ISIS and Islamic militants - discussion

deuse · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:16

Robbo said:
Common sense?

So nothing as I thought.

So that somehow means that the majority of the global Muslim population support ISIS?

"Mr Hammond told BBC Breakfast the government was aware of "significant numbers" of British nationals involved with extremist organisations overseas"

I was talking about the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria scum in the UK.
"British extremists among 'most vicious' in Isis, expert says"

"Jihadism expert says Sunni Muslims from the UK do everything from suicide bombings to executions in Syria and Iraq conflicts"

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/20/uk-isis-extremists-most-vicious-iraq-syria-expert

http://www.christianconcern.com/our...s-support-killing-for-islam-40-for-sharia-law

Says it all really.

balky12 · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:16

Amnesia said:
i think there was a twisted survey done which he linked previously, the reason i say twisted is because it clearly had an agenda to make the average muslim sound like he had terrorist views.

What surveys don't have agendas? I don't get how much you can twist a survey.

Are you Muslim: Yes / No.
Do you think killing in the name of religion is acceptable: Yes / No

32% of people who circled yes for the 1st question circled yes for the 2nd.

The results get published, people are free to draw own conclusions.

Craterloads · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:16

Sad state of affairs all around, what a tremendous balls up this whole Iraq thing has been from the get go.

tbyeah · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:17

Found it.

tbyeah · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:18

deuse said:
So nothing as I thought.

"Mr Hammond told BBC Breakfast the government was aware of "significant numbers" of British nationals involved with extremist organisations overseas"

I was talking about the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria scum in the UK.
"British extremists among 'most vicious' in Isis, expert says"

"Jihadism expert says Sunni Muslims from the UK do everything from suicide bombings to executions in Syria and Iraq conflicts"

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/20/uk-isis-extremists-most-vicious-iraq-syria-expert

Says it all really.

Your justification, for the statement that a MAJORITY of 2,000,000 British Muslims support IS, is that 400 of them are fighting along side them.

Riiiiiggghht...

tbyeah · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:20

balky12 said:
What surveys don't have agendas? I don't get how much you can twist a survey.

Are you Muslim: Yes / No.
Do you think killing in the name of religion is acceptable: Yes / No

32% of people who circled yes for the 1st question circled yes for the 2nd.

The results get published, people are free to draw own conclusions.

In fairness that doesn't mean that they support IS, they could be thinking of circumstances where if they become oppressed etc.

Only 6% said that someone who leaves Islam should be punished under Sharia, which is more relevant (albeit still a high number).

Xordium · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:20

Robbo said:
I'm just saying, I think it's unfair to say that ISIS represent Islam in any meaningful way. They're a load of nutters.

They do not represent Islam but they do come from Islamic backgrounds with a Islamic worldview (even if perverted from the norm). The people from this country that are over there come from Islamic enclaves and unintegrated communities across this country.

As much as you don't like it this is a very Islamic problem and Islamic people have to be part of the solution and quick before they find themselves on the bad end of association which will in likelihood drive more people to such causes. Trying to hide you head in the sand and go all PC and disassociate the actions of these people and Muslims though is wrong.

lemonkettaz · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:22

It doesnt matter how many are IS, what should matter is that there should be 0 IS style muslims in the UK. It only takes a handfull or 1 to do something hideous in the UK

People seems to justify with the numbers, justify the existence of evil extreme people because they fall in at under 1%

Well lets all sit on our thumbs and hope the 0.01% get all the killing out their system.

Woogie · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:24

Saying ISIS represent Islam as a whole is like saying the Westborro baptist church represent the entirety of Christianity.

They are a splinter cell that happen to be part of the same religious faith.

Gornall · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:26

lemonkettaz said:
It doesnt matter how many are IS, what should matter is that there should be 0 IS style muslims in the UK. It only takes a handfull or 1 to do something hideous in the UK

People seems to justify with the numbers, justify the existence of evil extreme people because they fall in at under 1%

Well lets all sit on our thumbs and hope the 0.01% get all the killing out their system.

More chance of you dying while getting out of bed...do you sit there and panic everytime you do?

No...because realistically...it's a terrible consequence but has an amazing low risk/impact in the grand scheme of things.

Amnesia · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:27

balky12 said:
What surveys don't have agendas? I don't get how much you can twist a survey.

