New World MMO

[Throrik]

At this rate WoW will become popular again. Anyone rolling on Season of Mastery?

I mean, it's fairly comical to say that WoW isn't still one of the most popular MMOs regardless of what you think of it, or the company. Yeah it's not at the level of 12 million active subs these days, but it's still going really strong. People are so quick to chant dead game because something drops off slightly. Don't see any other 17 year old MMOs with the amount of players that it still has.

 

[jonneymendoza]

I mean, it's fairly comical to say that WoW isn't still one of the most popular MMOs regardless of what you think of it, or the company. Yeah it's not at the level of 12 million active subs these days, but it's still going really strong. People are so quick to chant dead game because something drops off slightly. Don't see any other 17 year old MMOs with the amount of players that it still has.

Eve online says hello

 

[.Lethal]

I mean, it's fairly comical to say that WoW isn't still one of the most popular MMOs regardless of what you think of it, or the company. Yeah it's not at the level of 12 million active subs these days, but it's still going really strong. People are so quick to chant dead game because something drops off slightly. Don't see any other 17 year old MMOs with the amount of players that it still has.

It's going strong due to the financial success from it's microtransactions, that's not great from a player perspective at all. The active/daily player base today is approx. 1 million where as FFIX has 3.3 million.

Out of that million active players how many even log into main WoW? With Classic and SoM it's absolutely less.

 

[Malevolence]

Don't see any other 17 year old MMOs with the amount of players that it still has.

I've been playing EVE since 2003. That's 18 years.

 

[Throrik]

Eve online says hello

I've been playing EVE since 2003. That's 18 years.

I don't know about EVE Online's active numbers, but I didn't say there wasn't other MMOs which have been around longer that still aren't played. I doubt EVE has as many active players as WoW regardless. EVE is a very niche game and great for that.

It's going strong due to the financial success from it's microtransactions, that's not great from a player perspective at all. The active/daily player base today is approx. 1 million where as FFIX has 3.3 million.

Out of that million active players how many even log into main WoW? With Classic and SoM it's absolutely less.

Depends, they don't release those numbers but their MAU count is up - and it's definitely still more popular than most MMOs regardless of any shenanigans people want to look at. They don't release active account numbers so any data people get are purely guesswork. Anyway don't want to derail the thread anymore, just pointing out that people who say WoW isn't 'popular' anymore are deluded and are putting their feelings ahead of facts.

 

[.Lethal]

Depends, they don't release those numbers but their MAU count is up - and it's definitely still more popular than most MMOs regardless of any shenanigans people want to look at. They don't release active account numbers so any data people get are purely guesswork. Anyway don't want to derail the thread anymore, just pointing out that people who say WoW isn't 'popular' anymore are deluded and are putting their feelings ahead of facts.

Mate, there are some pretty good systems out there that gather data on player activity that correlate to other MMOs and it's published player activity. You're in denial over a game you're passionate about.

EVE doesn't have WoW's numbers, or anywhere near it. But it does well for a game coming up to 20 years old.

MMO player engagement overall is the worst it's ever been, with exception of Final Fantasy doing well currently.

 

[Throrik]

Mate, there are some pretty good systems out there that gather data on player activity that correlate to other MMOs and it's published player activity. You're in denial over a game you're passionate about.

EVE doesn't have WoW's numbers, or anywhere near it. But it does well for a game coming up to 20 years old.

Wouldn't say I'm particularly passionate about WoW these days, I just don't look at FF being the messiah. I agree EVE is doing amazing, I never said anything contrary, you seem to be making assumptions that I am saying things that I'm not. I don't spend my time looking at systems which scrape data which isn't necessarily accurate, after all why would I? I couldn't care less if FF has 4m and WoW only has 1m and NW has 500k. Hell I still play Rift every now and then and that probably has less than 5k players on average. WoW simply does not publish active WoW player data, I don't know if FF14 does, it's not an MMO I have invested much time in since the original game.

