NVIDIA 4000 Series

[G J]

The 2x faster rumors if true are going to be using all the upscailing/DLSS/RT etc tricks.

This tech isnt just there for game dev's to be sloppy with game optimiation.

 

[Grim5]

2x the fake news and rumoured leaks. Get ready for the usual 20-30% increase as usual. Even the 2080ti to 3080 with double the cuda count was max 30% faster than a 2080ti, just people forget the reality. This time we are not getting a doubling of cuda cores and higher power limits tells you it will not be nowhere near 50% even and if we get 50% it will be the 4090ti not the 4080 or 4090 as we saw this gen and this 3000 gen was supposedly they largest increase in years (take that with a huge pinch of salt).

4080 will be 20-30% max faster than a 3080 and will be on the 103 chip.

4080ti will be same as 4090 minus 3 to 5 % slower and half the VRAM and will be on the 102 chip slightly cut.

4090 will be 30-40% faster than a 3090 and come with 16pin power on standard models and some AIBs with 2 x 16pin power basically silly power use on the AIB OC models. 102 chip slightly cut.

4090ti will be aiming for 50% faster than a 3090 but really 40% faster max than a 3090ti and stupid power use with 2 x 16pin power on the AIB models with OC. 102 chip fully unlocked.


The midrange will see smaller increases as we saw this gen, 4070 will probably be only one aiming for 20-30% increase and ones lower down 3060,3050 will see a max 20% increase if we are lucky.

The main thing Nvidia needs to fix is the VRAM size issues on their 4080 and not do the silly low VRAM again, they only did that on the 3000 series because AMD forced their hand to move up each model one step up, this is why we got a 3080 on GA102 not GA104 so they had to do something to disable it in future games and they knew 10GB was never enough and 12GB should have been the minimum and 16GB for a 3080ti with a £1400 price but it all got messed up by AMD, even the 3090's should not exist they both should have been really the Titan cards 3090= Titan A and 3090ti Titan AP, like the titan x and xp.

I think people are in for a shock when they come out and the power use and price for performance that will make all these rumours look so stupid as we saw with AM5 CPUs and people again were saying 50%-100% increase over AM4.. meeh reality sucks and this is why people live in dream land about 2x the performance ..from gen to gen, them days have been done for decades.

It's a bit different this time though.

* The "Cuda core" increase from RTX 2000 to RTX 3000 did little for games - all they actually did was double the FP32 units in the core so they can claim big tflop numbers and not touch anything else in the core - the other stuff is important for games

* this time they've touch other things inside the core like cache and other units like ROPs (ROPs are really important for rasterisation performance)

I really don't think it's just going to be 30% improvement from 3090 to 4090

 

[gpuerrilla]

I really don't think it's just going to be 30% improvement from 3090 to 4090

The general sentiment I was reading was people expecting the 4070 to beat the 3090, have way better ray tracing and cost ~ £499. This is the price point people can tolerate. Unless there are some magical improvements at the time, I doubt that many will be flocking to buy 4090's especially if they are like two grand.

 

[Miganto]

The general sentiment I was reading was people expecting the 4070 to beat the 3090, have way better ray tracing and cost ~ £499. This is the price point people can tolerate. Unless there are some magical improvements at the time, I doubt that many will be flocking to buy 4090's especially if they are like two grand.

Oh there are always people that will buy the top end no matter the price.

 

[gpuerrilla]

Oh there are always people that will buy the top end no matter the price.

For out and out enthusiasts that will always be the case. Whittle back the layers and you get more volume as price/value gets most return. Look back to the 2080Ti and we have the 3070 bang on this. Coincidence? You will find the same with Ada and the marketing will be beguiling everyone until the testing and benchmarks reveal the state of play.

I think there will be way less appetite this time round. Inflation taken a grip and monster power draw on high end cards wont make them as tempting. Can't say what pricing will be but they wont be cheap. Timing wise it will be good for gamers as mining will likely be in a lull with no easy money on ethereum, more 20 and 30 series cards in the second hand market available.

 

[Richdog]

I reckon that X2 uplift will be in Raytracing performance alone as didn't we get a x2 uplift from the 20 to 30 series , normal rasterization i very much doubt we will be seeing a x2 uplift ( 100% ) but more like a x1.3- x1.5 ( 30%-50% ) at the very best ... would be nice to be proved wrong but i reckon that's where we will land with the 4000 series.

One thing is for sure: this time I will not be selling my GPU until the new one is in my clammy hands.

 

[Richdog]

If any of the 4000 series are 2X faster it won't be on release, they will drip feed the cards over the next 2 years with with the 4080 and 4080ti with increases in yield and ram speed just like they did with titan X, then a titan XP release after that. no doubt Nvidia will string it out over the time frame from release, board improvements from AIB's power improvements just like the 3000 series have done. as the silicon improves so will the cards in speed and ram speed its the way they all do it not only Nvidia but also the same for AMD.

The Ti cards are hardly faster than the non-Ti versions in most cases so the initial big speed boost will, as always, come from the initial releases.

Oh there are always people that will buy the top end no matter the price.

What I have learnt from the previous generation Ampere launch: buy the best card at release and then sit pretty until the next launch, because spending weeks hunting for a card while scalpers hoover up stock is not fun and there was a period where the more expensive and less popular 3090's had really good stock for rrp prices and I just ignored them while hunting for a far better value 3080. When everything ran out, I then managed to find a "close to rrp 3090" and regretted not grabbing one sooner. If finances allow then it's worth at least putting in an order for a 4080 and 4090 and seeing which comes first then you can simply return or cancel the other.