Are you Muslim: Yes / No.
Do you think killing in the name of religion is acceptable: Yes / No

32% of people who circled yes for the 1st question circled yes for the 2nd.

The results get published, people are free to draw own conclusions.

Well out of all the surveys i have done in uni, i cant remember any asking me if i would kill my classmates, so it does come as a bit twisted.

now from what ive heard these sections about killing are advising people what to do at a time of war. so yes it mentions killing.

i could be wrong, its not something ive read...just my understanding of what ive heard.

johnnymarz · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:29

I have not read the Qu'ran, but there must be some controversial passages in the book that keep getting consistently misrepresented by extremists. For it to get misquoted time and time again and to be so widespread across the world.

Absolutely sick of religion, education is the key. I feel the need to help those that are religious to open their minds.

It's so simple,

1000's of religions created by man but somehow you think yours is the divine one? That's a 1/1000 shot on its own.
Pretend you are born in a completely different country with a different religious culture. How would you have been raised, what would you know and be aware of? The same values? No.

Them two points alone would convince me.

Robbo · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:29

Xordium said:
They do not represent Islam but they do come from Islamic backgrounds with a Islamic worldview (even if perverted from the norm). The people from this country that are over there come from Islamic enclaves and unintegrated communities across this country.

As much as you don't like it this is a very Islamic problem and Islamic people have to be part of the solution and quick before they find themselves on the bad end of association which will in likelihood drive more people to such causes. Trying to hide you head in the sand and go all PC and disassociate the actions of these people and Muslims though is wrong.

Don't get me wrong, I think there are a lot of deep rooted problems within Islam, however I think certain people are attempting to blur the line between your average Muslim and an ISIS terrorist - which is wrong.

lemonkettaz · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:30

I definitely dont panic in my bed no

And there is more chance of winning my football accumulators. Absolute meaningless point.

A fact is these people exist. Ok ill just bury my head in the sand and not think about it. As long as no one in the uk is being executed they can do what they want

Even though its happened already

duc999 · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:31

Would it not be easier to ensure the 0.01% are not allowed back into the UK to begin with ? Cuts the risk even more ?

Gornall · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:33

lemonkettaz said:
I definitely dont panic in my bed no

And there is more chance of winning my football accumulators. Absolute meaningless point.

A fact is these people exist. Ok ill just bury my head in the sand and not think about it. As long as no one in the uk is being executed they can do what they want

Even though its happened already

Oh I'm not saying they don't need to be brought to account/justice.

What I'm saying is, the vast overstatements constantly of who these 0.01% represent.

They don't represent Islam, they don't represent religion, they represent the beliefs of 0.01% and that's that.

lemonkettaz · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:37

Yeh we all agree the very small proportion are insane and do not represent any religion.

However just closing the gate on the UK to this lot is probably not possible. As for the ones here already either back or havent gone out yet, who knows.

Amnesia · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:38

lemonkettaz said:
When will people protest in the streeets against IS? They love a protest against Israel , all in support of the palestinians , students seems to love palestinians too. Funny how not many people get all angry enough to wave flags in local high streets against IS, where are all the peace lovers about this lot? Where are all the good muslims kicking off against the bad ones? What about all the studenty type folk ?

We live in peace so others dont have too.

people see the Palestinians as ordinary muslims just like themselves and when they see them getting killed, they dont like it

I guess they just dont relate to ISIS.
They will see it as a problem the West created, even after 3480978943 warnings that it would create more terrorists...bush and blair went ahead anyway.

you were probably in the camp of going to war against Iraq and now it has all gone to crap because of the war....you want those who were against the war to fix it for you ? well thats how its coming across.

Amnesia · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:40

johnnymarz said:
1000's of religions created by man but somehow you think yours is the divine one? That's a 1/1000 shot on its own.

Tunnel vision

XeNoN89 · 20 Aug 2014 at 11:48

Robbo said:
Don't get me wrong, I think there are a lot of deep rooted problems within Islam, however I think certain people are attempting to blur the line between your average Muslim and an ISIS terrorist - which is wrong.

The issue is that the Islamic religion continues to be interpreted in it's more extreme way by a large amount of Muslims. It's like a few hundreds year ago when almost all Christians interpreted the bible in it's more extreme ways. The difference is that now most Christians look over the morally questionable parts, and there are only a very very tiny few loons who follow it exactly. Islam needs to reach this point as well, and until it does there will never be peace.