeing dlss with a bigger bar than last time?

It would be interesting to see if the native Nvidia owners are mostly made up of non rtx owners though but CBA redoing the poll, I know at least 3 of the votes are rtx owners though.

At the end of the day, it doesn't bother me what people use, I use dlss as it simply is better than native as evidenced by several sources and my very own testing (which no one has been able to debunk with anything to show otherwise other than cherry picked scenes or/and using old/worse versions of dlss) as shown in my videos when it comes to temporal stability and adding more detail (especially combined with dldsr). If people want to use native for whatever reason, that's their choice, I just find it hilarious when people keep saying native is better yet there is nothing to back this up unless the above in brackets is done.

Of course if I was playing older games more often, I wouldn't have any choice but to use native (well I would use dldsr since old games will be easy to run) but alas I don't.

 

[Nexus18]

Ah, let's not fight on Christmas! I'm happy using DLSS, just don't see that it is an improvement over native IQ in actual gameplay in my experience, but it's not much if any downgrade either at quality level. But DLSS quality is not the point of this thread, it's only a poll with moving goalposts... Sorry, answers

In what way don't you see it being better than native from your experience? General curiosity.

I suppose I'm more picky than most when it comes to temporal stability especially gaming on a non matte finished qd-oled 175hz display where shimmering and so on is much more noticeable.

The most surprising thing to me is that no one uses FSR according to the poll

AMD may as well shut it down

Yeah this just confirms what I've been saying for ages, it's all very well making things free and oss for the masses but it's a bit pointless when no one wants to use it. I think fsr will improve at some point but as shown, dlss at lesser Res and lower presets is miles ahead now so they really need to focus on it and not expect the Devs to do the work for them as they aren't going to spend the time on it without amds time

 

[Nexus18]

No IQ improvement in gameplay, when playing a game. I'm also noticing much in the way of deterioration, just not an improvement.

Do you not see an improvement in motion fluidity/smoothness with the higher FPS when using dlss? (Can't recall if you have a high refresh rate display or not)