teleport gives you map control. having map awareness is good but theres a difference between knowing what might happen and being able to actually do something about it instantly...
i personally do not run teleport but i have seen it used very well.
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teleport gives you map control. having map awareness is good but theres a difference between knowing what might happen and being able to actually do something about it instantly...
i personally do not run teleport but i have seen it used very well.
I have played well over a thousand games of HoN, and god only knows how many of DOTA, and my knowledge of this is therefore pretty good, but things change, you may know where the next bit of action will happen, but the bit of action after that? As said, TP gives you control, you CAN be where your needed, without it you just have to hope you're in the right place at the right time.
Not only that but sometimes the RIGHT place IS farming, because running to somewhere you speculate action may be going down or standing around at a tower is time that you aren't XPing or farming while the enemy are. The farming point isn't about safety - as you identified bunny that comes from map awareness and wards, its about maximising your time.
The ability to even up a fight in the blink of an eye is invaluable as well, turning a 2v2 into a 2v3 and pushing a tower, or preventing a team mate from getting ganked alone at a tower then losing it is useful.
There's also other tactics to consider such as if the enemy team is down to the inhib tower on bottom lane and all 5 are gathered and suddenly port off to top to push the first tower in there is absolutely nothing you can do about that unless you & your team can counter TP. Yes this is an extreme example but also consider that sometimes 4 people can stall 5 of the other team while one pusher ports out and unless your team can send one person off as well then you'll lose towers.
It does actually shock me that TP in this game isn't taken at least 95% of the time by players especially as you get TWO summoner skills. I hate to relate again to HoN but some of the metagame is still similar but in a higher level environment you'd have to be nuts not to carry a TP stone at all times. Wards and map awareness are great as they lead to more control but by adding TP to this control you have yet one more thing the enemy team doesn't have.
The ability to even up a fight in the blink of an eye is invaluable as well, turning a 2v2 into a 2v3 and pushing a tower, or preventing a team mate from getting ganked alone at a tower then losing it is useful.
There's also other tactics to consider such as if the enemy team is down to the inhib tower on bottom lane and all 5 are gathered and suddenly port off to top to push the first tower in there is absolutely nothing you can do about that unless you & your team can counter TP. Yes this is an extreme example but also consider that sometimes 4 people can stall 5 of the other team while one pusher ports out and unless your team can send one person off as well then you'll lose towers.
It does actually shock me that TP in this game isn't taken at least 95% of the time by players especially as you get TWO summoner skills. I hate to relate again to HoN but some of the metagame is still similar but in a higher level environment you'd have to be nuts not to carry a TP stone at all times. Wards and map awareness are great as they lead to more control but by adding TP to this control you have yet one more thing the enemy team doesn't have.
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Soldato
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We had a pretty epic ranked game this evening. In truth we got outpicked, I got first blooded and we were losing for about the first 25-30 mins. Even on kills but 3 towers down, then we managed to turn it around for a 65 minute win.
Soldato
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This isnt HoN. I have not played it, but afaik the speed and pace of play is much quicker in HoN.
A tower is basically an npc person for statistical purposes, so on tower it would 3v3. Unless you are 5 pushing a tower, nearly all successful tower take-downs occur on undefended towers, either from a successful gank or drawing the enemy away.
I am sorry, but you are wrong. The fail here is that your team are pushing as 5 when a side lane is pushed back in an indefensible position. If you have correctly placed the wave enemy side, off tower, before group pushing your scenario simply cannot happen. Even for fast pushers like sivir, it takes virtually no time at all for 1 of your group to split from mid to the side lane in question. Also, splash fortify.
Quite simply, by placing creep waves, warding and keeping an eye on the mini map gives you an early warning system of likely events before they occur. By relying on TP, you are grossly underestimating how much time it takes to travel from one side of the map to the other, because with boots, its actually very quick indeed.
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You've just proved my point, were you agreeing with me here? TP helps facilitate these things.
And the travel time from bottom inhib to say first or second top tower also is tiny - which was my example by the way which you appear to have miss-understood. Perhaps I poorly explained.
