I don't understand the point of 4k

Oh lawd, you're really taking watching movies far too seriously.

You haven't been slandered either, don't be so dramatic.

For some, a HTPC is much more convenient. I am one of those people. I really would rather not deal with physical media if I don't have to. I don't have any disc drives installed in any of the 5 desktops and 3 laptops that are used regularly.

All of the issues you've mentioned are easily addressed with software functionality. My HTPC is always on, with Kodi (XBMC's new name) open.

I can get a TV show or movie paying in far less time than it would take to put the PS4 or Xbox One on, take the bluray off the shelf, stick it in the drive then run it.
 
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Well you have to remember, it's all digital noughts and ones. Yet, all over the world there are Bluray players from under £100 to over £1000 with specific models getting more merit than others over picture quality.


A PC is not usually optimised for simply watching bluray, regardless of digital, usually requiring you to go into your graphics menu and switch various features off such as colour correction, edge enhancement, etc. Some users have to tweak settings to sort out the judder created by a 60hz signal coping with the 3.2 pulldown for a 24hz frame rate too, though I even notice this on some budget players. There is also colour spacing, PC's do not always have the output set correct, with PC output being full RGB 0-255 but most TV's and Bluray players being 16-235.

http://lifehacker.com/how-to-get-better-picture-quality-from-your-home-theate-1700412363
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/948496-avs-hd-709-blu-ray-mp4-calibration.html

Various ways to cut the process, but it's not simply like buying a Bluray player, plugging the HDMI cable and slapping a disc in the machine and pressing play.

There are plenty of issues involved with HTPC. But thats not what I am complaining about here, it's the issue with others slandering people who actually buy physical media because it offers a better experience than online streaming or pirated downloads to that end user!

I have three kids, when a movie comes out, how many times does a kid want to watch such a movie? When I was in my twenties did I watch a movie once or on various occasions, £4.99 to rent an HD release on Virgin media for one viewing, for a movie available on Bluray that can be available from £5 to £17 depending on title that can sit in a walk in cupboard and be viewed again in a month, year, 10 years?
When I built my home network, there were three PC's and a Mac here, I wanted the ability to stream movies from the network collection to any room in the house, I copied movies from my bought Bluray and DVD's, I bought digital downloads, I slowly built the collection within my storage, used MyMovies over WMC on networked Windows 7 PC's in various locations in home with a projector upstairs, the kids room TV, and a 50" plasma with the dedicated HTPC. The kids grew distant from it, prefering to use streaming and with their favorite movies asking for Bluray discs, even for movies where I had DVD, Bluray and on the home network, they simply would put the Blueray on instead of the HTPC. Virgin and Netflix are used most in this home, with the family prefering to buy favorite movies on Bluray.

It can take ages to browse Netflix, Sky movies, Virgin movies to find something to watch something new, sometimes it is easier to look through square meters of films on a shelf and pick something, but off the shelf is usually not the norm.

Now, where can I stream a good quality copy of these examples of the top of my head, how much is a Bluray copy of 1978 Dawn Of The Dead on Blu Ray and Dogs Of War?
The Dogs Of War?
The Hunchback Hairball of LA?
Taking care Of JoJo?
The original unadulterated Star Wars Trilogy?
The Wild Life?
The last Movie?
The Keep?
Phantasm?
Bubba Ho-Tep?
The Hitcher?
Critters quadrilogy?

There were plenty of movies released on VHS that never reached DVD, there will be many DVD that never reach Bluray, and there will be many Bluray too that wont be re issued or remastered. Not everything is available to stream or download, and not even every retail edition of a movie is the best, with the likes of even the Die hard movies having an appaling history of appaling video quality releases on all formats.

Not everthing will ever be remastered in HD or higher formats, and I sure as hell would have loved to have kept all my VHS and the players for nostalgia reasons, especially the B movie rarities and such.

So what is a true movie buff, someone who streams or downloads only what is available online, usually limited? Or someone who through a love of movies builds a collection of various formats that can be cherished and revisited anytime, with movies quality improved upon if a better quality copy is released on an alternative format?

I use Virgin Media.
I use Sky.
My wife, children, and I have used Netflix for years on various devices.
I use various formats including VHS, LD, DVD, Bluray, HTPC, streaming, downloading, with itunes too, and even freeview and Roku, Flixter/ultraviolet etc. I am not upturning my nose to any of it or saying it has no place.



And you do not?

Did no one state that in this thread?

What is neglidgable to do with the same?

What is hassle free about the majority of manners in which a PC is used to watch content readily available to stream on a smart TV anyway?

How is switching on an HTPC, clicking on software, and selecting a movie from a menu any less hassle than pulling a disc of a shelf, inserting, and pressing play? Or even selecting a movie from the Nas on a Bluray player and streaming that way? WHat about building, set up, configuration, and the time searching and downloading, is it really any different to using a player, or buying a physical movie online.

