ISIL, ISIS, Daesh discussion thread.

[Angilion]

Oh dear and here's me thinking it started when some vile, cave-dwelling nutcase murdered 3000 people in New York. I think you'll find that the west does actually quite like peace and compared to other parts of the world, like say the middle-east, is a lot more peaceful. You're right to point out that we don't like losing wars though - we prefer winning them which is why we usually do in the end.

Besides, even if all that (along with other western ideas like democracy, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, human rights and minor little things like that) is ignored and the west actually was the mercenary sociopath some people claim it is war still wouldn't be the result. Peace is more profitable than war.

The idea that all IS wants is peace and trade is, to be very polite to manoz, not very plausible.

 

[Tunney]

I think you'll find that the west does actually quite like peace and compared to other parts of the world.

I assume you're talking post-1945 or even post-Cold War here? The west has has a violent history of conquest.

 

[manoz]

Oh dear and here's me thinking it started when some vile, cave-dwelling nutcase murdered 3000 people in New York. I think you'll find that the west does actually quite like peace and compared to other parts of the world, like say the middle-east, is a lot more peaceful. You're right to point out that we don't like losing wars though - we prefer winning them which is why we usually do in the end.

Really you still believe that? You are delusional. America and the west had a lot more to gain from that "attack" then the ME or Islam. Even if you do believe the ridiculous official story, most suspects were Saudis, ISIS and other rebel groupps follow the same doctrine as Saudi. We never invaded or reprimanded Saudi. ISIS don't attack Israel either. The invasion of Iraq and bombing of Libya and Syria were all based on lies. Not only that but the group that the west and Saudi wants in power (Army of Islam) follow the same doctrine and want Sharia Law in secular country that didn't have such. The people don't get a say? If the west or more specially likes peace then how come it's bombed and poisoned so many countries since it had the ability to bomb so many countries? This war on terror is nothing but a charade to get more oil and sell it in dollars.

 

[manoz]

Besides, even if all that (along with other western ideas like democracy, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, human rights and minor little things like that) is ignored and the west actually was the mercenary sociopath some people claim it is war still wouldn't be the result. Peace is more profitable than war.

The idea that all IS wants is peace and trade is, to be very polite to manoz, not very plausible.

Democracy and freedom of speech don't actually exist in the west, that's becoming clearer everyday that it's all pretend. Freedom of religion is going down because of peoples ignorance and this http://www.presstv.com/Detail/2016/02/08/449289/Kevin-Barrett. As for human rights, I don't think the west really cares. If it did, it wouldn't prop up Saudi. The west only cares about its economy and control of resources while it pretends to give the "uncivilised" world democracy and freedom. I just don't understand how anyone can trust the west after all the problems it causes, all the civil wars it backs to destabilise governments, the way it uses sanctions to wage war and the lies it spreads about beloved leaders. I guess shopping for frivolous things, reality TV, freedoms etc all are rather good distractions to keep people oblivious to what's really going on. If anyone cares about seeing things from different sides, this is a rather intriguing talk

goes on a bit though lol

 

[NickK]

Dang who'd a thunk after attacking and destroying the er axis of er evil that 10's of millions of people would want to leave their destroyed towns and come to relatively close wealthy societies, har ******* har to the neo con ****** that thought it was a good idea.

A surprisingly truthful piece from the Independent

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...e-after-isis-in-the-middle-east-a6860276.html

The problem is that it's religious hate.. not a political 'adjustment'.

People are fleeing the the fact that everyone hates their religion (sect). Same will occur when Iran and Saudi kick off.

 

[scorza]

The problem is that it's religious hate.. not a political 'adjustment'.

People are fleeing the the fact that everyone hates their religion (sect). Same will occur when Iran and Saudi kick off.

Oh look - it's NickK and his blind bigotry

 

[manoz]

Besides, even if all that (along with other western ideas like democracy, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, human rights and minor little things like that) is ignored and the west actually was the mercenary sociopath some people claim it is war still wouldn't be the result. Peace is more profitable than war.

The idea that all IS wants is peace and trade is, to be very polite to manoz, not very plausible.

Aww you thought I meant ISIS want peace? ISIS is and has been nothing more then a fake enemy as cover for capturing oil fields and smuggling it into Turkey. Russia caught them however and is now at the top of Pentagon's list of threats. ISIS is 5th.

The list is
Russia
China
North Korea
Iran
ISIS

Russia also switched to Yuan http://russia-insider.com/en/politi...russia-now-chinas-biggest-oil-partner/ri12611
Iran switched to the Euro http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2016/02/05/448836/Iran-wants-oil-payments-in-euros-only-
China told George Soros to leave their currency alone https://www.rt.com/news/330252-china-warns-soros-currency-war/
North korea have an "odd demeanor" lol and have nuclear bombs and they are independent and not tied to US hegemony.

Perhaps try different sources of news?Like
https://www.youtube.com/user/StormCloudsGathering/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/wearechange/featured
https://www.youtube.com/user/cgreene34/featured

 

[Angilion]

Aww you thought I meant ISIS want peace? ISIS is and has been nothing more then a fake enemy as cover for capturing oil fields and smuggling it into Turkey.https://www.youtube.com/user/cgreene34/featured [..]

Oh, you're a silly conspiracy nutter. No point carrying on, then. I'll just chat with the aliens in Roswell on my Batphone instead.

 

[Iraklis F.C.]

briefing by some Russian general or something similar, some info on the turkish violation of the open skies treaty

 

[scorza]

briefing by some Russian general or something similar, some info on the turkish violation of the open skies treaty

Thanks for the tip off, as it's a Russian general or similar I know to ignore it as it'll be 100% bull dust

 

[Iraklis F.C.]

