ISIL, ISIS, Daesh discussion thread.

[Destination]

If the west keep pressing isil, and russia takes out the syrian opposition, then assad can rally his forces and deal with isil on the ground. Leaving a weakened assad and no isil.
I'd be hapoy enough with that mess.

 

[Robosapien]

It can help degrade them so they're a less effective fighting force, so then the troops on the ground can own them/or they go below the critical mass needed to actually do anything meaningful. It can also shatter morale and lead to even more desertions/mean fewer people join up/etc.

I'm not so sure about that last part? Excuse my ignorance, but didn't this group come to prominence as a result of the Iraq occupation i.e. they've already been driven to join by such action? Dropping more bombs might actually strengthen their resolve?

 

[Tosno]

Amusingly UK production is currently at its highest for 15 years *shrug*

And new fields are being sanctioned.

And of course, in the west your wife would just be going to the nearest hospital without the need for bribery.

How long can it carry on? 140 threatened for closure in the next 5 years, over the same time just 38 are expected to be opened.

It's all swings and roundabouts, any hospital but ridiculous waiting lists.

 

[Jokester]

Oil production won't stop in the North Sea any quicker than the rest of the world. The rapid improvements being made to renewables, particularly solar and battery technology will render oil all but useless for anything put manufacturing of plastic compounds which is a minor market compared to energy.

The UK can live without an oil industry. Russia is completely reliant on it.

 

[scorza]

If the west keep pressing isil, and russia takes out the syrian opposition, then assad can rally his forces and deal with isil on the ground. Leaving a weakened assad and no isil.
I'd be hapoy enough with that mess.

I think the West should let Russia fight the Islamic State in Syria on its own - our job is to get them out of Iraq. Let Russia take on an expensive anti-terror operation for a change. At the same time we can turn the tables on Russia - send some Typhoons out of Cyprus on a strafing runs of Latakia and turn away just before we enter Syrian airspace - test their response

 

[Tefal]

Oil production won't stop in the North Sea any quicker than the rest of the world. The rapid improvements being made to renewables, particularly solar and battery technology will render oil all but useless for anything put manufacturing of plastic compounds which is a minor market compared to energy.

The UK can live without an oil industry. Russia is completely reliant on it.

and you know the petrochemical industry and pharmaceutical industry and the transportation industry, I mean come on you really think we're going to have electric planes and ships?

The UK can live without an oil industry.

it can live without an oil extraction industry, but it cannot live without oil.

 

[PermaBanned]

Technically almost everything we make from oil could also be made from plant matter or other biomass. I haven't actually seen any of the maths on what would be required to make that work but it would be very interesting.

 

[robfosters]

It's annoying me somewhat that the UK and US seem to be doing nothing except having a go at Russia over this.

I'm beginning to seriously doubt my own government's motives.

 

[Tefal]

Technically almost everything we make from oil could also be made from plant matter or other biomass. I haven't actually seen any of the maths on what would be required to make that work but it would be very interesting.

incredibly expensive though, and much harder to do on the scale we do it with oil (you gotta give it to oil its pretty easy to move in bulk).

you are right though the amount of arable land required to produce enough matter would be interesting to see worked out

although i suppose the track were going on with the algae that can produce diesel would be a massive space saver vs growing something then trying to turn it into an oil equivilent.

 

[PermaBanned]

incredibly expensive though, and much harder to do on the scale we do it with oil (you gotta give it to oil its pretty easy to move in bulk).

Surely a large part of that is the pretty much centuries of investment and work that have gone into creating a society and infrastructure dependent on fossil fuels. If you actually take a step back and think about it oil extraction and processing on a global scale is just a ridiculously difficult and complex task, i'd say at least on par with fulfilling the same needs via biomass. But we found a way to do it. The main drawback of any alternatives is really startup cost. All we can do for now though is to properly fund research and development.

Anyway, this is my first time poking my head into this thread, what on earth does this have to do with ISIS?

 

[Tefal]

Surely a large part of that is the pretty much centuries of investment and work that have gone into creating a society and infrastructure dependent on fossil fuels. If you actually take a step back and think about it oil extraction and processing on a global scale is just a ridiculously difficult and complex task, i'd say at least on par with fulfilling the same needs via biomass. But we found a way to do it. The main drawback of any alternatives is really startup cost. All we can do for now though is to properly fund research and development.

oil doesn't need that much once its set up though, once you've got your wells and you pipes liens theres not that much work to do (relativly speaking)

biomass requires continual work, but as i said the algae route seems interesting as it provides the same liquid form as oil which is great for transport and processing.

