London Bridge Incident

Tefal said:
and iirc last year a course on islam provided by the jails had to be withdrawn when they checked ( you know months after they put it out...) and found that it approved of jihad against non believers and was basically a radicalization course.
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There's this thing called the Quran which approves of jihad against non-believers. No creation of 'training manuals' or left-wing euphemisms required.
 
Hikari Kisugi said:
I wasn't aware internment occurred on the British mainland, and that it was proven effective.
I'd like a source for this.
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Not since WW2, when civilians were locked up.I found this an interesting read:

Internment of civilian nationals belonging to opposing sides was carried out in varying degrees by all belligerent powers in World War Two. It was also the fate of those servicemen who found themselves in a neutral country.

At the outbreak of war there were around 80,000 potential enemy aliens in Britain who, it was feared, could be spies, or willing to assist Britain's enemies in the event of an invasion. All Germans and Austrians over the age of 16 were called before special tribunals and were divided into one of three groups:

  • 'A' - high security risks, numbering just under 600, who were immediately interned;
  • 'B' - 'doubtful cases', numbering around 6,500, who were supervised and subject to restrictions;
  • 'C' - 'no security risk', numbering around 64,000, who were left at liberty. More than 55,000 of category 'C' were recognised as refugees from Nazi oppression. The vast majority of these were Jewish.
The situation began to change in the spring of 1940. The failure of the Norwegian campaign led to an outbreak of spy fever and agitation against enemy aliens. More and more Germans and Austrians were rounded up. Italians were also included, even though Britain was not at war with Italy until June. When Italy and Britain did go to war, there were at least 19,000 Italians in Britain, and Churchill ordered they all be rounded up. This was despite the fact that most of them had lived in Britain for decades.

Thousands of Germans, Austrians and Italians were sent to camps set up at racecourses and incomplete housing estates, such as Huyton outside Liverpool. The majority were interned on the Isle of Man, where internment camps had also been set up in World War One. Facilities were basic, but it was boredom that was the greatest enemy. Internees organised educational and artistic projects, including lectures, concerts and camp newspapers. At first married women were not allowed into the camps to see their husbands, but by August 1940 visits were permitted, and a family camp was established in late 1941.

That many of the 'enemy aliens' were Jewish refugees and therefore hardly likely to be sympathetic to the Nazis, was a complication no one bothered to try and unravel - they were still treated as German and Austrian nationals. In one Isle of Man camp over 80 per cent of the internees were Jewish refugees.

More than 7,000 internees were deported, the majority to Canada, some to Australia. The liner Arandora Star left for Canada on 1 July 1940 carrying German and Italian internees. It was torpedoed and sunk with the loss of 714 lives, most of them internees. Others being taken to Australia on the Dunera, which sailed a week later, were subjected to humiliating treatment and terrible conditions on the two-month voyage. Many had their possessions stolen or thrown overboard by the British military guards.

An outcry in Parliament led to the first releases of internees in August 1940. By February 1941 more than 10,000 had been freed, and by the following summer, only 5,000 were left in internment camps. Many of those released from internment subsequently contributed to the war effort on the Home Front or served in the armed forces.

As regards British citizens interned by the Nazis, in September 1942 the Germans sent 2,000 British-born civilians from the Channel Islands to internment camps in Germany. Another 200 were deported in January 1943, as a reprisal for a British commando raid.

In 1941-2 approximately 130,000 civilians from Allied countries living and working in colonies invaded by the Japanese were interned. These included men, women and children from the Netherlands, the UK, Australia, New Zealand and the USA. The camps varied in size; some were segregated according to gender or race but there were also many camps of mixed gender. One of the largest un-segregated camps was the Stanley internment camp in Hong Kong, which held 2,800 mainly British internees. Unlike prisoners of war, the internees were not compelled to work, but they were held in harsh conditions in primitive camps. Brutality by the Japanese guards was common and death rates were high.

Internment was also carried out in the USA after the Americans entered the war in December 1941. Some 100,000 Japanese-Americans living on the west coast of America were interned, often in very poor conditions.
 
Abraxaz1 said:
Yes instead we should just get used to our children bleeding put cold and alone on the concrete floors. Hell their only white children after all.

Maybe we should start mandatory Islamic classes in all schools and mass convert to Islam. That's what they want after all.

Or we could ban wahhabism being imported into the country, target Isis online propergander.(If anon can do this I'm sure our security teams can)

Or eventually we will start to see an actual backlash, I wonder how much violence can the British people take before enough is enough and mosques start going up in flames?
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I doubt if that will happen. Don't forget that the political wing is much stronger and much more skilled and don't forget weight of numbers. There's well over 3 million Muslims in the UK and the number is rising rapidly. This will go all the way to full conquest, a little at a time. Salami technique. No one step will be large enough to trigger an effective counter. They'll get what they want. Not this year. Not this decade. But they will get it. Hopefully I'll be dead by then.
 
danielanthony said:
I wonder how the IRA used automatic rifles, Semtex and mortars during their campaign but these Jihadi's can only muster up a van and a few kitchen utensils. Not saying cutlery isn't effective, but considering the wider appeal and support base, I thought they would be better organised and equipped.
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If you train someone how to use an automatic weapon or wire up explosives you have useful asset, it makes no sense to use a suicide attack. Those who are prepared to for for their cause/religion aren't concerned with death, that is their ultimate aim.
 
