Legal aid should not fund asylum legal action.

McstylisT said:
Again a very honest and personal post, which I appreciate.( giving you full respect that you are being honest here).

Most of us can only imagine what living in that environment is like. We don’t have those realities you described.
The answer is not to run anyway from it though. It’s about education, and people staying to fix a broken system in India and many other places. I agree that the normal reaction for a human is to escape. But it’s what has been done for years and things haven’t improved. It’s time to enlighten the others, get politicians who have a wider perspective and politically and morally revive the nation. To make it a better home.

For me everyone just upping sticks and heading to the UK just brings the issues here. People like you sound like you do everything needed and integrate without issue. In my life I don’t think I have ever met an Indian who wasn’t warm, pleasant and welcoming. Islam in my observation is another thing altogether. It’s very divisive. Dangerous even.

Most of the ideas you mention at the end of the post, is mostly what I would like to see. But as many bigger problems you can’t tackle it whole. It’s needs to be broken down to manageable proportions. Believe it or not, Brexit was a good step. Now we need strong no nonsense leadership. To manage and address those areas too. Filter out the people who don’t deserve opportunity. Eventually it’s people who just want to get on, live life on respectable levels and have an in conjunction mindset mutual understanding of our society.
The left and ideology will do the absolute opposite and damage the ability to evolve. They will cause more division, more hatred by turning people against each other or promoting blame politics.

To return to the topic, I feel many many people have come here for a better life. But these numbers need to stop. We have many people here already and we will most have family’s of our own. If we want a good opportunity for ourselves and our children we must “value” what this Country offers us. Respect it and protect it.
There is no answer to solving the worlds poverty issues. Other than evolution in some way, politically or education.
I don’t think it’s fair people here have the oppression to be sorry for anything. It’s our home and we just want the very best for it. This especially doesn’t make anyone racist as some like to label.
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The only solution I could see would be some utopia where there is world peace. Everyone gets paid the same wage regardless of their job role and country they live in and everyone who is able has a job. Those who are unwilling to conform to this would be the rich, elite and lifelong benefit cases as well as those who don't really understand compassion and empathy and are out for themselves and their own interests.

How is it fair that you have people born into extreme poverty through no choice of their own and others who are born billionaires? A truly level playing field and everyone has access to the same education and belief structure that is we are all human beings and we should be treating everyone with respect, compassion and empathy. The idea of terrorism, murder, rape and the likes should be deleted from the world forever. As should racism.

I honestly don't believe we will ever get there though the rich elite run the world and there is no way they want their bubble to be burst.
 
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Psycho Sonny said:
The only solution I could see would be some utopia where there is world peace. Everyone gets paid the same wage regardless of their job role and country they live in and everyone who is able has a job. Those who are unwilling to conform to this would be the rich, elite and lifelong benefit cases as well as those who don't really understand compassion and empathy and are out for themselves and their own interests.

How is it fair that you have people born into extreme poverty through no choice of their own and others who are born billionaires?
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It certainly seems like you are advocating for communism. The track record for it throughout the 20th century speaks for itself. I get that people, especially young people that struggle to aquire any capital may feel like the system is rigged but to flip it 180 and decide to adopt a system that is responsible for so may deaths isn't a solution anyone with any knowledge of history is going to buy into.

Money out of politics would be a good start thats for sure. But straight up equality of outcome? That's not going to be good for anyone.

Personally I'm going to setup a hobbit like commune and smoke pipework, drink homebrew and dance on tables. Maybe a cool wizard will come and visit one day.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
India is a corrupt country run by those with power and money fir their own benefit.

You can buy a degree from any university.

I'm well aware of this.
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In that case the UK has every right to attempt to mitigate the potential problems arising from corruption and other problems in India.

Including seeking to vet Indian doctors and perhaps to not entirely trust some of the qualifications they gained from Indian institutions.

What you can't do, however, is keep playing the racist card, as if that changes anything at all (it doesn't, even if you think it explains the present situation).

"Britain made India therefore Britain is responsible for corruption in India. Don't criticise the doctors with fake qualifications - you'd do the same in their shoes."

Well where does that reasoning take us? Falling standards (in India too), avoidable deaths (in India too), lawsuits against the NHS no doubt.