Anyway, this is my first time poking my head into this thread, what on earth does this have to do with ISIS?

ISIS are operating in the region we get most of our oil from and have seized sizeable oil feilds ?

 

[PermaBanned]

oil doesn't need that much once its set up though, once you've got your wells and you pipes liens theres not that much work to do (relativly speaking)

biomass requires continual work, but as i said the algae route seems interesting as it provides the same liquid form as oil which is great for transport and processing.

I don't really see how biomass would require any more work, considering how much goes into drilling and refining and finding new places to extract oil from and transportation...

It's annoying me somewhat that the UK and US seem to be doing nothing except having a go at Russia over this.

I'm beginning to seriously doubt my own government's motives.

The US and the UK don't want to eliminate ISIS for Assad, because then he would be able to focus all of his efforts on the other factions and could relatively easily return himself to power. Which we don't want. Because he's a despicable leader responsible for atrocious human rights violations.

 

[Tefal]

I don't really see how biomass would require any more work, considering how much goes into drilling and refining and finding new places to extract oil from and transportation...

fertilizing, harvesting, planting, processing, and then once you've got it to the hydrocarbon stage it enters into the entire system we already have set up for oil.


once a field is set up it can tick over without masses of intervention.

once you set up a biomass farm it will require constant interaction.

 

[robfosters]

The US and the UK don't want to eliminate ISIS for Assad, because then he would be able to focus all of his efforts on the other factions and could relatively easily return himself to power. Which we don't want. Because he's a despicable leader responsible for atrocious human rights violations.

Surely he's far less dangerous to us than ISIS are though?

 

[PermaBanned]

Surely he's far less dangerous to us than ISIS are though?

Debatable. ISIS don't really post a threat to us, and most of our military action in the area has really been to contain them until a better solution presents itself. Danger to Syrian citizens is a whole other question.

fertilizing, harvesting, planting, processing, and then once you've got it to the hydrocarbon stage it enters into the entire system we already have set up for oil.


once a field is set up it can tick over without masses of intervention.

once you set up a biomass farm it will require constant interaction.

That is, for biomass you specifically grow rather than simply using the waste products of other industries. I still think you underestimate the work that goes into continued oil extraction, but i'm too tired to continue.

 

[Tefal]

That is, for biomass you specifically grow rather than simply using the waste products of other industries. I still think you underestimate the work that goes into continued oil extraction, but i'm too tired to continue.

you'll find a lot of waste is already used for stuff. if you want to replace oil its going to have to be a dedicated oil crop I'm afraid.

put it this way if it was even remotely close in terms of cost and effort people would do it, as it is its not practical on the same scale.

 

[robfosters]

Also makes me laugh the way the US spend the day slamming Russia for the bombing and meanwhile their bombers are hitting a hospital and killing loads of innocent people.

The US are hypocrites. There can be no doubt about that. They believe there can only be one sheriff in town.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Air attacks kill at least 19 at Afghanistan hospital

I am just stunned as how was this allowed to happen... No one knows for sure who is to blame but most likely NATO is responsible.

UN human rights Chief says the attacks might possibly be "criminal"

Can bombing of a hospital be justified any different?

 

[scorza]

The US and the UK don't want to eliminate ISIS for Assad, because then he would be able to focus all of his efforts on the other factions and could relatively easily return himself to power. Which we don't want. Because he's a despicable leader responsible for atrocious human rights violations.

The US (and France) are the only actors fighting Islamic State in Syria. Assad has been concentrating purely on fighting/torturing/murdering other rebels because his long term strategy is to convince the West that he's the good guy and IS are the bad guys - that's why he for example, released hundreds of jihadis from Syrian prisons to go fight for IS. Russia have done a handful of airstrikes against IS in Syria but the vast majority have been against the other rebels so it seems they plan on continuing with this strategy.

 

[Zethor]

Also makes me laugh the way the US spend the day slamming Russia for the bombing and meanwhile their bombers are hitting a hospital and killing loads of innocent people.

The US are hypocrites. There can be no doubt about that. They believe there can only be one sheriff in town.

Go back and read what you've just said. You're complaining about there being only one sheriff in town, as opposed to what, two maybe? Which is what the Cold War was, with its constant threat of nuclear war. Or several sheriffs, which is what the world was pre WWI and WWII, that turned out nicely didn't it?

The US make mistakes but it also does most of the dirty work for the rest of the democracies, you should be thanking them not moaning.