Number plates for cyclists...

GreatAuk said:
I'd be more interested in number plates for electric scooters tbh.
1. The riders seem to pull much more dangerous stunts than cyclists.
2. It would help with the appalling visibility from behind (especially in the dark, those tiny little dull red lights at ground level are seriously rubbish for making them visible, and not all of them even have those lights).
Click to expand...

They need to make them legal first.
Anybody who rides an unlicensed one on public highways is breaking the law.
 
The time the police would have to spend pulling people over with illegal plates as they don't want the drag penalty would be worth seeing :D
 
MadMossy said:
Unfortunately there are some idiot cyclists around, but no where near as many as their are idiot drivers. Suffice to say that cyclist that ran a red light and wacked you with his bag, probably runs red lights in his car also, eventually he or she will get caught, the issue is that if they do it in a car and hit someone, that person has a far greater chance of not surviving it. I think in all instances of a cyclist hitting a pedestrian, the pedestrian has either died or been seriously injured as a result of hitting their head on the pavement or road. They absolutely should be accountable and in most situations specially in build up areas, they almost always are due to the prevalence of CCTV with big brother always watching. Like the young lad who hit that elderly lady not too long ago, he wasn't caught because of a number plate or registration, it was good old fashioned CCTV and detective work. The former would have just made the process a little faster.
Click to expand...
It should all be equal, we can’t have a shift towards a hierarchy of vulnerability and not apply the same extra rigour to cyclists or it makes a mockery of the idea of the hierachy..

But I get this sense of entitlement and wanting your cake and eat it from those so pro cyclists, why up in arms for something so simple?

When picking my kids up from school, it’s clear the utter lack of responsibility kids have on their bikes, yet at that age (teenagers) they have no repercussions, no policing of their behaviours at all.. then they migrate to an eScooter and that wanton behaviour escalates with no repercussions, what do you think happens when they then get in a car? He’ll, I;ve seen kids who used to cycle to school get mopeds then ride those identically to how they rode their bikes, thinking nothing of jumping on a pavement etc… it’s only at that stage will the police bother..

To argue against enforcing responsible riding is just not setting the right message if vulnerability is the true motivating factor here, yet it’s clear people want double standards with the weakest of excuses that anecdotally they feel it’s the car drivers that do it more..


I walk, ride (cycles and motorbikes) and drive.. I always do so with responsibility and I’d be fine registering my bike, so what?

GreatAuk said:
I'd be more interested in number plates for electric scooters tbh.
1. The riders seem to pull much more dangerous stunts than cyclists.
2. It would help with the appalling visibility from behind (especially in the dark, those tiny little dull red lights at ground level are seriously rubbish for making them visible, and not all of them even have those lights).
Click to expand...
eScooters IMO attract the same people that otherwise would ride bikes (if they could be bothered), the specs of an eScooter are identical to eBikes, and should be considered interchangeable, but again, people want to treat them differently to cyclists as if cyclists are this different group.. they are not, they are one and the same..
 
Demon said:
It should all be equal, we can’t have a shift towards a hierarchy of vulnerability and not apply the same extra rigour to cyclists or it makes a mockery of the idea of the hierachy..

But I get this sense of entitlement and wanting your cake and eat it from those so pro cyclists, why up in arms for something so simple?

When picking my kids up from school, it’s clear the utter lack of responsibility kids have on their bikes, yet at that age (teenagers) they have no repercussions, no policing of their behaviours at all.. then they migrate to an eScooter and that wanton behaviour escalates with no repercussions, what do you think happens when they then get in a car? He’ll, I;ve seen kids who used to cycle to school get mopeds then ride those identically to how they rode their bikes, thinking nothing of jumping on a pavement etc… it’s only at that stage will the police bother..

To argue against enforcing responsible riding is just not setting the right message if vulnerability is the true motivating factor here, yet it’s clear people want double standards with the weakest of excuses that anecdotally they feel it’s the car drivers that do it more..