MMO player engagement overall is the worst it's ever been, with exception of Final Fantasy doing well currently.

I don't disagree, it's been on a downward trend - but to say FF is the only MMO doing well currently is farcical, it's simply not true. FF14, WoW, ESO, GW2 all doing fairly well, although it depends how you define well I guess. You cannot however deny Activision Blizzard's earnings are up based and their MMO game(s) are continuing to increase monetarily therefore does not not define it being a success regardless of your opinion on anything such as micro-transactions, issues with the game, company or thoughts otherwise. I personally haven't purchased a single micro-transaction from them in years, I don't pay real currency to play it now anyway.

 

[.Lethal]

Wouldn't say I'm particularly passionate about WoW these days, I just don't look at FF being the messiah. I agree EVE is doing amazing, I never said anything contrary, you seem to be making assumptions that I am saying things that I'm not. I don't spend my time looking at systems which scrape data which isn't necessarily accurate, after all why would I? I couldn't care less if FF has 4m and WoW only has 1m and NW has 500k. Hell I still play Rift every now and then and that probably has less than 5k players on average. WoW simply does not publish active WoW player data, I don't know if FF14 does, it's not an MMO I have invested much time in since the original game.

I don't disagree, it's been on a downward trend - but to say FF is the only MMO doing well currently is farcical, it's simply not true. FF14, WoW, ESO, GW2 all doing fairly well, although it depends how you define well I guess. You cannot however deny Activision Blizzard's earnings are up based and their MMO game(s) are continuing to increase monetarily therefore does not not define it being a success regardless of your opinion on anything such as micro-transactions, issues with the game, company or thoughts otherwise. I personally haven't purchased a single micro-transaction from them in years, I don't pay real currency to play it now anyway.

I feel you're passionate about WoW because nobody otherwise would talk about it's financial success as a measure of a games state, this feels like it's reinforced by your replies. If you don't care about a games player base, why do you take the time to read how Blizzard Activision are doing as a business? Unless you're a big fan, or an investor.

Every product and service has a lifecycle. WoW peaked with WotLK. GW, ESO and almost every other big MMO haven't reached numbers it had in previous years. Final Fantasy on the other hand is going through it's highest peaks yet, therefore it is one of the only MMO games currently doing well in terms of active player engagement which players and the companies (normally) use to measure how successful a game currently is. You can argue with me all you want about how WoW is doing monetarily, but I'd argue as a player that a companies financial success isn't a reflection of a games active player base and overall quality of service.

I'm not saying WoW is dead, but I'm sure a lot of the former employees who have lost their jobs in the last few years, partly due to on-going decline in subscribers and consequently quality of service would tell you otherwise.

 

[Throrik]

I'm not saying WoW is dead, but I'm sure a lot of the former employees who have lost their jobs in the last few years, partly due to on-going decline in subscribers and consequently quality of service would tell you otherwise.

Let's not kid ourselves, the loss of jobs has zero to do with any form of WoW Subscription numbers, or anything like that, it's because Activison Blizzard is a scumbag company who care more about their profits than anything else, and they know that people will play the games regardless of support staff, or back-office staff.

I feel you're passionate about WoW because nobody otherwise would talk about it's financial success as a measure of a games state, this feels like it's reinforced by your replies. If you don't care about a games player base, why do you take the time to read how Blizzard Activision are doing as a business? Unless you're a big fan, or an investor.

On the contrary, I simply read one news amalgamation site every now and then, and they condense the earnings call's every quarter. Hardly passionate about it whilst reading a website for a few minutes every few weeks. You seem to read far more into my replies than are there, I haven't said that I don't care about the games player base. In an ideal world I would love to see multiple MMOs thriving at their peak, but that time passed long ago when FF14 was such a bad game they just ended up starting from scratch. At the end of the day, it's basic economics, if a game doesn't make money it's not successful in an MMO world. WoW is making money therefore successful...