I see a lot of anger in your posts, a lot of "Racist! Racist! Ignoramus! Empire did this! Your ancestors did this!"

But apart from that I'm not entirely sure what you want. To blame us for all India's problems, sure, I can see you want that. Perhaps Africa's too.

To allow a migration free-for-all? To allow unqualified doctors to practice in the UK (and India too)? Do you want that?

Or are you just here to vent about Empire and try to lay some of that at the doors of modern Brits?
 
Zatoichi.uK said:
It certainly seems like you are advocating for communism. The track record for it throughout the 20th century speaks for itself.
. . .
But straight up equality of outcome? That's not going to be good for anyone.
. . .
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Ever since Marx and Engels published the Communist Manifesto some 170 years ago, the implementation of ANY form of Communism certainly seems not to have worked out well - for the vast majority of the people who live in an allegedly Communist society.

However, for many people, Capitalism doesn't appear to be the perfect solution either despite its having been developed over a longer period of time.

There must be a better solution somewhere between the two extremes - the Scandinavian countries and perhaps Germany appear to be pursuing a fairer trajectory.


As to equality of outcome, that is clearly an unrealistic nonsense. Equality of opportunity will never work so long as there are such huge disparities in income and wealth. That is what should be tackled, starting with education, housing, health, freedom, food and clean water.

Allowing people to accumulate obscene wealth and power and to use it disproportionately and unfairly to benefit themselves, their families and their supporters is manifestly anti-social and unjust.


FoxEye said:
. . . the UK has every right to attempt to mitigate the potential problems arising from corruption and other problems in India.

Including seeking to vet Indian doctors . . .
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I'm not entirely convinced that ANYONE can just swan up in the UK, claim to be a Medical Practitioner and get to work. I suspect that a certain amount of vetting goes on. I do acknowledge that this "vetting" may be somewhat casually carried out. UK Governments really should have been encouraging more people in the UK to train to be Doctors, Nurses, etc. for years.
 
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stockhausen said:
I'm not entirely convinced that ANYONE can just swan up in the UK, claim to be a Medical Practitioner and get to work. I suspect that a certain amount of vetting goes on. I do acknowledge that this "vetting" may be somewhat casually carried out. UK Governments really should have been encouraging more people in the UK to train to be Doctors, Nurses, etc. for years.
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Of course, and I'm not suggesting Indian doctors should be singled out for special treatment.

The standard should be exacting for all entrants.

Sadly we do know that that (as a rare event) unqualified doctors have entered the UK healthcare system.

If a large number (say 50% as claimed by the BBC) of Indian doctors have fake qualifications, however, that does mean you could potentially see more Indian entrants being rejected, or more entering the healthcare system fraudulently.

Highlighting this potential issue would no doubt lead to some here playing the "racist" card, but I would hope others would see the grave danger here and the necessity of taking appropriate measures to protect safety standards.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
India is a corrupt country run by those with power and money fir their own benefit.

You can buy a degree from any university.

I'm well aware of this.

These are issues stemming from their culture and history. Britain played a huge part in their recent history.

What is it in America, 50% of African American males have a criminal record. That's because of the system put in place by those in power.

The issue is none of you can understand India because you have never lived there. All you see is some news headlines.

I know how things are done over there my uncle was a politician before he passed away and now his son took his place.

When someone needed something done they would take him along. Like getting a license for a shotgun or to buy some land. Of course he would get something out of it.

I remember us going out for the day and there was a police road check going on where they stop every car and if they find anything wrong they ask for money or you go to jail. That money goes in their pockets. He happily stopped and they all knew who he was and didn't check anything instead he chatted with them for a few minutes and we were on our way.

The country works nothing like it does over here. So you cannot hold it to the same standard.

If you were born into a system like that then guess what chances are you too would be corrupt. Just like if you too were born African American in America in a place like Compton you too would have a criminal record.

The people discussing the issue on here have no real clue what they are talking about. Like I said before. You have never walked in their shoes. Judging them by the standards of your own experiences vastly different to theirs.

Its going to take at least a century for India to sort itself out possibly two or three. The problem is that so many are out for themselves because the poverty situation over there is so bad and once you have power it's easy to use it against those beneath your standing.