I walk, ride (cycles and motorbikes) and drive.. I always do so with responsibility and I’d be fine registering my bike, so what?


eScooters IMO attract the same people that otherwise would ride bikes (if they could be bothered), the specs of an eScooter are identical to eBikes, and should be considered interchangeable, but again, people want to treat them differently to cyclists as if cyclists are this different group.. they are not, they are one and the same..
Click to expand...

No they are not, eScooters are not pedal bikes, for an ebike to be classified as a bicycle and not a moped it requires pedals and the electrical assistance can only be operated by pedalling the bike, if it is throttle controlled it is a moped, if the electrical assistance is above 15.5mph it is a moped, if it has no pedals, it is a moped, if its over 250w it is a moped. An escooter is legally classified as a motor vehicle currently, and requires the appropriate legislation for operation in the UK (mot, insurance etc) but that could change in the future.

It shouldn't be equal because the modes of transport are not equal. Should a bus be treated the same as a car? Why does a lorry require more regulation than a moped? The sole reason why regulation/legislation isn't as strict on bicycles is because the law assumes you won't put yourself in danger as your not protected as you would be in a metal box. Some people don't care about themselves or anyone else and no amount of legislation is going to change that. Would they be held accountable for their actions, I'd say no more than they are now, because there's no one to enforce it.

The only thing that would happen should any of this come into effect, is a significant reduction in the number of people cycling for leasure, and ultimately lead to a great increase in obesity and other illnesses related to poor fitness. Which would cost more in the long term. Regulation/Legislation that cannot or is too hard to be enforced, or millions of more medical issues clogging up our NHS even more. The only law I would like to see come in is the requirement for bicycle helmets to be worn, even then in most situations where a helmet was worn and the crash/accident was significant, the helmet would have made no difference to the outcome. Which circles back to the safety aspect of cycling on roads, and why more segregated cycle lanes are absolutely required and if implimented well could actually speed up traffic by allowing higher speed limits as motor vehicles would no longer be a risk to people cycling on a cycle lane.
 
GreatAuk said:
I'd be more interested in number plates for electric scooters tbh.
1. The riders seem to pull much more dangerous stunts than cyclists.
2. It would help with the appalling visibility from behind (especially in the dark, those tiny little dull red lights at ground level are seriously rubbish for making them visible, and not all of them even have those lights).
Click to expand...
First they need to be legal to use on the road.
 
GreatAuk said:
Well that's a big issue too, but even in places where they are legal because there is an approved hire scheme people can still ride like lunatics and there's no way to easily identify the scooter.
Click to expand...
This is all wrong escooters are illegal but you can buy them and hire for profits is this make sense?
 
I'll put it in big letters since people are still replying to something that was never going to happen

“No plans to introduce registration plates” for cyclists, insists Grant Shapps​

 
GreatAuk said:
Well that's a big issue too, but even in places where they are legal because there is an approved hire scheme people can still ride like lunatics and there's no way to easily identify the scooter.
Click to expand...
Add to that the Police have no interest in actually doing anything about the idiots riding e-scooters. I see them every day I go out, and they're not legal here as we're not one of the trial scheme areas, not that it matters as they are mostly ridden by children - on the pavement - as fast as they can possibly go. I've almost been knocked over twice while out for a walk by some ***** on an e-scooter rider going hell for leather. The Police are either never around or just drive by and ignore them.
 
Infidelus said:
Add to that the Police have no interest in actually doing anything about the idiots riding e-scooters. I see them every day I go out, and they're not legal here as we're not one of the trial scheme areas, not that it matters as they are mostly ridden by children - on the pavement - as fast as they can possibly go. I've almost been knocked over twice while out for a walk by some ***** on an e-scooter rider going hell for leather. The Police are either never around or just drive by and ignore them.
Click to expand...
Does seem that there are more and more things they are just completely disinterested in. The other day I was stopped at traffic lights on a big gyratory in the centre of Warrington, and could see an Uber car stopped in the outside lane on the next section of road, clearly causing an obstruction, and stopped on the double yellows and double yellow pavement stripes which mean you're never allowed to stop there. Police car then comes up behind them, I'm sat there thinking 'he he, someone's getting a telling off' but no, they just pull out to get round the car, drive past them, and go on their way.