Every product and service has a lifecycle. WoW peaked with WotLK. GW, ESO and almost every other big MMO haven't reached numbers it had in previous years. Final Fantasy on the other hand is going through it's highest peaks yet, therefore it is one of the only MMO games currently doing well in terms of active player engagement which players and the companies (normally) use to measure how successful a game currently is. You can argue with me all you want about how WoW is doing monetarily, but I'd argue as a player that a companies financial success isn't a reflection of a games active player base and overall quality of service.

Again, I don't disagree, and find it difficult to see from my posts where you seem to think that I am saying this? WoW indeed peaked with WoTLK and no MMO has ever reached such highs since (I don't believe, but may be wrong) and probably never will because that was a different time. You also seem to keep going on about FF going through it's highest peak or whatever, nobody is denying that? I am just simply saying that you said that WoW is not popular, and you're just wrong, you can't deny this unless you deny basic facts. I'm glad FF14 is doing well, it's a great game. Same reason I'm glad that WoW is still going, I have issues with the company behind it, but the game holds some very good memories. I'm happy that LoTRO is still going for the same reason, I'm not happy that Rift isn't doing well, I'm happy that ESO is doing well, EVE too despite it not being my sort of game. I hope NW gets better, although I find it hugely amusing from all the FF14 players mocking the New World launch/initial experience when they had such a bad experience that they literally recreated the game because it was so, so bad.

 

[.Lethal]

Let's not kid ourselves, the loss of jobs has zero to do with any form of WoW Subscription numbers, or anything like that, it's because Activison Blizzard is a scumbag company who care more about their profits than anything else, and they know that people will play the games regardless of support staff, or back-office staff.

It absolutely does. How do you think Blizzard Activision make the money they do? Without their French offices and declining number of employees there’s less expenses and more profits for its shareholders whilst they milk what’s little left from the player base. Every little bit is being squeezed from every little crevice.

I didn’t say WoW wasn’t a popular MMO by today’s standards, nor claim FF to be the messiah. I backed my opinions with what matters most which is the growth of its player base, which most MMOs aren’t able to do for one reason or another.

Anyway a lot of what you’ve said I can agree with, for now WoW is one of the most popular MMOs but it’s also a lot closer in line with a few others and no longer the most active. The way it’s heading though there’s no denying it’s in an on going slow decline.

Side note, I actually think WoWs record numbers will be beaten someday. Records are broken eventually.

 

[Throrik]

It absolutely does. How do you think Blizzard Activision make the money they do? Without their French offices and declining number of employees there’s less expenses and more profits for its shareholders whilst they milk what’s little left from the player base. Every little bit is being squeezed from every little crevice..

Yet they have record numbers of developers and designers and increasing top-end salaries. How does one explain that? Support and back-office is the first thing to go in 'restructuring' and consolidating etc.

 

[.Lethal]

Yet they have record numbers of developers and designers and increasing top-end salaries. How does one explain that? Support and back-office is the first thing to go in 'restructuring' and consolidating etc.

Yeah I’ve read that comment from what was it J Allen Brack? Unfortunately nobody knows the real number as the total employees include those from Activision but if we look at the cuts in 2018 9.9k employees it hasn’t recovered since at 9.5k

 

[Throrik]

Yeah I’ve read that comment from what was it J Allen Brack? Unfortunately nobody knows the real number as the total employees include those from Activision but if we look at the cuts in 2018 9.9k employees it hasn’t recovered since at 9.5k

Not 100% sure myself, but I haven't separated Activation from Blizzard for a long time now to be honest. The rose tinted goggles let me remember Blizzard as they were, despite the reality probably being quite different. I just know that large companies never put a focus on customer support and constantly cut costs in those departments.

 

[Draven]

I've sunk over 100 hours into this and gotta say it got boring and repetitiveness pretty quickly,I kept on with it and persevered hoping things would change as I went through the levels but no,as a result stopped playing now,the currency dupe problems was the last nail in the coffin for me with this game,will go back to it in a few months to see if any significant changes have been made,and please introduce mounts this game is desperate for them,tired of running about everywhere!