I don't drink or smoke or gamble or have any debt and PC gaming has been a major hobby and source of happiness for me my whole life, so I am more than willing to splurge. I just hope my 850w Seasonic PSU is up to it...

 

[gpuerrilla]

What I have learnt from the previous generation Ampere launch: buy the best card at release and then sit pretty until the next launch, because spending weeks hunting for a card while scalpers hoover up stock is not fun and there was a period where the more expensive and less popular 3090's had really good stock for rrp prices and I just ignored them while hunting for a far better value 3080. When everything ran out, I then managed to find a "close to rrp 3090" and regretted not grabbing one sooner.

One thing I learned, watch out ignore the haters though. Regardless of circumstance, you should only have bought the best value card even if it was unobtainable (according to select crowd). This gen though, you may not be able to use mining to pay for multiple cards the purchase.

 

[Jay85]

More interestingly what are these cards going to be like for people like me who are still rocking cpu's like a 9900k on ultrawide monitors? Will it even be worth upgrading to see any foreseeable reasonable performance?

 

[GhostDog1981]

One thing I learned, watch out ignore the haters though. Regardless of circumstance, you should only have bought the best value card even if it was unobtainable (according to select crowd). This gen though, you may not be able to use mining to pay for multiple cards the purchase.

I’m more than happy with my 3060ti FE at 1440p Ultra. Most games only use 6gb in resources (and I get 150-180 fps) and I don’t see 8gb vram bufffer being exceeded at this resolution. In about 5 years I may upgrade to a 4k screen only if I can get >144fps in games using whatever gpus available then.

The disappointment at 4k (had a LG GP950 which was returned for black-screening issue) with 30 series is that even with a 3090 FE (I had one before I downgraded) you can’t push >144fps in all games.

 

[gpuerrilla]

I’m more than happy with my 3060ti FE at 1440p Ultra. Most games only use 6gb in resources (and I get 150-80 fps) and I don’t see 8gb vram bufffer being exceeded at this resolution. In about 5 years I may upgrade to a 4k screen only if I can get >144fps in games using whatever gpus available then.

The disappointment at 4k (had a LG GP950 which was returned for black-screening issue) with 30 series is that even with a 3090 FE (I had one before I downgraded) you can’t push >144fps in all games.

You only need a GPU that drives your chosen display. Agree on your observations. I am in no hurry to change up the setup right now, if the new gen cards are a massive uplift I will wait for the right time as all the games I play do not require, in fact if dlss improves or the game optimises through patches/drivers it extends the timeframe of not needing any upgrade.

 

[Richdog]

More interestingly what are these cards going to be like for people like me who are still rocking cpu's like a 9900k on ultrawide monitors? Will it even be worth upgrading to see any foreseeable reasonable performance?

Seems a a bit of a odd question considering a 9900K is obviously no slouch and at higher resolutions where the load is on the GPU it will great.

 

[Jay85]

Seems a a bit of a odd question considering a 9900K is obviously no slouch and at higher resolutions where the load is on the GPU it will great.

Its definitely no slouch however it is quite a few generations behind now and wondering if its worth upgrading the cpu first but like you say at higher resolution the gpu matters more but i've always found 1440p to be abit of a odd spot to be in where its relatively balanced between gpu and cpu if that makes sense?

 

[Richdog]

Its definitely no slouch however it is quite a few generations behind now and wondering if its worth upgrading the cpu first but like you say at higher resolution the gpu matters more but i've always found 1440p to be abit of a odd spot to be in where its relatively balanced between gpu and cpu if that makes sense?

If your monitor is a 1440p ultrawide then that is higher than the standard (ie: most common) 1440p resolution.

 

[Nexus18]

Elsewhere, it seems second hand 3090s are going for £750-900 now New gpus are almost hitting MSRP and still loads of stock it seems...

Starting to look like the premium/gouging will be a thing of the past so I'll be surprised if nvidia try to capitalise on 40xx now.

 

[Jay-G25]

One thing is for sure: this time I will not be selling my GPU until the new one is in my clammy hands.

Yeah same , will be keeping hold of my 3090 Strix until i see some actual performance comparison via reviews etc of how a 4090 performs against it ... if it is only a small 20-25% jump in performance then i will very likely run the 3090 for another 2 years but if it actually delivers a decent noticeable jump ( id be happy with say 50% ) then will do the swap but will only sell once i actually have a card in hand ready to go in the PC .

 

[Tommy_Here]

3060 Ti was faster than 2080 super 95% of the time and with an Oc nipped at the heels or practically matched a 2080 Ti.. if a 4060 Ti can do that to the 3090 Ti for around £389.99 that would be bonkers.. we can only dream ey!

 

[TNA]

Elsewhere, it seems second hand 3090s are going for £750-900 now New gpus are almost hitting MSRP and still loads of stock it seems...

Starting to look like the premium/gouging will be a thing of the past so I'll be surprised if nvidia try to capitalise on 40xx now.

I would not even pay £600 if someone offered it to me now to be honest. Rather have a 4070, even if it ends up with 12GB VRAM

 

[Nexus18]

I would not even pay £600 if someone offered it to me now to be honest. Rather have a 4070, even if it ends up with 12GB VRAM

You and me both, I'll stick to offering £300, maybe 350 at a push and a half eaten ham sandwich come the time

 

[Jay85]

You're all assuming there's gonna be plenty of supply at launch day , i have a feeling its gonna be another round of wait 6-12 months for a gpu you want and used market is gonna sky rocket again. Availability is only good now because everyone has what they want and mining has died down a fair bit.

The Lesson we all learnt from last round is: Don't sell your gpu till you get your new one