Intel’s surprise Ryzen killer

[RBImGuy]

If those AMD fanboys chose Intel instead, then Intel would have 100% market share. So where would the money for AMD's R&D come from?

How many cores do you think we would have today without that competition? The i9 wouldn't exist, the reasonably priced i7 would still have 4c8t. The i5 would still have 4c4t and the i3 would only have 2c4t. Clock speeds would be much lower because Intel would have no reason to push 14nm.

Before AMD came back, we thought Moore's law was dead. I genuinely thought mankind had reached a limit with silicone and quantum computing was the way forward.

It's easy to mock the AMD fanboy and think they're an idiot, but surely they helped save gaming (and indeed the CPU) from a dark future?

Moore law is dead the way it was stated originally.

Intel is silent as they know this is coming and trying to cover it up is backfiring for them.

https://www.thetechnoburst.com/ryzen-5-5600x-benchmark-using-cpu-z-software/

 

[DeathStorm]

Does Intel even realise they have competition?

Sure but given they still have the majority of the market and they're still very profitable it's easy for them to, well not ignore but consider their current problems a bump in the road they just need to get past, so stick to the plan and business as usual right?

The world does not lack for large companies that have become overly complacent when they control a market but this should work out for us, Intel will eventually catch up but hopefully AMD will take a nice big bite out of them forcing more competition. We'll see.

 

[Destination]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SV3_-VDRXyU

Seems to sum it up, its all complete mud.
8 cores, going very far backwards intel.
Unless you rely on igpu in your desktop, seems to be the singular advantage, and given 14nm, it won't have any decent perf/wattage

 

[Grim5]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SV3_-VDRXyU

Seems to sum it up, its all complete mud.
8 cores, going very far backwards intel.
Unless you rely on igpu in your desktop, seems to be the singular advantage, and given 14nm, it won't have any decent perf/wattage

Yep - the architecture is good in theory but it's totally cucked by that now outdated process node - Intel is trying to put its fancy new v8 engine inside the body of a 1960 mustang and hoping it doesn't tailspin off the road (naively)

 

[r22snapper]

A fancy new V8 engine in a 1960s Mustang body sounds like a dream car to me!

 

[LePhuronn]

Probably time they binned off their pitiful 10nm and 7nm attempts, ate humble pie and utilised someone else's 7nm

Apparently DG2 is using TSMC's 6nm, and there's talk they want to be the "launch partner" and really big the node up.

Intel maybe buttering up TSMC and actually building a relationship for a larger N6 adoption down the line? We all rag on 14nm++++++++++++++++++++++ but CPUs built on it are still beastly, it's maybe not a bad thing if Intel stay a node behind for now. Let AMD and Nvidia jump on TSMC N5, keep the lion's share of N6 for themselves and maybe get some competitive products out.

 

[chrcoluk]

Intel sponsored linus stream starring gamersnexus and jay was a blast, but the intel sponsorship was cringe.

They can afford to give each other money in prizes, then they could have coughed up for the pc parts and made it unsponsored.

 

[chrcoluk]

Intel actually did the correct thing at the time, when your competition fails so badly you don't burn up your resources competing with yourself, you focus on making the most profit with the least effort.

Unfortunately it looks like they didn't realise with competition they need to stop doing that at some point, so the position they now find themselves in is well deserved.

That does make some sense, but I still remember the nvidia rep been interviewed by that youtube channel who used to be big but are not doing so much now days (sorry forgot their name). He was constantly saying although AMD were weak they had to make maxwell a good improvement as they were competing with themselves to get customers to upgrade from older nvidia gpus.

 

[humbug]

Intel sponsored linus stream starring gamersnexus and jay was a blast, but the intel sponsorship was cringe.

They can afford to give each other money in prizes, then they could have coughed up for the pc parts and made it unsponsored.

They will have been paid in more than PC parts, i bet Linus wouldn't do so much as 3 minutes for anything less than 10K.

 

[Vince]

Does Intel even realise they have competition? it seems like they are just executing a pre-determined schedule as if they exist in a vacuum and at best the attempts to get things back on track have just been musical chairs with equally useless managers. Feels to me like they are now throwing good money after bad. Probably time they binned off their pitiful 10nm and 7nm attempts, ate humble pie and utilised someone else's 7nm while shaking things up behind the scenes and getting the right people in to do the development from 14nm to 5nm (granted that does need some lessons along the way from 14nm but at this point there doesn't seem to be much to be gained from their 10nm, etc.).

I agree with all of this. I don't think Intels top dogs are ready to admit that they can't keep up with the big boys at the sharp end just yet. I'm sure they can turn it around but it doesn't feel to me like they have the right person at the helm of the ship right now. I also wonder if any fab (or just tsmc as thats the only one that matters) will be able to produce the volumes that intel need.

 

[Grim5]

They will have been paid in more than PC parts, i bet Linus wouldn't do so much as 3 minutes for anything less than 10K.

Well yeah makes sense - 3 min of video is not 3 min of work, it takes much longer to write up the script, film it and edit it and Linus has like what, 20 or 30 staff now so that's a lot of mouths to feed

 

[4K8KW10]

Mobile 8-core/16-thread Tiger-Lake:

https://twitter.com/TUM_APISAK/status/1327080913096753152

TigerLake-H
Insyde TigerLake intel 0000 U3E1 CPU 8 cores, 16 threads Base clock 3.1 GHz, turbo 2.75 GHz (avg)

And some more newsworthy details:

New information regarding Intel's next-generation Desktop CPUs codenamed Alder Lake, Meteor Lake and Lunar Lake has been revealed by Moore's Law is Dead. MLID was the first to confirm the existence of the Cypress Cove architecture which is now been confirmed to power the Rocket Lake line of 11th Gen Desktop processors.