TP Allows you to break the "likely events before they occur". Don't see how early game you can get from Bot First to Top First with your boots in time to stop a tower push or gank. Enlighten me?
Soldato
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Sure thing. Assuming you have solo top, solo mid, 2 bot and 1 jungler:
1)mid or bot notice a miss and call it. Top lane, aware of a probable gank pull back to a more defencible position (if the lane is pushed forward, which it shouldnt be. You nearly always want to place the wave just infront but out of range of your tower)
result: Gank is unsuccessful
2)either or: mid lane cycles to top, 1 from bot cycles to mid. Jungler makes a decision about where lane presence is required. Also, consider map wide ultis, such as Ashe and TF (typical mid laners) and shen (jungler or bot lane)
result: Travel time cut in half, all lanes are still protected without burning a summoner spell.
Job done
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i think you are underestimating the power of teleport and you're thinking of it the wrong way. i'm gonna give you one very basic situation where you map awareness does not cover it.
lets say top lane is 1v1. they are in lane, lanes unpushed and happily harassing/farming. one of them gets off a skillshot or whatever and lands a meaty combo... a kill is insight. he commits and chases the other champ who is now backing off - he is certain to get the kill. cue your teleport.... champion saved, possibly turning it around to get a kill back.
no amount of map awareness is going to prevent that situation. you may say it is the fault of the player for getting himself hit and put on low health but you need to realise no one is perfect and more importantly... the chances of a very passive farming lane is near zero... one person going to win that lane.
it is best used when players commit, when they feel that they can get something, be it a kill or a buff. don't forget that you can tp to wards as well, you can literally appear out of nowhere. the best uses of tp ive seen involved defending/attacking buffs and turning fights around.
you may feel that tp is a waste of a slot but what you need to ask yourself is, have you ever seen good use of shen/tf ulti? it provides very similar utility, especially if you have good ward placement.
lets say top lane is 1v1. they are in lane, lanes unpushed and happily harassing/farming. one of them gets off a skillshot or whatever and lands a meaty combo... a kill is insight. he commits and chases the other champ who is now backing off - he is certain to get the kill. cue your teleport.... champion saved, possibly turning it around to get a kill back.
no amount of map awareness is going to prevent that situation. you may say it is the fault of the player for getting himself hit and put on low health but you need to realise no one is perfect and more importantly... the chances of a very passive farming lane is near zero... one person going to win that lane.
it is best used when players commit, when they feel that they can get something, be it a kill or a buff. don't forget that you can tp to wards as well, you can literally appear out of nowhere. the best uses of tp ive seen involved defending/attacking buffs and turning fights around.
you may feel that tp is a waste of a slot but what you need to ask yourself is, have you ever seen good use of shen/tf ulti? it provides very similar utility, especially if you have good ward placement.
Soldato
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Urgh, your really not getting this are you. Assuming i am not a total idiot, and i know somebody on the other time is running a teleport, I know not to commit stupidly deep to get a stupid kill. If the enemy is as low as you say he is, he HAS to go back to nexus, i don't care whether he dies or not, he is still losing gold and exp by being out of lane. If you don't have survivability and cannot live through a 2v1 and you chase a kill, commit too deep and die that is YOUR mistake and YOUR fail and you need common sense not teleport to fix it.
We are going to have to agree to disagree with this one, because If You Know The Enemy Are Running A Map Wide Ulti And/Or Teleport You Simply Adjust Your Game Plan To Suit.
The only tactical play teleport enhances is the Blue Screw. On game start 1 person buys a ward and rushes to their blue to ward it. 1 bot lane runs teleport and teleports into the ward to gank the (low health from fighting blue) jungler
Avec said it perfectly 3 pages back
This game is strategically not that different from modern tennis. Chip and charge is a dead art. The meta game runs off baseline rallies, and the game is won/lost on a composite of forced and unforced errors. Unforced errors are bonus points ripe for exploitation, forced errors are about pressurising the opponent into an indefensible position.
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Do you not feel TP can force mistakes even from people who are playing cautiously? I gotta agree with Oj here and say TP gives great utility when used correctly(which is rare).
