Motorsport Off Topic Thread

Mr Jack said:
I think being upset because someone used a naughty word is a childish relic of a more puritanical era. I'm not saying that kids TV should be swearing all the time but the idea that it is scandalous to hear someone swear is daft, almost as daft as referring to the word as an F-bomb as if it was some devastating thing.



Indeed, and the UK is far from the most puritanical country in this regard so I think it's fair enough for FOM/FIA to regulate this stuff. It is getting broadcast around the world to markets with differing notions of acceptability, and I think most teams and drivers are smart enough to realise this but we should also recognise that a lot of drivers are speaking a second or third language and may not be entirely down with what is or isn't acceptable* and I don't think it was really necessary to go for a penalty beyond a fine in this case. However, I suspect it has only really caused a problem because of wider issues in governance.

* - There's actually interesting research into taboos and second languages: people actually find it much easier to discuss taboo subjects in a second language than a first, because they haven't had the same associations indoctrinated into them as a child and despite the commonality of meaning of words.
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Christ he only used the 's' word, not the 'f' or even the 'c', for some it's almost like Max has murdered someone.
However the iisue is the manner in which the FIA dealt with it by by punishing him in the way they did was definitely ott. They could just as easily talked about it accepted his apology not to do it again then punished him further if he did.
But it's Max isn't it so we'll leave that one there.
 
Feek said:
No, you're wrong. He said that the car is ******. The first letter there being an f.
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Was this clarified then, sorry didn't read the response to my post.
However, unlike Ben Sulayem, the 'public' aren't really bothered about swearing on tv:
www.ofcom.org.uk

Public attitudes towards offensive language on TV and radio revealed

Viewers and listeners have told Ofcom they are generally more relaxed about most swearing on TV and radio, particularly if it is accidental and an apology swiftly follows, according to our latest in-depth research study.
www.ofcom.org.uk www.ofcom.org.uk

Sorry I should have said that the British public couldn't give a **** about swearing on tv..
 
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Swearing in the media and on tv isn't really a taboo in the Netherlands. It isn't bleeped out either, their F1 commentators (Olav Mol in particular) swears all the time. He probably grew up with it. Jos and his antics probably didn't help either :o
 
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cuke2u said:
Was this clarified then
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Find a video on YouTube called "Max Verstappen ANGRY RESPONSE to the FIA after got told to not swear"

It's a garbage video but can't find a sensibly edited one with all the waffling about the F word not being that bad.

Can't link it here because it contains the F word.

Edit - this has it all but the F word is fully beeped.

 
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cuke2u said:
However, unlike Ben Sulayem, the 'public' aren't really bothered about swearing on tv:
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The public probably aren't really bothered about speeding but it's still not allowed.

The bottom line is that if you don't adhere to the regulations set by most of the countries the programme is aired in, you're going to be punished. That's what the FIA are enforcing here.
 
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cuke2u said:
Christ he only used the 's' word, not the 'f' or even the 'c', for some it's almost like Max has murdered someone.
However the iisue is the manner in which the FIA dealt with it by by punishing him in the way they did was definitely ott. They could just as easily talked about it accepted his apology not to do it again then punished him further if he did.
But it's Max isn't it so we'll leave that one there.
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As usual with Max it isn't the actual act (the swearing) that annoy people. It's his petulant childish reactions afterwards when things don't go his way.

cuke2u said:
Was this clarified then, sorry didn't read the response to my post.
However, unlike Ben Sulayem, the 'public' aren't really bothered about swearing on tv:
www.ofcom.org.uk

Public attitudes towards offensive language on TV and radio revealed

Viewers and listeners have told Ofcom they are generally more relaxed about most swearing on TV and radio, particularly if it is accidental and an apology swiftly follows, according to our latest in-depth research study.
www.ofcom.org.uk www.ofcom.org.uk

Sorry I should have said that the British public couldn't give a **** about swearing on tv..
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I don't think that article quite backs up your point as you think.

Participants in the study felt that, in line with freedom of expression, offensive words can be used to create dramatic impact, bring humour, reflect real life, or even to inform and educate.

They had limited concerns so long as the strongest language was broadcast after the watershed and parents were given sufficient warnings and information to help them decide what their children see and hear.
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It doesn't say swearing, it says "offensive language" which opens it up to words other than swearing. Also, given the request for warnings, are you suggesting F1 should rather come with a warning about swearing rather than simply asking the drivers to show some self restraint and not swear in press conferences? I appreciate that when under the stress of driving swearing may be more prevalent but then there's more control over what radio messages are broadcast than in a live press event.
 
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Greboth said:
As usual with Max it isn't the actual act (the swearing) that annoy people. It's his petulant childish reactions afterwards when things don't go his way.



I don't think that article quite backs up your point as you think.



It doesn't say swearing, it says "offensive language" which opens it up to words other than swearing. Also, given the request for warnings, are you suggesting F1 should rather come with a warning about swearing rather than simply asking the drivers to show some self restraint and not swear in press conferences? I appreciate that when under the stress of driving swearing may be more prevalent but then there's more control over what radio messages are broadcast than in a live press event.
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We all have our own interpretation of what language is offensive and was isn't, some of the language used in this forum could easily be deemed highly 'offensive' and not necessarily swearing. However the article does state swearing, not offensive language. https://photos.app.goo.gl/bMKX8xcir97sfJ177 But I'm not defending Max's use of language in that particular scenario, more that the punishment was far too severe and the drivers do agree so we'll see where this one rolls. https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...talks-max-verstappen-swearing-row-motor-sport
 
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There is literally no need ever to swear at all if being asked such a mundane question in a press interview, what is wrong with "the car feels like a bag of bolts" or "piece of trash will be lucky to get me 3rd"

I feel sorry for people who think that foul language uttered for no reason to a global audience is acceptable, can't imagine what it must be like around their dinner tables, uncouth and uncalled for.
 