 

[Temujin]

I've sunk over 100 hours into this and gotta say it got boring and repetitiveness pretty quickly,I kept on with it and persevered hoping things would change as I went through the levels but no,as a result stopped playing now,the currency dupe problems was the last nail in the coffin for me with this game,will go back to it in a few months to see if any significant changes have been made,and please introduce mounts this game is desperate for them,tired of running about everywhere!

Agree on most points, exactly my experience and will probably go back in some months to check it out.
Don't hold your breath on mounts though, you can basically run the length/width of the map in 10-20 minutes so IMO it's not a matter of map size in so much that it's the constant running back and forth to the same places to complete a meaningless side quest in about 1-5 minutes!

 

[Draven]

yes agree your right its the constant backwards and forwards all the dam time,mounts qould make this a lot less tedious imo although like you say I'm definitely not holding my breath

 

[~Divine~Wind~]

Already abandoned this three weeks ago, glad I got out when I did. This is all a massive beta test.

I'm starting to feel this way as well

On release I hammered it, now I just cba to log in lol

What's the point in putting so much effort into gathering, crafting, levelling crafting when the resultant items have been duped to ***** and sold on the AH for a few K Gold :/
I played one PVP MMO (RF Online) a long ass time ago and that game did (ime) really well when it came to support and stuff early on.
Then came a server squish, then came the exploits, then the duping started and you had whole guilds running around in heavily upgraded gear that most couldn't even attempt.

It was just like a "compounded?" benefit, everything from that point on they had an advantage over most normal players and I see this as no different.

The ones that have been caught appear to have been given short (if any suspensions) you've got streamers on twitch that were "supported/recommended" (not sure of the right phrase) by amazon for this game... and they too were using exploits and stuff clear as day on stream.

The games only been out what a month? And it's already showing notable decline (My server was nigh on empty last night)
Now don't get me wrong, I understand MMO and hitting max means people will be logging in less, maybe for a dungeon or so here and there but it just doesnt hit me as normal.

I've said I woudlnt go back to MMOs for a long time now but after dipping my toe Im tempted to have a look at others haha

As a player that quite often enjoys crafting on most games, dont' get me started on the limited storage space, azoth cost to travel and olde wordle style 20min walks across maps. Mounts are needed and they need to get shot of the daft azoth system or raise the cap.

 

[arknor]

doesn't wow only have 2mil subscribers these days? it's pretty much dead compared to the good old days of 12-24mil subs

 

[C Kent]

doesn't wow only have 2mil subscribers these days? it's pretty much dead compared to the good old days of 12-24mil subs

No one knows, bellular did a video recently where they extrapolated various participation numbers to have a guess (raiding, m+, level cap characters) and he put it at around 1.4 mill. Who knows, as long as the money keeps rolling in from microtransactions do actiblizz care about sub numbers? Probably not.

 

[Tombstone]

Its such a shame really that New World has ended up like this. As those who have followed the thread know, I had some serious reservations after playing beta and announced on here that I would not buy at release but would keep an eye on things and see how the population and game was faring on December 31st, after being out for ~3 months before making a buying decision. Very sadly its looking like that was a wise decision and unless there is a significant turn around in the next month it doesnt even look like I will need to wait until December 31st to complete my decision.

Its a real pity, the MMO genre has always been my favourite genre but its probably suffering more than ever at the moment and I fear for its future. The consolation that I do have is that I was around and experienced the "golden age" of MMOs, from 1997 to 2005 (UO, EQ1, AC1, DAOC, SWG, Year 1 of WoW) , those years had gaming experiences like no other that I have ever experienced since so at least I am glad I was there for that. I hope that something comes along to revive/reinvigorate the MMORPG genre but right at the moment its looking bleak for the future of the genre, perhaps its just a style of game which has run its course and had its time.