Not what to do in the wet!!

Dolph · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:17

saitrix said:
Depends if you know how much opposite lock to put on. Turn it enough so your fronts are pointing in the same direction as movement and they will gain grip back easier. Then you can bring the steering back into turning into the corner to carry on going round.

You don't need much opposite lock generally to correct a slide, as Lowe said the biggest thing you need to do is get the power back on.

The main reason a car oversteers is because the front of the car is moving slower than the back (for whatever reason) and breaks traction, in the case of the 306 aided by the suspension design that makes it very prone to sudden, violent snap oversteer, especially in poor conditions or on greasy roads (and given the heat over the last week or so, followed by rain, that's exactly what the roads would be).

Pointing the wheels straight, or slightly into the slide and accelerating is, in all but the most extreme cases, enough to get the back into line again. Too much opposite lock will bring the back end into line then cause it to snap the other way in a fishtail as you try and correct it. By speeding up the front of the car you stop the back wanting to overtake and it comes back into it's normal following line.

I would also add that (despite the description given by the OP) it wasn't caused by getting on the power too early, unless he got on the power then lifted off again. It would have been caused by either braking too late into the corner or lifting off at the wrong point (possibly after he had started accelerating). A FWD car will never step it's back end out caused by power...

Edit: Just to make sure it's clear, the above techniques for slides apply to FWD cars only...

Kingy · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:17

[TW]Fox said:
It's a 30mph residential zone. What do you expect us to say? You don't roll your car doing 30mph in a residential zone, you roll it by lifting off in a corner after you realise your entry speed was a tad high, unsettling the rear of the car, and inducing oversteer.

Most of us here have a laugh when the time is right but not in an area like that. You were lucky not to have killed yourself or somebody else. Please do us all a favour and buy a Fiesta 1.1.

Come on Fox, it's hardly 'residential'. It's an on-camber corner leading into an NSL straight, are you honestly professing to have never geared up to accelerating out of a similar corner?

The guy made a (daft) mistake, we've all been there, his was just unlucky/lucky, depending on how you look at it.

Serj · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:19

[TW]Fox said:
Please can you not use personal attacks in Motors. Try and get your point across in a more mature way

Sorry, just thought it was ridiculous way to describe a common driving technique.

[TW]Fox · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:20

Kingy said:
Come on Fox, it's hardly 'residential'. It's an on-camber corner leading into an NSL straight

Are we looking at different photographs? It's a sharp bend, in a village, with houses. Sure, it becomes NSL several hundred yards after the corner but thats not REALLY relevant, is it...

I don't believe it was caused by him 'powering' out of the corner, it wouldnt unsettle the car in such a way that could cause that to happen. I think he tanked it into the corner, thought argghg, jumped off the accelerator, etc.

squiffy · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:22

Serj said:
Boy racer? Valid or not - personal insults are not tollerated. FF.

I've seen plenty of boy racers who've completed the turn who "burn rubber" straight out the turn, and lose it due to traction. There's safe acceleration and being a there's being a unsafe driver.

Serj · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:24

squiffy said:
I've seen plenty of boy racers who've completed the turn who "burn rubber" straight out the turn, and lose it due to traction. There's safe acceleration and being a there's being a unsafe driver.

If that's how you define a boy racer then fair enough. I always thought a boy racer was someone with a chavved up car who performs handbrake turns in car parks.

agw_01 · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:24

squiffy said:
I've seen plenty of boy racers who've completed the turn who "burn rubber" straight out the turn, and lose it due to traction. There's safe acceleration and being a there's being a unsafe driver.

They're just idiots, who plant their foot mid corner.

I'll keep even pressure on the throttle during the corner, and then once I've straightened the wheels up will put my foot down.

People who plant their foot mid corner are just asking for trouble.

Gilly · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:25

agw_01 said:
People who plant their foot mid corner are just asking for trouble.

...or are doing it on purpose for a controlled result

Zaf · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:25

Kingy said:
Come on Fox, it's hardly 'residential'. It's an on-camber corner leading into an NSL straight, are you honestly professing to have never geared up to accelerating out of a similar corner?