I was potentially assaulted and certainly threatened by someone a couple of years ago and they didn't even bother going round to talk to the guy despite me knowing exactly where he lived (seems that I need to be carrying a 360 degree camera constantly recording if I want them to actually do anything). I have no trouble believing all the stories about police not bothering to do anything about burglaries or assist in recovering stolen cars etc even when people know exactly where they are.
 
GreatAuk said:
Does seem that there are more and more things they are just completely disinterested in. The other day I was stopped at traffic lights on a big gyratory in the centre of Warrington, and could see an Uber car stopped in the outside lane on the next section of road, clearly causing an obstruction, and stopped on the double yellows and double yellow pavement stripes which mean you're never allowed to stop there. Police car then comes up behind them, I'm sat there thinking 'he he, someone's getting a telling off' but no, they just pull out to get round the car, drive past them, and go on their way.

I was potentially assaulted and certainly threatened by someone a couple of years ago and they didn't even bother going round to talk to the guy despite me knowing exactly where he lived (seems that I need to be carrying a 360 degree camera constantly recording if I want them to actually do anything). I have no trouble believing all the stories about police not bothering to do anything about burglaries or assist in recovering stolen cars etc even when people know exactly where they are.
Click to expand...
You are absolutely right.
 
MadMossy said:
No they are not, eScooters are not pedal bikes, for an ebike to be classified as a bicycle and not a moped it requires pedals and the electrical assistance can only be operated by pedalling the bike, if it is throttle controlled it is a moped, if the electrical assistance is above 15.5mph it is a moped, if it has no pedals, it is a moped, if its over 250w it is a moped. An escooter is legally classified as a motor vehicle currently, and requires the appropriate legislation for operation in the UK (mot, insurance etc) but that could change in the future.

It shouldn't be equal because the modes of transport are not equal. Should a bus be treated the same as a car? Why does a lorry require more regulation than a moped? The sole reason why regulation/legislation isn't as strict on bicycles is because the law assumes you won't put yourself in danger as your not protected as you would be in a metal box. Some people don't care about themselves or anyone else and no amount of legislation is going to change that. Would they be held accountable for their actions, I'd say no more than they are now, because there's no one to enforce it.

The only thing that would happen should any of this come into effect, is a significant reduction in the number of people cycling for leasure, and ultimately lead to a great increase in obesity and other illnesses related to poor fitness. Which would cost more in the long term. Regulation/Legislation that cannot or is too hard to be enforced, or millions of more medical issues clogging up our NHS even more. The only law I would like to see come in is the requirement for bicycle helmets to be worn, even then in most situations where a helmet was worn and the crash/accident was significant, the helmet would have made no difference to the outcome. Which circles back to the safety aspect of cycling on roads, and why more segregated cycle lanes are absolutely required and if implimented well could actually speed up traffic by allowing higher speed limits as motor vehicles would no longer be a risk to people cycling on a cycle lane.
Click to expand...
1. I said the ‘specs’ of the eScooters and eBikes are the same, i.e. 250w/15.5mph limit, and you highlight the deftness of the logic being applied.. literally the only difference is one you gently turn the pedals to unleash 250w/15.mph of assistance, the other you press a thumb throttle, yet legally they are treated so differently it’s laughable.. I have 2 eScooters in the house, bought well before the law was clarified, and ridden a fair few times, and believe me, the fact they are not being treated in all regards as being interchangeable with an eBike is ridiculous, it’s a great alternative.. My opinion of why they’ve been so harshly treated is it’s like a mass of causal (otherwise potential) cyclists suddenly come along which just then highlights the problems with cycling, more people cycling on pavements, more jumping red lights, more being irresponsible, and that is a problem..
2. I never suggested treating everyone to the same rigour.. but being identifiable on a bike and policing the obvious is no where near the level of a car or moped, I didn’t say you should have a licence on a cycle, nor even inusrance, or MOT or the myriad of other things…
3. I agree on the policing, that needs sorting.. but it’s no excuse, there is no point changing laws and defining this hierachy of vulnerability and only policing one sliver of it.
4. The obesity argument is hypothetical and probably the weakest, if eScooters where legal and everyone was pushed more towards cycles and scooters we’d have far less road deaths from cars, less pollution in cities, etc, etc, yet they clearly don’t want people on greener/cleaner and ultimately healthier for everyone transport..