Upturned noses? In comparison to slandering someone who loves the physical media and stating your just as big a fan with digital downloads? Then stating an opinion on matter not even in stated within the original quote?

So for us here not in the know, where are you actually downloading these full uncompressed movie files from? How much are they costing per title? And did you calibrate your PC in any manner, what are the PC specifications of your current PC, case and all.

I would love to reply meaningfully, but I just can't be bothered to wade through your awfully written, long-winded posts. When you decide to condense them into sensible lengths without waffling, please let me know. :)
 
A Blu-Ray player is not "convenient" in any real sense of the word, it requires more time and effort to buy and insert than a download.

True but that truly is some laziness! Imagine the effort to get off ones arse for a disc. Oh think of the pain kneeling down, twice within two hours.
 
WHAT ?!

that is just rubbish.

If you are finding that you are doing something wrong.

It is of course hardware dependant but again it is digital ! it is exactly the same thing.

No... you're just blind and deaf :p

I mentioned the difference isn't huge anymore... but it is noticeable.

Much improved since you could properly output 23.976 fps... something that blu-ray players have been able to for a long time. I'm not the only one who has, check out the av forums.

Just because the source data is the same... doesn't mean the playback is the same.

You can also notice a difference between a budget player and a good quality player - or has that managed to escape you too?

I use an I3 4350 in my media system and it's plays everything perfectly without issue exactly the same as my Blu-Ray player ? I cannot tell any difference at all either visually or Audio.

Good for you, sometimes I wish my eyes and ears weren't quite so OCD...

It's either a 4330 or 4360 in mine.

Last HTPC was a 3570 and before that, an E8400.

I've gone through various different apps in windows, some to try and improve screen tearing, others for other things and various combinations of the recommended codec packs and players like vlc, mpc-hc, kodi and more.

The best playback quality I've found is OpenELEC, but I find it a little unstable in usage - so I've reverted to Kodibuntu, which is a close 2nd but more stable.

I've seen other systems where people claim the playback of their system matches that of a blu-ray player... and I couldn't tell if they had just convinced themselves of it, or they really couldn't see the difference... because the playback quality was NOT as good...
 
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I get the point and can see, based on store demos (never the best metric) the improvement, but frankly there is not enough content or ability to stream (for me) which is why it's a pointless rush to adopt. I will get there, but I will get there when I need to not because it's the next big thing as frankly right now it's a waste as I have one of the better HD TV's already.
 
I've seen other systems where people claim the playback of their system matches that of a blu-ray player... and I couldn't tell if they had just convinced themselves of it, or they really couldn't see the difference... because the playback quality was NOT as good...

I use Kodi with CCCP installed. It plays everything perfectly with no screen tearing or any of the problems you have mentioned. I use a 4350 i3 and the onboard GPU connected via HDMi.

I am 1:1 ripping the Discs though so I'm not playing downloaded compressed films mine are identical to the Disc apart from no menus or adverts.

I'm quiet OCD about quality and would have spotted any of the problems you mentioned pretty easily.

My Player is a Denon DBT-1713UD and I see no difference at all from playing on here or Uncompressed rips on the media PC.
 
I'm referring to remuxes, which are clean rips like you say in an mkv container... The problems have been there since inception and I'm not the only one to notice... Even playing disk directly ;)

I'm sure things will eventually catch up and it's good enough for me to not be annoyed in most films... But in high action/cg/fast moving scenes is where it is most noticeable in the video. Things get much more muddled much more quickly and screen tearing happens often with windows, but not Linux.

Audio depends on the source
 
Nope not had any tearing or anything untoward in fast moving scenes. I'm very picky and I cannot see any difference on anything and have 300+ Blu-Rays.
 
I'm referring to remuxes, which are clean rips like you say in an mkv container... The problems have been there since inception and I'm not the only one to notice... Even playing disk directly ;)

I'm sure things will eventually catch up and it's good enough for me to not be annoyed in most films... But in high action/cg/fast moving scenes is where it is most noticeable in the video. Things get much more muddled much more quickly and screen tearing happens often with windows, but not Linux.

Audio depends on the source

They broke something in Windows awhile back and it seems to have carried over into 8 and 10 and seems most people can't notice it :S there is quite a difference in high speed scenes, objects panning left<>right etc. between a system with an un-updated install of Windows 7 and one with all the latest updates or 8-10.

When I replaced my Windows 7 media system a few months back (which hadn't been updated since a couple of months since Windows 7 release) I was scratching my head for awhile at the sudden micro-judder in high motion scenes (its like a mixture of uneven frametimes and every 4th and 5th frame being switched around) - going through 100s of codec packs, checking dpc latency, different refresh rates, different media players, different monitors, etc. until I remembered I had an old laptop with almost a clone of the original Windows 7 media system and bam it was back to how it should be and now I notice it on all my newer devices.
 