But please go ahead educate me more on a country I've stayed in for over a year and I speak the lingo and I've been all over goa, bombay, Delhi, agra, all over punjab and uttar pradesh.

No wonder they all want to leave its literally a mess over there. So they seek better lives elsewhere if they can. It's easy to get into the UK if you are a doctor and it's easy to buy a degree. Hell I'd do it if I lived over there.
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What has that got to do with the UK?
Why should the uk accept immigrants or asylum seekers.

if it is so corrupt there then fix it like most west countries did. You think the West just became the west naturally, it was people uprising a lot of deaths by those fighting those in control, uprising that creating laws and sticking to them that made those countries great.

The UK should just close it doors not fund assistance to those who are not British citizens and send them all back.
 
Mrwong said:
What has that got to do with the UK?
Why should the uk accept immigrants
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Because it's economy needs them. Every study shows they take out less and pay more in than average UK folk do. And until Brexit was one of the four freedoms provided as being part of the EU. Those outside of the EU had to apply and gain visa's or are here for study / spouse etc.

Mrwong said:
or asylum seekers.
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Because every comparatively rich, Western country with any conscience does and because the UK is a signatory to the Geneva convention and the European Convention on Human Rights.
By the way Turkey hosts 3.7 million refugees, the UK 126,000 (March 2018).


Mrwong said:
The UK should just close it doors not fund assistance to those who are not British citizens and send them all back.
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The numbers claming asylum in the UK are tiny in the grand scheme of things. The costs of proving for them is tiny. This false narrative of an invasion is just that.


What should be done is every asylum seeker and every UK citizen should have an ID card (like every other EU nation does) so you can track who is legal and who isn't. Who has a right to work and who doesn't. The UK also should have always enforced rules on EU nationals staying when they couldn't support themselves. Again rules fully allowed under EU law and something many other EU countries enact.
 
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Another plane load of inmigrants being held up at the last moment due to overzealous lawyers trying to maximise their income from uk tax payers by lodging useless appeal after appeal.

The lawyers need to be named and shamed, perhaps if their company name was made public and no ome wanted to use them any more they would change their strategy.
 
The Running Man said:
Another plane load of inmigrants being held up at the last moment due to overzealous lawyers trying to maximise their income from uk tax payers by lodging useless appeal after appeal.

The lawyers need to be named and shamed, perhaps if their company name was made public and no ome wanted to use them any more they would change their strategy.
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Perhaps you might consider providing a link to these Daily Mail type scare stories?
 
The Running Man said:
Another plane load of inmigrants being held up at the last moment due to overzealous lawyers trying to maximise their income from uk tax payers by lodging useless appeal after appeal.

The lawyers need to be named and shamed, perhaps if their company name was made public and no ome wanted to use them any more they would change their strategy.
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Yes that’s a fair point. Expose them for what they are doing nationally. I wouldn’t be surprised if it were mainly immigrants providing services for other immigrants. Total abuse of the system in place.

With Pretti Patel doing nothing at the moment, something must change soon.
 
redeye said:
Because it's economy needs them. Every study shows they take out less and pay more in than average UK folk do. And until Brexit was one of the four freedoms provided as being part of the EU. Those outside of the EU had to apply and gain visa's or are here for study / spouse etc.



Because every comparatively rich, Western country with any conscience does and because the UK is a signatory to the Geneva convention and the European Convention on Human Rights.
By the way Turkey hosts 3.7 million refugees, the UK 126,000 (March 2018).




The numbers claming asylum in the UK are tiny in the grand scheme of things. The costs of proving for them is tiny. This false narrative of an invasion is just that.


What should be done is every asylum seeker and every UK citizen should have an ID card (like every other EU nation does) so you can track who is legal and who isn't. Who has a right to work and who doesn't. The UK also should have always enforced rules on EU nationals staying when they couldn't support themselves. Again rules fully allowed under EU law and something many other EU countries enact.
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There is no infrastructure to support people in this country, adding to the population with out having infrastructure to cope will lead problems .

Most reports are carried out with hidden agendas or those that will profit from uncontrollable immigration.

Skill immigration is very different from asylum and most none skilled immigrants.

I’d you don’t have a skill that is needed then you should not be allowed enter ther uk.
 
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