I for one love someone like Teemo who carrys TP, he's so so good at backdooring.
I for one love someone like Teemo who carrys TP, he's so so good at backdooring.
i am in no way questioning your intelligence or ability in the game. i do however find it really surprising how much you disregard teleport.. if you were bashing revive or rally i might understand but teleport is a key spell that at least one person on your team should run.
i get what you are saying, but you talk as if everyone plays perfect and the team is a machine. you also can't play THAT conservative... you talk as if you know exactly when the opponent will use teleport and you know how the game will unfold. its true that with map awareness you can expect certain things, but essentially you can't be in 2 places at once and you can't roam that map acting on your 'hunches' all the time, its absolutely not viable.
teleport allows you to respond instantly and teleport paired with good map awareness gives you insane map control.
i get what you are saying, but you talk as if everyone plays perfect and the team is a machine. you also can't play THAT conservative... you talk as if you know exactly when the opponent will use teleport and you know how the game will unfold. its true that with map awareness you can expect certain things, but essentially you can't be in 2 places at once and you can't roam that map acting on your 'hunches' all the time, its absolutely not viable.
teleport allows you to respond instantly and teleport paired with good map awareness gives you insane map control.
As has been said, he's the best solo champ in the game but when it comes to a teamfight he tends to get lost and tends to be a glass cannon. His role is to basically focus down their carry and completely eliminate them. When doing his ult he is stunned as much and for as long as the receiver, which is a huge weakness in a team fight against people who know to focus you.
A good Malz is powerful, a bad Malz isn't really so much. Same with the majority of other champs.
We're going to have to agree to disagree then. You're making valid points of how to solve this specific situation but at the same time I can also see ways that these problems can be solved more easily with TP and with the possibility of not just avoiding a gank but being able to turn it around and push the enemy tower (gank defense side) or on the ganking side someone TPing in to gank doesn't actually give much time for a lane to call miss and result in not 1 but 2 lanes coordinating to move across (what if mid is pushed right to the tower and your mid can't go up?).
There's too many other situations which others and myself have tried to point out where TP can also give you an advantage but it's pointless going back and forward trying to counter every point and case because the thread would go on forever.
Teleport is a good summoner spell, however there are better spells to be carrying.
Currently the likes of Exhaust Ignite Flash or ghost seem to be the staple
To win games you need to destroy the towers which generally involves a fair few team fights where most summoner skills becvome better than TP.
Currently the likes of Exhaust Ignite Flash or ghost seem to be the staple
To win games you need to destroy the towers which generally involves a fair few team fights where most summoner skills becvome better than TP.
Really depends if you have the ability to teleport eg Pantheon or TF, if you don't then i'd argue you do need at least one and a couple are well worth the spend.
teleport is awesome for backdooring though , place a ward telelport to it whack a tower , recall.
wait for cooldown
Teleport is a nice summoner spell, but then again every summoner spell is nice that's the point. Spells like Flash or Ghost give you far more utility then a TP does, other spells like Exhaust or Ignite give you a much stronger presence in Teamfights. That's not to say Teleport is useless, far from it. It's one of the most powerful summoner spells in the game (I'd consider it in the top 5, with the other 4 I mentioned) simply that it's not useful on everyone, where as the others are.
Honestly I would only advise running it on a solo top though, because they are usually the characters that need the most farm and are always far away from the action.
Just to add though, if you run Teleport solely for the purpose of backdooring or use it to get farm from a lane. Stop running the spell. It encourages bad habits and is a horrendous use of a very powerful summoner spell.
Honestly I would only advise running it on a solo top though, because they are usually the characters that need the most farm and are always far away from the action.
Just to add though, if you run Teleport solely for the purpose of backdooring or use it to get farm from a lane. Stop running the spell. It encourages bad habits and is a horrendous use of a very powerful summoner spell.
Are they planning on a new EU server at all.I seem to have to wait quite often to get a game now
Yep there is a post on there news page which goes into it - although no specifics or eta but even Riot must realise the current situation can't go on. It will work for current players but will turn off new players