The guy made a (daft) mistake, we've all been there, his was just unlucky/lucky, depending on how you look at it.

cheers Kingy for sticking up for me there granted it was a very daft mistake. I cant really remember what happend exactly but I think I lost back end quite abit after the corner not sure how I would manage to do this tho might of done a 360(prob dremt that part but having vague recolection) after I hit the curb head on passenger side went into that stone gate post which fipped the car over on a pivot

Kingy · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:25

[TW]Fox said:
Are we looking at different photographs? It's a sharp bend, in a village, with houses. Sure, it becomes NSL several hundred yards after the corner but thats not REALLY relevant, is it...

I don't believe it was caused by him 'powering' out of the corner, it wouldnt unsettle the car in such a way that could cause that to happen. I think he tanked it into the corner, thought argghg, jumped off the accelerator, etc.

My point was that doing 'over 30' in such a corner on the exit from the village is hardly obscene. His mistake was stamping on the brakes mid corner, not playing in the first place imo.

agw_01 · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:26

Gilly said:
...or are doing it on purpose for a controlled result

Ah yes, that as well

L0rdMike · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:26

Kingy said:
My point was that doing 'over 30' in such a corner on the exit from the village is hardly obscene.

Obviously it was as it had been raining.

Gilly · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:27

agw_01 said:
Ah yes, that as well

Though in the wet in a 30 isn't the greatest place to be doing that

Zaf · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:29

[TW]Fox said:
I don't believe it was caused by him 'powering' out of the corner, it wouldnt unsettle the car in such a way that could cause that to happen. I think he tanked it into the corner, thought argghg, jumped off the accelerator, etc.

I was doing under 30 as a lady driver in a mini was following me and said I wasn't speeding. I prob did enter the corner to fast for the road conditions tho

All I can say is i'm going to live by my mistake and very lucky me or anyone else wasn't hurt

Zaf · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:30

Kingy said:
My point was that doing 'over 30' in such a corner on the exit from the village is hardly obscene. His mistake was stamping on the brakes mid corner, not playing in the first place imo.

I stamped on the breaks well after the corner when I was going up the curb

Kingy · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:31

Zaf said:
cheers Kingy for sticking up for me there granted it was a very daft mistake. I cant really remember what happend exactly but I think I lost back end quite abit after the corner not sure how I would manage to do this tho might of done a 360(prob dremt that part but having vague recolection) after I hit the curb head on passenger side went into that stone gate post which fipped the car over on a pivot

What rubber did you have on?

This is why I have Eagle F1's on mine, I'd feel such a male hen if I stacked it due to something that could have been avoided with better rubber on.

The other thing I took out of my oversteer in the wet case (wasn't playing incidentally) was to learn a bit more about why it happened. Mistakes happen once, not learning is stupidity imo.

Zaf · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:32

Kingy said:
What rubber did you have on?

To be honest i've got no idea

Trick · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:52

Glad to hear you're ok Zaf, looks nasty. As non of us know the full circumstances I'd ignore the OcUK keyboard warrior brigade and just take on board the sensible advice; count this one as a lucky escape and valuable experience. Hope you get back on the road soon.

[TW]Fox · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:53

Trick said:
I'd ignore the OcUK keyboard warrior brigade

No, no no, you got the wrong brigade. The keyboard warrior brigade are OcUK's own band of wannabe vigilantes, ready to go out and beat people up with keyboards for looking at them the wrong way.

This thread features an altogether more fearless team - OcUK accident investigation, or 'OcUK see through the excuses for monging it up team'

Chocki · 19 Jun 2006 at 17:55

Glad your OK. It was probably worn shock absorbers. I had a car where the back end snapped out on a mountain road in wales, I admit I was going a tad quick, but got it back OK, then it went again going around a roundabout and I ended up facing the wrong way!, but OK. got new shocks and could take both the corner and the roundabout faster without any problems after that!.

I know it's not going to help much now, but just remember for future reference, if the back starts to step out on a front wheel drive car, check the state of the shocks.