The IPC estimates for the Alder Lake family are suggested to be 35-50% over Skylake (10th Gen CPU family) and 10-20% over Tiger Lake (Willow Cove Cores).

https://wccftech.com/intel-next-gen-desktop-cpu-rumors-alder-lake-meteor-lake-lunar-lake/

Rocket Lake 11th gen Willow Cove - Q1 2021 - 25-30% higher IPC than Skylake;
Alder Lake 12th gen 10nm Golden Cove - Q4 2021 - another 10-20% IPC over Rocket Lake;
Meteor Lake 13th gen 7nm Redwood Cove - 2022
Lunar Lake 14th gen Next-gen Core - 2023

 

[Cenuij]

Rocket Lake 11th gen Willow Cove - Q1 2021 - 25-30% higher IPC than Skylake;

Maybe, just maybe, that IPC uplift might have happened on 10nm - these are Ice Lake cores which were designed for 10nm - what are they going to cut to run them on 14nm? They will be inefficient and power hungry.

Alder Lake 12th gen 10nm Golden Cove - Q4 2021 - another 10-20% IPC over Rocket Lake;

Yeah that's just not happening, Intel's 10nm is not delivering any yield to speak of after how many years? It's not going to be fixed within the next year, it maybe never will.

 

[4K8KW10]

Maybe, just maybe, that IPC uplift might have happened on 10nm - these are Ice Lake cores which were designed for 10nm - what are they going to cut to run them on 14nm? They will be inefficient and power hungry.

Maybe only lower clocks, the architecture is backported and remains or should remain the same, even if slightly larger because of more transistors - but die size could prove beneficial for the thermal density side of characteristics.

 

[Dave2150]

Maybe, just maybe, that IPC uplift might have happened on 10nm - these are Ice Lake cores which were designed for 10nm - what are they going to cut to run them on 14nm? They will be inefficient and power hungry.



Yeah that's just not happening, Intel's 10nm is not delivering any yield to speak of after how many years? It's not going to be fixed within the next year, it maybe never will.

All that matters is peak performance, irrespective of TDP. Just look at Nvidia's 3080, a 320W monster. No-one mentions it's insane power draw/heat output, as it's got best in class performance (RX6000 hasn't released yet).

Skylake + 15-20% IPC, with 5.3Ghz = insane power draw, with equally insane performance. Probably.

 

[Grim5]

All that matters is peak performance, irrespective of TDP. Just look at Nvidia's 3080, a 320W monster. No-one mentions it's insane power draw/heat output, as it's got best in class performance (RX6000 hasn't released yet).

Skylake + 15-20% IPC, with 5.3Ghz = insane power draw, with equally insane performance. Probably.

Rocket lake is unlikely to reach skylake's clocks

firstly, Intel has not managed to match their old clocks on first iteration process node shifts in the last 15 years to my knowledge. And regardless of history, we have lots of leaks saying Rocket lake won't hit 5ghz and 4.8ghz is more realistic

 

[humbug]

@4K8KW10 Don't hold your hopes up, Intel claims a 20% IPC uplift with every generation, in reality its 3% except 4000 series to 6000 series where it was about 15% and that's only because of DDR3 to DDR4.

You would think after all these years of Intel BS people would stop taking them seriously.

 

[4K8KW10]

Rocket lake is unlikely to reach skylake's clocks

firstly, Intel has not managed to match their old clocks on first iteration process node shifts in the last 15 years to my knowledge. And regardless of history, we have lots of leaks saying Rocket lake won't hit 5ghz and 4.8ghz is more realistic

Rocket Lake is still 14nm, there is no first iteration process node shift.

@4K8KW10 Don't hold your hopes up, Intel claims a 20% IPC uplift with every generation, in reality its 3% except 4000 series to 6000 series where it was about 15% and that's only because of DDR3 to DDR4.

You would think after all these years of Intel BS people would stop taking them seriously.

Except that Rocket Lake is the same architecture as in Core i7-1185G7. The IPC increase aligns exactly as the claimed.
It's not a rebrand in the same way from second generation Sandy Bridge to seventh generation.

 

[humbug]

Rocket Lake is still 14nm, there is no first iteration process node shift.



Except that Rocket Lake is the same architecture as in Core i7-1185G7. The IPC increase aligns exactly as the claimed.
It's not a rebrand in the same way from second generation Sandy Bridge to seventh generation.

Yeah, and at 4.8Ghz it scores 580 points, while yes that is an actual improvement on Coffeelake is still about 10% short of Zen 3 at the same speed.

Oh and a maximum of 8 cores. the 5800X will beat it.

Its not a Ryzen killer.

 

[4K8KW10]

Yeah, and at 4.8Ghz it scores 580 points, while yes that is an actual improvement on Coffeelake is still about 10% short of Zen 3 at the same speed.

Oh and a maximum of 8 cores. the 5800X will beat it.

Its not a Ryzen killer.

5800X is very expensive. If there will be an 8-core Core i9 that would be put for $299, it will kill the Ryzen 7 5800X's sales.