Greboth said:
As usual with Max it isn't the actual act (the swearing) that annoy people. It's his petulant childish reactions afterwards when things don't go his way.
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This. I’ll defend drivers using whatever language they want on the radio (although I hate them blaming their team etc. ) but when you’ve been asked not to swear in a press conference, that should be 100% straight forward.

Footballers are the biggest muppets on the planet and can’t be trusted not to swear on the pitch, yet even they manage not to swear in their post game interviews. If they can do it, an F1 driver can do it in a press conference that doesn’t even happen on race day.

If Max had a sense of humour, he’d have used some nice words like mother-flippin’, fudged etc. But no…
 
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Journey said:
There is literally no need ever to swear at all if being asked such a mundane question in a press interview, what is wrong with "the car feels like a bag of bolts" or "piece of trash will be lucky to get me 3rd"

I feel sorry for people who think that foul language uttered for no reason to a global audience is acceptable, can't imagine what it must be like around their dinner tables, uncouth and uncalled for.
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Don't watch Drive to Survive as it's full of it and the editing is done deliberately to enhance the swearing. Don't listen to many interviews of Steiner either. Some seem to conveniently forget that F1 one is rife with language being used in inappropriate situations and when broadcast live. They were never punished in the same way.
Max is no different and he's been treated unfairly but it's the usuat picking on Max because some have their own personal agenda with him, others just make it up as they go along.
 
cuke2u said:
Don't watch Drive to Survive as it's full of it and the editing is done deliberately to enhance the swearing.
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Which isn't broadcast live and specifically has a maturity rating that references "Language"

cuke2u said:
Don't listen to many interviews of Steiner either.
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I'm fairly sure he never swears in Live TV Interviews.

cuke2u said:
Some seem to conveniently forget that F1 one is rife with language being used in inappropriate situations and when broadcast live.
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Aside from the delayed and censored Team Radio, I can't remember the last time I heard uncensored language broadcast live on F1.

cuke2u said:
Max is no different and he's been treated unfairly but it's the usuat picking on Max because some have their own personal agenda with him, others just make it up as they go along.
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So you have no agenda? Seems a lot like you are defending him unnecessarily.
 
Armageus said:
Which isn't broadcast live and specifically has a maturity rating that references "Language"


I'm fairly sure he never swears in Live TV Interviews.


Aside from the delayed and censored Team Radio, I can't remember the last time I heard uncensored language broadcast live on F1.


So you have no agenda? Seems a lot like you are defending him unnecessarily.
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I already stated I'm not defending his behaviour, please read back, it is the punishment that doesn't fit the crime.
Come on though Steiner has a reputation for 'fruity' language in live interviews to the point that when Sky was interviewing him they reminded him every time it was live. So has Gerhard Berger and in fact many other F1 drivers have used 'inappropriate' language in live interviews.
Max made an error and apologised for it yet some wish to tar and feather him.
He also has the support of the GPDA https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...talks-max-verstappen-swearing-row-motor-sport I quote from Wurz: "How many lifetime community services would Guenther Steiner have to serve for using the F word?” Wurz told Formel1.de. “He was glorified for using the F word."

It doesn't matter if it is live or recorded either as F1 is still being represented.
 
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Thought this was quite interesting, specifically around why Merc had correlation issues between the wind tunnel, CFD and on track. Such a simple thing but major consequences.

Also shows the significance of reduced wind tunnel and CFD time as a leading team - we're probably seeing this now with RB, made even worse by the cost cap penalty.

 
I saw that too, good vid.

It's also very indicative that the new policy of restricting development time of the best performing teams is having an effect. Up until 2020 the best performing teams were all in a positive feedback loop of 'do well > get more money > spend all the money > do better > get more money...'. Which ended up in huge spells of dominance. With the cost cap and development restrictions the teams performances are all starting to converge now, which is fantastic IMO. It'll be interesting to see if McLaren can keep their advantage next year if they lose 5-10% (can't remember specifics) of their dev time. Likewise, if RB can raise their game.
 
GravyMonster said:
I saw that too, good vid.

It's also very indicative that the new policy of restricting development time of the best performing teams is having an effect. Up until 2020 the best performing teams were all in a positive feedback loop of 'do well > get more money > spend all the money > do better > get more money...'. Which ended up in huge spells of dominance. With the cost cap and development restrictions the teams performances are all starting to converge now, which is fantastic IMO. It'll be interesting to see if McLaren can keep their advantage next year if they lose 5-10% (can't remember specifics) of their dev time. Likewise, if RB can raise their game.
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This is also why I don’t think RB are too worried about coming 3rd in the WCC.
 
cuke2u said:
Don't watch Drive to Survive as it's full of it and the editing is done deliberately to enhance the swearing. Don't listen to many interviews of Steiner either. Some seem to conveniently forget that F1 one is rife with language being used in inappropriate situations and when broadcast live. They were never punished in the same way.
Max is no different and he's been treated unfairly but it's the usuat picking on Max because some have their own personal agenda with him, others just make it up as they go along.
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Couldn't comment, it's not live TV and I don't watch that sort of trash ;)
 
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