Soldato
Seems a lot of people getting arrested now as is usually the case wonder if this is a terror cell it obviously a planned attack
Manchester Bombing *** Please remain respectful and refrain from antagonising posts ***
- Thread starter omnomnom
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Seems a lot of people getting arrested now as is usually the case wonder if this is a terror cell it obviously a planned attack
Yes and yes.
The Irish Assembly has the full support of the British government, within that assembly you have known terrorists who planned may have carried out attacks on innocents on both sides of the fence.
The only way it was resolved was a decades work of negotiations and forgetting about pride.
WE NEED TO START DIALOG WITH THESE PEOPLE, not keep putting them in a bigger and bigger box.
I firmly believe it has to start with the Muslim community itself, it probably is but that doesn't make nice headlines for the news papers or politicians with there own political agenda and I guess people would not like the money being diverted into programs to sort out the issue.
The Irish Assembly has the full support of the British government, within that assembly you have known terrorists who planned may have carried out attacks on innocents on both sides of the fence.
The only way it was resolved was a decades work of negotiations and forgetting about pride.
WE NEED TO START DIALOG WITH THESE PEOPLE, not keep putting them in a bigger and bigger box.
I firmly believe it has to start with the Muslim community itself, it probably is but that doesn't make nice headlines for the news papers or politicians with there own political agenda and I guess people would not like the money being diverted into programs to sort out the issue.
/Unrelated
I survived an attempted mugging by two guys on a moped on Monday night off Goswell Road (they tried to pinch my phone), quickly followed by two other people on push bikes trying to mug me again. I flagged down a police car to tell them 10 mins later - the car contained several flustered police officers, who'd been going around in circles all night trying to find these clowns, they looked KNACKERED - apparently there'd been a whole load of calls, and they were getting nowhere in catching them.
I just walked off completely amazed at the lack of resources, you have people riding down pavements hitting people trying to grab their belongings all evening, and literally 1 car going around trying to get them, (this problem has been going on for weeks now)
How the heck are they going to stop organised terrorism, if there simply aren't enough police on the beat, who can catch basic criminals - run before we can walk?
Soldato
they have lost thousands of jobs under May when she was home secretary and now she is Prime Minister
No, most of these people will be released i imagine.
Caporegime
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Spot on, they would say things like:
"Why isn't that money being given to homeless soldiers instead?"
A comment was made about Theresa May in reference to the election - I think her counterpart, is fairly relevant to an election comment - especially as it relates to terrorism.
I wonder if his brother knew. It seems they lived together with the parents back in Libya.
Soldato
Mi5 monitor people not the police
I don't think they have a monopoly on that.
Soldato
bottom line is if you want to keep tabs on suspected terrorists, you need manpower and resources
if you keep cutting funding and making police officers redundant then things get missed an there are consequences
the police and security forces have all the powers they need, they just dont have the numbers or money to do the job to the best of their ability
politicians can give platitudes and wring their hands as much as they want, but they are responsible for the way things are being run and if they want to do something back the police with the funding to make them truly effective and pro-active instead of reacting after the fact
if you keep cutting funding and making police officers redundant then things get missed an there are consequences
the police and security forces have all the powers they need, they just dont have the numbers or money to do the job to the best of their ability
politicians can give platitudes and wring their hands as much as they want, but they are responsible for the way things are being run and if they want to do something back the police with the funding to make them truly effective and pro-active instead of reacting after the fact
but that is why funding has increased for this - I think people are trying to use this to have a complain about austerity but funding for the intelligence services has increased(it was boosted further under Cameron after the Paris attacks), counter terrorism funding has increased
Yup. But for the fact the vast majority of conspiracy theorists are Right-Wing, you'd be seeing far more made of the facts that:-
- Yet another attack just before an election
- It happened despite the attacker being seemingly well-known to authorities and US authorities had named him within a few hours of the attack
- Attack happened day after Right-Wing press ran a barrage of stories painting Corbyn as a terrorist-sympathiser
Soldato
More than you think
nope - for example who was watching the Brazilian guy who was accidentally shot on the tube?
I do somewhat agree with the guy.
If you can prove intent of someone making claims of allegiance or support to terrorism, then they should be immediately detained, deported or imprisoned.
The problem for many people, is that it could create a sort of Guantanamo bay on UK soil, where you have a large number of people in 'legal limbo' who haven't been convicted of anything, locked up potentially indefinitely, for having looked at websites or attending certain dodgy mosques or teachings.
However, maybe it's gotten to the point where the public discomfort of performing such action, is outweighed by the risks of not taking real action - the harsh reality of having the blood of 8 year olds splattered across the walls of a pop concert.
Associate
The problem is that the only real suggestions that are being put out there involve incredibly regressive policies like internment for suspected terrorists.
But you're right that there are things that could be done that *aren't* regressive, but require two things that are hard to come by: increased funding, and changes in attitude. On the first point, it can only be beneficial to increase the funding that is given to the police for counter-terrorism operations. We know that the majority of perpetrators of terror are known to the police for one reason or another -- though not necessarily in a terror context, as per the Westminster attacker -- and more detailed monitoring of potential suspects would at least give us the opportunity to react quickly. We've seen that the police tend to be able to round up accomplices relatively quickly; they likely already have these connections, but without proof that a suspect is about to perpetrate an act of terror, bringing them in can be counterproductive. This is where the second point comes in.
Certain communities (united by language, religion or race) tend to be somewhat insular. The reasons for this are complex, but generally boil down to a reluctance for members of the community to integrate with the wider population, and a reluctance for the wider population to accept them. We're automatically suspicious of people who look different to us, or speak a different language. We often project this suspicion in our body language and our general demeanour so it's unsurprising that integration can be hard. By being open and accepting of these communities, we foster trust and where there's trust there's more likely to be dialogue. If the police start bringing suspected terrorists and their contacts in for questioning left, right and centre, all that will happen is that the rest of that community will become distrustful of the police -- you can see how easily this happens by looking at the USA -- and so when they notice something suspicious or odd about people in their community they will be less likely to report it.
So what I'm saying is that there are things that *everyone* can do to help stop this. Put aside your prejudices about race, religion and country of origin and be welcoming and friendly toward migrants. If we show them that we're able to recognise that there's a difference between them and their subversive elements (in the same way that they presumably don't assume we're all rapists or murderers even though those elements exist in our society) then they'll be less likely to believe the propaganda that they're fed from those subversive elements. Unfortunately attitudes are hard to change, and while we have the power to do it ourselves, I'm not convinced there's the will.