OcUK DDoS attack - £10,000 reward

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Soldato
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I don't even know what a DDoS attack is so wouldn't know where to start. :p


Maybe an idea to check the ip addresses of all recently banned users?

A DDoS is a Distributed Denial of Service. When you access a website your computer and the server the website is stored on perform what is called a three-way-handshake, essentially:

Your PC: HI I'm on this address!
Server: Why hello thar, can you hear me?
Your PC: Yes, I can hear you!

The server is unfailingly polite and it will keep asking "Can you hear me" until it doesn't get a response for a pre-defined period of time. Off the top of my head I think the default is somewhere around 30 seconds. After your PC responds that it can hear the server, it can then ask for the webpage, or whatever it is you're looking to get.

At a basic level, a standard Denial of Service attack will rely on that mechanism, except that it doesn't respond to the server when the server asks "can you hear me". The server will keep asking over and over "can you hear me" but to no response. That takes server resources, and uses bandwidth.

Now imagine that your PC sends 100,000 "HI" messages to the server, but fakes what address it's sending from. The server has to send 100,000 "hello thar" messages back. Your PC never gets the "hello thar" messages, and if the fake address is real that other machine never sent the "HI message" so ignores it. The target server has to sit there wasting processing power and bandwidth saying "hello thar" over and over again until each process times out, so in the region of several hundred thousand messages.

In the old days it used to be possible to DoS a server using just a PC hosted on an ISDN line. The amount of requests you could send was high enough to cause problems on a target box, both from a spare system resources and also from bandwidth used in replying.

These days it takes a lot more than a single PC, plus if the attack is coming from a single PC it's easier to track, even with a fake address. Networks guys at ISPs despise DoS attacks and actively track unusual traffic patterns, working in conjunction with colleagues at other ISPs.

With a DDoS the attack is coming from many PCs, all claiming fake addresses. The PCs are usually "zombie" PCs, i.e they've been infected with some form of malware. The malware sits there waiting for instructions, usually listening to IRC channels or similar. The attacker posts a message to where the clients are listening, containing a target address and the zombies attack, resulting in millions upon millions of "HI!" messages being sent to the attacked server.

It is extremely challenging at best, and more often pretty much impossible to catch the perpetrator of such an attack if you rely purely on the technical data. Any addresses garnered from logs are liable to be completely fake, so contacting ISPs abuse services about them is pointless.

Filtering out the attack traffic is difficult to achieve as it looks exactly like any normal handshake transaction. Most anti-DoS systems, such as the ones produced by Riverhead Networks (now part of Cisco) analyse the traffic headed to the targetted server and look for unusual patterns and filter out those bits. The cost for such solutions can often be rather prohibitive, and is only useful if it has an idea of what a 'normal' traffic pattern looks like. Typically you'd want to run one for 24 hours watching a server during normal load for it to be able to filter out attack traffic effectively.
 
Soldato
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The PCs are usually "zombie" PCs, i.e they've been infected with some form of malware. The malware sits there waiting for instructions, usually listening to IRC channels or similar..

does that mean that say I had been infected with malware, unawares, I could actually be bringing OCUK down, and thus be in line for the firing squad / police?
 
Soldato
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does that mean that say I had been infected with malware, unawares, I could actually be bringing OCUK down, and thus be in line for the firing squad / police?

I'm not sure it's prosecutable having a PC that is infected, even if it is being used to attack a target. It's the one that triggers the attack that is liable.

However - there is no excuse for not keeping a computer clean. There are free, and very effective, anti-virus solutions out there like Avast and AVG. I don't care how techy people claim to be, there is no excuse for not having anti-virus software installed, because everyone makes unwitting mistakes at times, and you could end up with an unexpectedly infected machine.
 
Man of Honour
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Anyone not scanning incoming files or running a secure browser setup (even as far as running it in a throw away VM or sandbox) is silly imo - but theres no need to run an active AV imo _if_ you know what you are doing and are fairly security conscious - most people are not.
 
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I'm not sure it's prosecutable having a PC that is infected, even if it is being used to attack a target. It's the one that triggers the attack that is liable.

However - there is no excuse for not keeping a computer clean. There are free, and very effective, anti-virus solutions out there like Avast and AVG. I don't care how techy people claim to be, there is no excuse for not having anti-virus software installed, because everyone makes unwitting mistakes at times, and you could end up with an unexpectedly infected machine.


everyone run a scan quick!!!!
i think your right tho, no matter how cautious you are or how well you know a pc it only takes 1 mistake or 1 person(friend) to open a wrong email and your done for.
ive lost count how many times i had to sort pc's for friends / family etc bcos they never run the AV.

running scan as we speak !!! in paranoid mode :p
 
Soldato
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I don't need an excuse - I'll decide how I use my own computers :)

If only that was true. You surrendered that ability the moment you installed an operating system onto the machine. You then became at the mercy of what the programmers decided a) you could do, and b) what others could do through any security holes said programmers left.
 

Jez

Jez

Caporegime
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likewise, i can't stand antivirus software, i'll keep my PC clean via manual means myself!

Maybe when someone makes a decent AV program i'll use it

*awaits flame from AV users*

Always felt this way too. Never had an issue.
 
Man of Honour
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well seeing as how its going to be difficult to catch whoever did this, would it not be better for you to save your 10 grand and spend it on more bandwidth for the site to handle these kind of attacks?

by offering the 10 large reward it obviously shows that this attack has peed you off and your after some sort of retaliation. whoever did the attack is probably laughing now and i wont be surprised if they are watching this thread right now and haveing a right giggle.

probably best to just ignore the attack that way the attackers will get bored and move on.

What a load of rubbish.
getting more bandwidth wont solve anything. Yeha they will get bored only been going on a fortnight already..
retaliation, or how about prosecuting someone who has lost his company thousands probably 10's or 100's and a crime that carrys upto 10years in prison. This isn't some silly little hacker, this is serious stuff.

well i dont get it, you make a thread trying to find out who attacked the site yet you dont provide these "facts involved", im not sure who is actually going to be able to get an idea on this attack unless they were involved in part of the attack.
he can't leagl reasosn. and groups liek this generally don;t kep it secret they will be shared within there group. Some might want the 10k.
 
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Man of Honour
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surely botnets have better things to attack then OcUK, hopefully within a few days this will all be over and the botnet can go back to whatever it is a botnet usualy does when not attacking OcUK.

Botnets are for hire, the people who create them rarely use them themselves these days, rent it out for money is the way now...
 
Soldato
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Always felt this way too. Never had an issue.

That you know of. It's easy to spot the bad malware, you start getting problems. The decent stuff, like the ones behind Storm, are completely invisible to users. You won't even know its there.
 
Man of Honour
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What a load of rubbish.
getting more bandwidth wont solve anything. Yeha they will get bored only been going on a fortnight already..
retaliation, or how about prosecuting someone who has lost his company thousands probably 10's or 100's and a crime that carrys upto 10years in prison. This isn't some silly little hacker, this is serious stuff.


he can't leagl reasosn. and groups liek this generally don;t kep it secret they will be shared within there group. Some might want the 10k.

I'll be shocked if anyone gets caught, you can count the number of people who get successfully prosecuted for these attacks on your fingers. So long as you're not criminally stupid you'll get away with it...
 
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