Thanks for the tip off, as it's a Russian general or similar I know to ignore it as it'll be 100% bull dust

you shouldn't, to have a better view on the situation you must study all sides. Unless you are brainwashed and you have accepted it.

 

[thep02]

I can't help thinking that if such a situation occured in a modern western culture it wouldn't have resulted in an instant butcherfest.

Get some sf running round the country letting off bombs in key places chosen to foster feelings of animosity between different groups within the country to create and nurture conflicting factions and power centres.

Get intel guys pretending to represent those different UK factions who can get arms from "foreign supporters" and before you know what's what we have fathers of dead kids suicide bombing the Yorkshire ***** who killed his kids and car loads of Brummies looting the black country, civil war.

 

[The Running Man]

Get some sf running round the country letting off bombs in key places chosen to foster feelings of animosity between different groups within the country to create and nature conflicting factions and power centres.

Get intel guys pretending to represent those different UK factions who can get arms from "foreign supporters" and before you know what's what we have fathers of dead kids suicide bombing the Yorkshire ***** who killed his kids and car loads of Brummies looting the black country, civil war.

Obe side has to be strong enough to win the war militarily and then keep the power from extremists.

the rebels even with billions in weapons aid are not strong enough. Look at them trying to negotiate a cease fire, most of the opposition can't agree what they want. If they did oust assaf would they be able to fend off isis? If so for how long? What would they do with the power? The situations in both iraq and libya show that even if they get full US backing and take out the dictator they become paralysed over what to do next as they can't agree and form governments acceptable to everybody. Which is impossible anyway but the hardcore rekigious will never accept secular governments, and without secular government there will be no progress and mass discrimination against the minority groups.

 

[sven256]

Obe side has to be strong enough to win the war militarily and then keep the power from extremists.

the rebels even with billions in weapons aid are not strong enough. Look at them trying to negotiate a cease fire, most of the opposition can't agree what they want. If they did oust assaf would they be able to fend off isis? If so for how long? What would they do with the power? The situations in both iraq and libya show that even if they get full US backing and take out the dictator they become paralysed over what to do next as they can't agree and form governments acceptable to everybody. Which is impossible anyway but the hardcore rekigious will never accept secular governments, and without secular government there will be no progress and mass discrimination against the minority groups.

Lets be honest most of the"rebels" at the peace talks are hard-line Islamic groups. ISIS by any other name is just the same.

They have no real say, as they are losing ground at a rate of knots and the most probable outcome will be a joint coalition betweeen the SDF and the regime forces. As i can not see ISIS lasting the course of the year in Syria and Iraq. Even if they do it will be a case of small pockets of resistance.

 

[The Running Man]

Besides that, we have seen first hand how muslims can vote - in a free and open society and that's through their imam.

The best chance of a moderate democratic process and government was Egypt after their uprising. A country not complete awash5 with guns and militia. And who did they vote in? The Muslim brotherhood.

What chance does iraq or libya or Syria have now filled with militia and weapons. Do you think anyone would gave freedom to vote? And even if they did who would they vote for? Moderate people don't ride in land cruisers sporting 50 caliber machineguns.

 

[scorza]

you shouldn't, to have a better view on the situation you must study all sides. Unless you are brainwashed and you have accepted it.

In England we have an expression; "fool me once - shame on you, fool me twice - shame on me". Russia has been caught out lying time and time again, it's even in their military handbooks - Masikrova or something. You'd have to be a collosal idiot to believe anything the Russian government tells you.

 

[deuse]

In England we have an expression; "fool me once - shame on you, fool me twice - shame on me". Russia has been caught out lying time and time again, it's even in their military handbooks - Masikrova or something. You'd have to be a collosal idiot to believe anything the Russian government tells you.

It's not just the Russians. Every government are a bunch of crooks.

 

[scorza]

It's not just the Russians. Every government are a bunch of crooks.

There's a scale of "crookery", we're at one end and the Russians are at the other.

 

[robgmun]

Besides that, we have seen first hand how muslims can vote - in a free and open society and that's through their imam.

The best chance of a moderate democratic process and government was Egypt after their uprising. A country not complete awash5 with guns and militia. And who did they vote in? The Muslim brotherhood.

What chance does iraq or libya or Syria have now filled with militia and weapons. Do you think anyone would gave freedom to vote? And even if they did who would they vote for? Moderate people don't ride in land cruisers sporting 50 caliber machineguns.

Indeed, for some reason muslims seems to prefer the shackles of Autocracy. Either a dictatorship or a monarchal rule. I was amused and a little disturbed when i was watching the 'Jihadi next door' C4 programme of a woman in a Burka handing out leaflets say "Free yourself from the shackles of Democracy"

I LOL'd at her stupidity a bit but also disturbed that people in this country can think in such a way and can only conclude she was mentally retarded

 

[SexyGreyFox]

I was amused and a little disturbed when i was watching the 'Jihadi next door' C4 programme of a woman in a Burka handing out leaflets say "Free yourself from the shackles of Democracy"

I LOL'd at her stupidity a bit but also disturbed that people in this country can think in such a way and can only conclude she was mentally retarded

I got round to watching it last night and it was quite disturbing.
They all want to be free from democracy to live under the thumb of Sharia.

However I was also thinking they could all be white people dressed up to look like Muslims so it fits with with manoz beliefs.
What do you reckon manoz?
Can you find me another actors advert for whites to be blacked up?