Hikari Kisugi said:
You state it like it is black and white and internment is the only option.
I've already stated that past efforts at internment left more children dead bleeding and subject to violence.
So what is your suggestion?
What would you do?
Who will you 'lock up' how will you keep us safe?

Something needs to be done, many things are being done, I have no answers, you have vitriol, have you any actual suggestions?
The prisons one is probably the best one yet, segregate, and isolate to a degree.
Stop the breeding of extremism within that site, that would be beneficial, but it is only one part to a complex problem.
What else have you got for us?
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Um read the bit about naming wahhabism... make it a hate crime to teach it or support it. A lot of these terrorists are converted by online propaganda (see spelt it right this time) so target that. Force integration, close all religious schools. Religion should be taught outside of school and not as a fundamental inside it.

But that might infringe on the terrorists human rights so I'm sure certain denizens of this forum would be against that.

But I forgot, if your angry at these attacks and not self blaming then there is something fundamentally wrong with you around here.


P.s. it was a spelling mistake via my phone's autocorrect...
 
Angilion said:
I doubt if that will happen. Don't forget that the political wing is much stronger and much more skilled and don't forget weight of numbers. There's well over 3 million Muslims in the UK and the number is rising rapidly. This will go all the way to full conquest, a little at a time. Salami technique. No one step will be large enough to trigger an effective counter. They'll get what they want. Not this year. Not this decade. But they will get it. Hopefully I'll be dead by then.
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I don't disagree with this.
They have 10% of the under 5 population, and 5% of the overall population.
While not all are jihadi and we can be clear, they are not, a population is easily poisoned.
Iran is the state it is, under rule of the 'supreme leader' because of its previous situation, there are not 50% of the people supporting that leader.
The spread isn't all by ISIS with their land capture, their land capture displaces millions across the world, and the knock on effects mean higher population elsewhere for years and in coming years.
The methods of cultural spread are just as effective as their poor military showing.
Marrying with forced conversion, large families, all helps.

Not sure if you can combat that. Its human nature.
 
1. Wipe out Saudi funded Islamic doctrine in this Country
2. Put articulate and intelligent Islamic preachers who are in Prison into solitary confinement. No one can be radicalised without a figurehead.
3. Discourage all religion in Prison and promote Secularism
4. Try to form some kind of quasi state sanctioned Islam headed up by a Secularist that all UK Muslims can refer to as their leader.
5. Close all faith schools. ALL OF THEM!

I can't pretend that I really have the answers but I see there being no 'Catholic Church' or 'Church of England' like Islamic denominations as being a real problem. Islam is a bit of a Wild West of religions. It needs to be regulated. When its regulated and controlled it can then be Secularised and neutralised just like Christianity has been in the UK over the years.
 
Abraxaz1 said:
Um read the bit about naming wahhabism... make it a hate crime to teach it or support it. A lot of these terrorists are converted by online propaganda (see spelt it right this time) so target that. Force integration, close all religious schools. Religion should be taught outside of school and not as a fundamental inside it.
But that might infringe on the terrorists human rights so I'm sure certain denizens of this forum would be against that.
But I forgot, if your angry at these attacks and not self blaming then there is something fundamentally wrong with you around here.
P.s. it was a spelling mistake via my phone's autocorrect...
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I must admit, I missed you point on Wahhabism, either in the post I quoted, or perhaps it was a previous post.
I went to a religious school, a Catholic one. I agree with you, education should be integrated, religious schools should end. My school was an excellent one, with a wonderful education and great moral upbringing but I see them as overall more divisive than good.
Seeking and removing the online stuff is very difficult given the nature of the internet, and the 'more needs to be done by facebook' gubbins that our Amber Rudd trip out isn't the way to do it.
Not sure what is, but there must be alternatives.
Remove materials, source materials, find the source, lock up the source, perhaps.
 
Kill_Phil said:
When did I say remove our rights as humans? My leftie prediction being well and truly answered.

I was on about the joke of an act that is the Human Rights Act that is abused by terrorists to stop deportation and being looked up indefinely. But it's OK I accept most of the country along with yourself will continue to bury your heads in the sand.
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The Human Rights Act applies to humans, not Muslims. Repealing an act that secures our rights as human beings does not solve anything.

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7 days ago I was sat outside the Wheatsheaf pub in Borough Market discussing the events in Manchester. Both myself and my other half's mum were talking about where they would hit next. She said 'it wouldn't surprise me if they went to a place like this, open market crammed with people, no security and can walk in freely'.

How ******* scary. The pic of the guy on the floor with the 'bomb' strapped to him is right next to the seat I was sat in as well. There wasn't anyone near us at the time, but it's extremely spooky :eek:
 
Mayor of London Khan must be having a laugh as minutes after all political parties stop campaigning he says "terrorists won't stop the political process" no not much you complete idiot.
 
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