Is it time to ban LED Headlights
- Thread starter Glanza
- Start date
You really think they don't track causes of accidents, drugs, vehicle fault, road surface hazards, dazzled by oncoming traffic for instance. No need to be silly about it.
![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
It's published by the government and was the source of the headline about how many accidents had 'headlight' as a contributory factor. It's all laid out for you so you can see each year, exactly how many collisions had which contributory factors allocated to them. It makes it easy to see if there is any sort of increasing trend, which there doesn't appear to be.
My personal opinion is that this isn't really an issue at all and is similar to the same sort of complaints we get about everything thats new and how everything thats old was better. I've had cars with every single type of headlight you can get and my experience has been that with each new upgrade in technology, driving at night feels safer and more confident. Every car I've owned with halogen headlights has had poor headlights which even at the speed limit on the Motorway were never confidence inspiring. Xenon headlights really improved things, LED headlights on their own didn't really change much and I suspect were just about power consumption, but the other huge area of progress I've found is the adaptive high beam systems which are absolutely excellent and which I won't buy another car without.
I don't have issues with headlights from oncoming cars either - yes, sometimes when you are going over a hill it happens, but we forget that it always has and at the wrong angle its not like a direct beam of light from a halogen headlight is wonderful is it? I don't drive a particularly high up car either.
One thing there probably won't be statistics for is the number of accidents and incidents avoided as a result of better, clearer visibility at night. I bet the number is quite significant.
If I am driving down a dark road at night with nobody else around, my headlights can illuminate the road ahead up to half a mile away. Are you really going to tell me that offers absolutely zero safety advantage over halogen headlights?
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Got a link I couldn't find anything after a quick look this morning.
I think you've missed the point.
They obviously do track accident causes.
Maybe the specific statistic doesn't exist because the problem doesn't exist and there's no data to collect?
It does though.
Hopefully somebody will post it soon then, because I couldn't find anything other than anecdotes and surveys either
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8 People die a year in accidents where being dazzled was an excuse used according to an RAC article I read yesterday.
Caporegime
It's not like government decision making is dependent on facts now, is it? Just the fact that a large, and increasing, number of people are complaining suggests to me that there will be some regulation and, personally, I think whether or not there is a statistically demonstrable danger, annoyance to other drivers and road users is a legitimate grounds for regulation. Depending on what the investigation finds, I'd expect there to be more or less strict requirements, but I wouldn't expect it to determine whether there is regulation.
Soldato
I cant wait to get my new car, back to Matrix LED from LED. The difference at night driving country lanes (my commute) with high beam dropping and not seeing the verge, road and other road furniture is a HUGE difference. Im convinced it also helps the cars im following with their crappy halogens see better.
So you think regulation should be based on the perception of the general public not the reality?
That sounds great! Just imagine the things we could regulate if we did it based on how people feel rather than the actual facts of the situation.
Makes zero difference to me, swap between a car with LED and halogen all the time I don't crash into road furniture more often in one Vs the other. Lol
It's not even on my list of things I want on a car, and I pretty much commute year long in the dark.
You probably didn't crash into anything when you had no antilock brakes, no seatbelt, no airbags and a 1.1 litre engine with a 4 speed gearbox either but that I doubt you'd want to go back to that. Being against progress because 'I didn't crash before I had this useful safety upgrade' doesn't really seem particularly logical.
That said, LED headlights on their own are not necessarily particularly bright, so I'd be careful to avoid judging every car with modern headlight technology as if they are the same. They are not. I have driven various cars with LED headlights which I would consider poor and not materially better than halogen lights. One that stands out to me at the moment is the BMW i4 with the standard LED lights. I was surprised at how poor they were, perhaps my expectation was high as the lights in my 3 Series are so good.
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Caporegime
I think regulation is based on perception more than reality, and I think you haven't been paying much attention to British politics if you think that isn't the case.
I also think that "perception" does, in some cases, matter. Car drivers shouldn't be annoying other drivers with their headlights; whether or not someone is getting dazzled by other cars is inherently a subjective judgement and I think it's a decent grounds for limiting headlight brightness. I'd hope that the investigation looks into what the data on that is too; it's not just a question of whether there are more accidents. People aren't automata.
Lots of things 'annoy' car drivers though - we can't regulate things just because they 'annoy' car drivers and we shouldn't unless there are sensible, logical, rational reasons for doing so.
As a society one thing we do enjoy doing is complaining about everything. Sometimes its justified but more often than not people just like to complain about things without putting any real thought into whether it's rational or reasonable to do so. I'm sure there are lots of examples of things the general public think are a huge issue which in reality just are not.
The media doesn't help - this latest news story is a perfect example. Take the headline and you could easily form a fairly sensible view that new headlights are bad. But it is provided without any context at all, so then you look at the data behind that headline...
As a society one thing we do enjoy doing is complaining about everything. Sometimes its justified but more often than not people just like to complain about things without putting any real thought into whether it's rational or reasonable to do so. I'm sure there are lots of examples of things the general public think are a huge issue which in reality just are not.
The media doesn't help - this latest news story is a perfect example. Take the headline and you could easily form a fairly sensible view that new headlights are bad. But it is provided without any context at all, so then you look at the data behind that headline...
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Who said in against progress?
At the minute it's a choice on some cars. I have them on my Mazda because it wasn't a choice.
You say it's a "safety upgrade" how so? Are you saying now that in fact there are less accidents specifically because of LED lights?
I've had Halogen, Xenon and now LED.
To me they're all exactly the same driving wise, only difference is cost of maintenance, which is the only reason I CHOOSE to have halogen while they still offer them.
Soldato
Can see deers in the side much sooner than when they hit your bonnet.
Feel free to borrow my car overnight, guess the faster the cars the more apparent the benefit though.
EDIT: I am talking multi beam matrix here.
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Are you really asking me how increased visibility isn't a safety upgrade from the drivers perspective? Really?
You can see more of the road ahead, this is nothing but a safety improvement (The separate argument that this then encourages people to drive faster than they otherwise would have is, however, valid, but the same is true of almost all safety upgrades).
I am unable to evidence this but I would be surprised if there wasn't. One of the most common contributory factors in any road accident in the UK is driver/rider failed to see/look properly. Therefore anything which improves the ability of the driver or rider to see things when driving will reduce the risk of accidents.
They're obviously not 'exactly the same' or there would have been absolutely zero point spending millions developing improved technology. The technology would have gone absolutely nowhere at its introduction.
Can you imagine the conversation?
'Would you like the Xenon headlight package for £2000?'
'What does it do?'
'Absolutely nothing, it is completely identical to the standard lights'
Yeah I've hit loads it's a constant annoyance.
Don't need to borrow yours I have one.
If they're all dumb systems, there's not a massive difference between them all as simple dipped beams, though I preferred the LED units in the Skoda as the beam pattern was a much more even distribution.
The adaptive Xenons I have now though are much better at night, because of the adaptive beam splitting etc. I've no doubt newer matrix LED implementations are even better.