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I'm running Win 10 on mine. I will have a look later but just watching mad max and I'm not seeing anything like what you describe ? Maybe it's fixed on mine ?
 
The micro judder you describe sounds like you're watching a 24p movie at the wrong refresh rate.

That and dropped frames was one of the first things I checked. It is exactly like the effect of that though. Its not that noticeable until you see it but then you can't unsee it :(
 
Oh lawd, you're really taking watching movies far too seriously.

You haven't been slandered either, don't be so dramatic.

For some, a HTPC is much more convenient. I am one of those people. I really would rather not deal with physical media if I don't have to. I don't have any disc drives installed in any of the 5 desktops and 3 laptops that are used regularly.

All of the issues you've mentioned are easily addressed with software functionality. My HTPC is always on, with Kodi (XBMC's new name) open.

I can get a TV show or movie paying in far less time than it would take to put the PS4 or Xbox One on, take the bluray off the shelf, stick it in the drive then run it.

It was not me, but the specific manner in which SGTMASON was replied to I was getting at, along with some of the misinformation stated. Nor do I take movies serious any more.

Not being dramatic. And for a long time an HTPC and streaming of my own collection to various systems within my own house was my prefered manner too. Even before Bluray.

Of course many of the issues have been addressed over the years, but I bet many who watch downloaded copies etc have no idea about half the issues.

I would love to reply meaningfully, but I just can't be bothered to wade through your awfully written, long-winded posts. When you decide to condense them into sensible lengths without waffling, please let me know. :)

Thankyou, but I doubt you could reply meaningfully, we just have to look at your previous responses and attitude to see that. (Apart from the Steam comment which I sort of agree with, though if you actually purchased movies instead of freeloading and dare I say stealing, you would have found that itunes and Ultraviolet work in a similar manner, usefull for phones and tablets etc while on holiday)
 
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My DVDs still look great on my 24" Samsung which is my main viewing screen.
The problem is that this is a geek forum and you are forgetting that normal people are like me, they have DVDs and play them through normal size TVs.
If I take our office there must be easily 50 people in there and AFAIK only one who takes his viewing seriously and he just happens to be an OCUK member.
If I go back to the factory I worked on with around 1000 people I can only think of about 5 people who were into their high quality viewing.
DVDs will still be round for a while and many millions of people will still believe they are great quality, like me on my 24".
 
It was not me, but the specific manner in which SGTMASON was replied to I was getting at, along with some of the misinformation stated. Nor do I take movies serious any more.

Not being dramatic. And for a long time an HTPC and streaming of my own collection to various systems within my own house was my prefered manner too. Even before Bluray.

Of course many of the issues have been addressed over the years, but I bet many who watch downloaded copies etc have no idea about half the issues.

Claiming that comments that you don't like, are slanderous on the virtue of you disliking them is a very strong suggestion that you are being quite dramatic, and taking this overly seriously.
 
That and dropped frames was one of the first things I checked. It is exactly like the effect of that though. Its not that noticeable until you see it but then you can't unsee it :(

Glad I'm not the only one on here who sees it, it's MUCH improved on linux-based playback... so i've stuck with Kodibuntu for a while now... only on the flip side, these releases are a bit terrible for decent music playback.

I definitely do not have any of that I would have noticed it easily.

Maybe it only affects certain setups ?

It's an inherent flaw... don't look too hard for it... if you don't notice it, enjoy it... once you see it, you won't unsee it.

I've spent years seeking a solution and it's not there yet... it's not hardware based, well... unless it is localised to Intel as I tend to avoid AMD.
 
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wow some people.

your only a true movie buff if you buy blu rays.

8k isn't true 8k and will never be available in the home. like LED tv's are real LED tv's right?

downloads aren't the same as blu rays.

people trying so hard to justify their purchases.



back on topic. 4k currently IMO is pointless. very very limited content. if you can afford a top 4k set then go for it but imo you would be better off going 1080P oled then waiting for 4k to mature.
 
wow some people.

your only a true movie buff if you buy blu rays.

8k isn't true 8k and will never be available in the home. like LED tv's are real LED tv's right?

downloads aren't the same as blu rays.

people trying so hard to justify their purchases.



back on topic. 4k currently IMO is pointless. very very limited content. if you can afford a top 4k set then go for it but imo you would be better off going 1080P oled then waiting for 4k to mature.



People will buy what they want. As long as they are happy with their purchase.
I'm loving my Sony 4K TV so much my 55 inch LG is hanging on my bedroom wall :)

I would have a plasma TV if they made any and I lived in a dark dudgeon :)
 
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