BTW, I don’t think registration of bikes is a good idea , or registration of eScooters for the same reason, it’s better policing we need, maybe employ cheap local pcso’s to help the community with low level stuff including this, but if all we can do is remote policing then maybe registration for all is fair.
 
I had to laugh on Friday, local radio was on in the car and the Presenter mentioned eBikes so I kept it on.
People having rants but one bloke really giving it some and everything he said he was wrong concerning the law and another caller was putting him right.
At that point I recognised the voice and it was my oldest friend and bass player in my band ranting :)
After it finished I rang him saying how he'd been savaged, he hadn't got one thing right and he should have spoken to me if he wanted to know the law etc, what's funny is he's rode both my bikes and think they're brilliant.
He then says he thinks it's wrong that he can be doing 30mph and an eBike comes flying past him but they don't have to register like a Moped.
He had never mentioned this in his rant, he just talked about eBikes in general, I told him that every one of those bikes need crushing, they are illegal so why didn't he mention those ones in his rant - "I forgot" :)

Last night I went to the pub, driving at 30 mph and a lad on an eScooter came flying past me and zoomed off into the distance, he was easily doing 50.
 
@Demon your correct the issue isn't the registration or number plates etc it is the policing or lack of, I remember growing up you'd see bobbies on the beat all the time, officers walking around on patrols, if a kid was acting like a plank on his BMX he'd get a clip around the ear and taken home, you can bet they never did it again.

I guess that's just part of being a different generation, being 40+ is pretty much the last generation to respect authority and the police or maybe that's just me.

EDIT: autocorrect on phone gaffs
 
MadMossy said:
@Demon your correct the issue isn't the registration or number plates etc it is the policing or lack of, I remember growing up your see bobbies on the bar all the time, officers walking around on patrols, if a kid was acting like a plank on his BMX he'd get a clip around the ear and taken home, you can bet they never did it again.

I guess that's just part of being a different generation, being 40+ is pretty much the last generation to respect authority and the police or maybe that's just me.
Click to expand...

Just you.

However there is a significant problem.
 
MadMossy said:
@Demon your correct the issue isn't the registration or number plates etc it is the policing or lack of, I remember growing up your see bobbies on the bar all the time, officers walking around on patrols, if a kid was acting like a plank on his BMX he'd get a clip around the ear and taken home, you can bet they never did it again.

I guess that's just part of being a different generation, being 40+ is pretty much the last generation to respect authority and the police or maybe that's just me.
Click to expand...
Not just you being 40+ stil remember what was like before (respect to everyone) today kids are doing what ever they want.
 
so when are we enforcing motors on motorways only, roads weren't designed for cars and that's the main problem

I remember growing up your see bobbies on the bar all the time, officers walking around on patrols
Click to expand...
it's crazy that we have adults who think it's normal to never see police anywhere and for breakins etc to not be investigated...
 
Since they introduced the 1.5 meter law for cars giving distance to bikes I still get them flying past me at less than a meter, I only ride my bike to the local village to post some items or get a bit of shoping but many car drivers think they are at Brands Hatch an ive seen them doing over 70 in the 30 mph at the top of my road.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom