OcUK Threadripper 2 review thread

[humbug]

Windows has been a piece of crap OS for more than a decade, they are a pretty useless company with some very badly designed software, what they have is a monopoly routed from the fact that because they have 90% of market share 90% of software is for Windows which then perpetuates the existing monopoly.

I'm sorry, it very very difficult to be fair and kind to Windows, to be fair to Windows its not to be kind to them.

A lot of content creators don't use Windows where they don't need to.

I should have added to this MS also make server OS's, they are crap that hardly anyone uses because.... see main point of sentence.

Its no excuse, they do have experience with extreme core counts.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

His conclusion makes no sense, it is still mostly faster than the more expensive 7980XE even when not at its best, when at its best its a lot faster than the 7980XE, if you're doing rendering work it hammers the crap out of the 7980XE....

I don't understand how how thinks that is unfortunate, its unfortunate for Intel, not AMD.

Its like saying "CPU A is faster than CPU B, how unfortunate for CPU A" No, are you mad?

He hasn't quoted the full summary for some weird reason:

Final Thoughts
It’s not going to be difficult summing this one up. Without question, AMD is offering an unbelievable chip with the Ryzen Threadripper 2990WX. I’m still surprised that it even exists, more than most, it seems. I just couldn’t see AMD literally doubling the core count after a single year, but here we are.

I’ve talked lots about core counts, but in actuality, it’s not the core counts that really matter at the end of the day. Do you buy your Radeons and GeForces based on their core counts? Probably not. What you want is the overall performance. The same principle should be applied here. On one hand, it’s unfortunate that AMD needs 32 cores to only just beat Intel’s 18-core in select tests, but AMD’s charging about the same ($1799) for its 2990WX that Intel is still charging for its 7980XE ($1850).

But it’s not those select tests that are going to matter to most people who are reading this review to learn how the chip can impact their workload. Like any workstation scenario, not everyone’s needs are the same. One chip might excel in one area, but if it’s not the area you deal with, then the point is moot.

If you use Arnold, for example, you stand to see incredible gains in performance with a chip like the 2990WX. The same could be said for pretty much every other renderer tested. Encoding scenarios are really hit or miss, even within the same suite. AMD performed great in certain tests, but fell behind in others – often attributed to applications that wouldn’t use the CPU properly.

Having tested the 16-core and 18-core chips before this, I felt like I was really quite prepared for this performance look. Admittedly, though, I was thrown some curve-balls, but it’s really to be expected. You can’t just double the cores and expect every bit of software to pretend like it doesn’t notice. HandBrake in Linux used literally half of the CPU, for example. Then there were applications like PhotoScan which did not use AMD’s many-core chips too well – or Intel for that matter, since SMT off proved better for both of them.

Fortunately, scaling worked well overall, just to different levels. If you are a render addict, it’s almost guaranteed that you’re going to see enormous gains, and I’d suspect those gains will only get better as time goes on, as developers design for these architectures and core counts. I have suspicions that AMD will be demoing Threadripper with a partner at next week’s SIGGRAPH, which will be a testament to that.

Even with some 35 graphs, it’s hard to wrap this up and feel like I covered enough ground. There’s much more that could have been tackled, but that’s probably best left for follow-up content. Gaming will never be a focus of mine with these biggest Threadrippers, but I will definitely be following-up on testing once in a while to see how the ecosystem has improved to better cater to these big chips. I’ve been in contact with a few ISVs already, and hope to talk to more at SIGGRAPH next week to gauge their thoughts.

If there’s anything I didn’t cover that you think I should have, please feel free to jump into the comment section and let me know. If you also have ideas for follow-up testing, that’d be welcomed, as well. New GPUs are coming soon, so time is strapped, but I am eager to get more testing done with the 2990WX soon. Having all that power on tap is kind of addicting.

I don’t really think about awarding Editor’s Choices that often; it really has to impress me to earn it. And the Ryzen Threadripper 2990WX definitely does earn it. It’s rough around some edges, partly due to AMD’s obsession with releasing more cores before developers realize they need to code for them, but it’s an incredible performer; a true “ultimate” workstation processor. It might not be for your workload, but if it is, the gains will be simply sublime. And, you don’t need exotic cooling for it.

If it hasn’t been stated enough already though, software optimization is required here, especially with SMT involved. While some software may have been exposed to multi-socket systems with very high-end servers and core-counts, for workstations it’s a different matter. The tell-tale signs are good this early in the release based on synthetic tests, but there is considerable room for improvement in some live software.

I know I didn’t touch on the 2950X as much as I should have, but I feel like we honestly knew what to expect from that to begin with, especially given the second-gen Ryzen series, and also what we knew from the 1950X (which was performance tackled just a few weeks ago). Fortunately, the 2950X was in fact faster than the 1950X in every test, sometimes by a greater margin than I expected. A nice iteration, but of course not a reason to jump up from the 1950X. For those looking to build a new rig, and are tempted by a 16-core processor priced at $899, it’s an excellent option.

He gave it a rare Editors award.

The 2950X looks pretty solid in its price range.

Edit!!

Also look at the very poor core scaling on the Intel chips from 10 to 18 cores.

So imagine how the 28 core Intel CPU on X599 is going to look too.

Second Edit!!

TBH,the Ryzen 7 2700X also looks pretty solid value too.

 

[Pooh]

His conclusion makes no sense, it is still mostly faster than the more expensive 7980XE even when not at its best, when at its best its a lot faster than the 7980XE, if you're doing rendering work it hammers the crap out of the 7980XE....

I don't understand how how thinks that is unfortunate, its unfortunate for Intel, not AMD.

Its like saying "CPU A is faster than CPU B, how unfortunate for CPU A" No, are you mad?

Stop and take a breath Humbug before you injure yourself or that Ryzen 1600 of yours.....

Look, the 2990 has for all intents and purposes 80% more cores than a 7980X, 32 rather than 18 so 14 extra, so the fact remains that while it is beating it, it's not monstering it, irrespective of OS, and that's before you get anywhere near overclocking potential. I don't care how well it does in synthetic benches, I'm more interested in real world performance of the Apps I use, in case I haven't stated that enough in this thread.

 

[humbug]

@CAT-THE-FIFTH
Did he quote out of context?

Looking at those slides the review is no different to any other review, even where the 2990WX is not as good as it is in other things it is still for the most part better than Intel's best.

What a thing.

And yes, for Windows at least the 2950X is an astonishing CPU for its money.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Do you think MS will start to look at optimisations?

Whislt they are in the server space too, not to the same extent as Linux and likely they only optimise for their server products such as sqlserver etc.

The OS has probably never seen so many cores lol.

Intel has their own Linux distro - Phoronix tested it with the 2990WX,so even Intel is probably aware there are issues too.

Stop and take a breath Humbug before you injure yourself or that Ryzen 1600 of yours.....

Look, the 2990 has for all intents and purposes 80% more cores than a 7980X, 32 rather than 18 so 14 extra, so the fact remains that while it is beating it, it's not monstering it, irrespective of OS, and that's before you get anywhere near overclocking potential. I don't care how well it does in synthetic benches, I'm more interested in real world performance of the Apps I use, unless I haven't stated that enough in this thread.

The 7980XE has 80% more cores than the 7900X,yet its nowhere near that much faster either. Its probably why Intel has its own Linux distro.

 

[Tom B]

The 2950X looks great, but I won't be upgrading my 1950X for a slight performance increase.

 

[humbug]

Intel has their own Linux distro - Phoronix tested it with the 2990WX,so even Intel is probably aware there are issues too.



The 7980XE has 80% more cores than the 7900X,yet its nowhere near that much faster either.

At least not in Windows, and this is my point, Pooh.

 

[humbug]

Looking at all of this it seems windows tops out at about 16 to 18 cores, making the 1950/2950X the sweet spot, for Windows.

 

[Panos]

Stop and take a breath Humbug before you injure yourself or that Ryzen 1600 of yours.....

Look, the 2990 has for all intents and purposes 80% more cores than a 7980X, 32 rather than 18 so 14 extra, so the fact remains that while it is beating it, it's not monstering it, irrespective of OS, and that's before you get anywhere near overclocking potential. I don't care how well it does in synthetic benches, I'm more interested in real world performance of the Apps I use, in case I haven't stated that enough in this thread.

Mate as others said. 7980XE has 80% more cores than the 7900X. Yet there is no +80% perf.
Nor there is a +60% perf from 7900X over your 7960X.
So my question is, why you choose the 7960X over the 7900X when there is isn't +60% perf? Especially when the price tag is more than 60%?
I simply apply your own logic.

 

[Panos]

Looking at all of this it seems windows tops out at about 16 to 18 cores, making the 1950/2950X the sweet spot, for Windows.

2950X makes sweet spot for everything because is still 2 chips with memory to access from both
And saw somewhere price tag £800 which cannot find again -_-

I cannot get why someone would buy a 7960X even at the current sale price of £1200, let alone it's normal price of £1500+ over a 2950X or a 1950X.
The perf gain is small, compared to pricing which is at best +50% if not +100%.
At least those who will buy the 2950X won't have to justify their purchase in the forums, because there is no competitor to that CPU.

Also I don't get why someone could use Premier at certain age, than Filmora.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

It will be interesting to see how the 12 core 2920WX does TBH.

 

[humbug]

2950X makes sweet spot for everything because is still 2 chips with memory to access from both
And saw somewhere price tag £800 which cannot find again -_-

I cannot get why someone would buy a 7960X even at the current sale price of £1200, let alone it's normal price of £1500+ over a 2950X or a 1950X.
The perf gain is small, compared to pricing which is at best +50% if not +100%.
At least those who will buy the 2950X won't have to justify their purchase in the forums, because there is no competitor to that CPU.

Yeah, and looking at these slides people like to point at to show how 'unfortunately the 2990WX is not much faster than the 7980XE' in half of those slides the 7960X is little faster than the 2950X, in the other half the 2950X is faster..... lol fail.

 

[Panos]

It will be interesting to see how the 12 core 2920WX does TBH.

Yeah, that is another chip that might suprise us to be honest.
Even if the 1920X atm is £350 at OCUK, imho worth to wait that one.

 

[SiDeards73]

Pretty much every review ive read of the 2990WX says the same thing, the chip is insanely good *IF* you can harness its power, its unfortunately only as good as the software you are using is coded for. If your software can use all the power on tap its going to beast most things, if your software is effectively rendering your cpu 50% useless due to not being able to use the power on tap, then your no better off by using the 2990WX over something with half the core count pretty much.

As always the world needs to catch up with CPU's, and unfortunately for most Intel still has the majority marketshare, until that changes dont expect to see much radical change or uptake in *Moar Cores* when it comes to tuning software.

Intel know damn well most of the people using HEDT setups are happy with their product performing admirably in given tasks, they know if they increase core counts on the software they excel at they will blow AMD away, so really there is nothing for them to worry about.

The arms race of *More Cores* is futile really for AMD, until major players start jumping on board and harnessing that power, its basically just going to continue being same old same old.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Intel know damn well most of the people using HEDT setups are happy with their product performing admirably in given tasks, they know if they increase core counts on the software they excel at they will blow AMD away, so really there is nothing for them to worry about.

The issue is Intel has the same scaling problem,and you only need to compare the 2950X and 7960X which have the same number of cores to higher end models,so I doubt Intel adding more cores is going to work(there is an Intel Linux distro probably for this very same reason),especially if you look at how massive the Intel chips are. Most of the difference is probably down to IPC or memory bandwidth where the Intel platform has an advantage.

The Intel 10 core lower end HEDT chip is 322MM2 and the middle level HEDT 18 core chip is 484MM2. The 28 core top end HEDT chip is 698MM2.

The Ryzen chip is 213MM2,so yields are going to be much higher for AMD. Its easier for them to add moar cores than Intel.

 

[humbug]

Pretty much every review ive read of the 2990WX says the same thing, the chip is insanely good *IF* you can harness its power, its unfortunately only as good as the software you are using is coded for. If your software can use all the power on tap its going to beast most things, if your software is effectively rendering your cpu 50% useless due to not being able to use the power on tap, then your no better off by using the 2990WX over something with half the core count pretty much.

As always the world needs to catch up with CPU's, and unfortunately for most Intel still has the majority marketshare, until that changes dont expect to see much radical change or uptake in *Moar Cores* when it comes to tuning software.

Intel know damn well most of the people using HEDT setups are happy with their product performing admirably in given tasks, they know if they increase core counts on the software they excel at they will blow AMD away, so really there is nothing for them to worry about.

The arms race of *More Cores* is futile really for AMD, until major players start jumping on board and harnessing that power, its basically just going to continue being same old same old.

This is very true, however on Rainforest top sellers ranking AMD's HEDT chips consistently out rank Intel's, quite often half of Intel's don't even make it into the top 100 list.

Because of architectural limitations Intel cannot even compete on core count let alone price for performance, which they are way behind on vs AMD despite already making massive tier price reductions, and wont for a few years yet.

AMD are gaining HEDT market share, rapidly and that should help to focus developers minds, perhaps even to put more of thier products into better Operating Systems where these CPU's can stretch their legs.

 

[Panos]

@CAT-THE-FIFTH
Hexus posted a 2950X review to add

https://hexus.net/tech/reviews/cpu/121061-amd-ryzen-threadripper-2950x/

Must say impressive especially it is so close to the 7980XE!!!

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

@CAT-THE-FIFTH
Hexus posted a 2950X review to add

https://hexus.net/tech/reviews/cpu/121061-amd-ryzen-threadripper-2950x/

Must say impressive especially it is so close to the 7980XE!!!

Added to the OP.Thanks!

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Just wow:

https://www.golem.de/news/32-kern-cpu-threadripper-2990wx-laeuft-mit-radeons-besser-1808-136016.html
https://www.hardocp.com/news/2018/0...g_benchmarks_stunted_by_faulty_nvidia_driver/

Golem.de clams that the Threadripper 2990WX is being held back by a faulty Nvidia driver
In some games the 32 core beast run at half the speed compared to the 16 core 2950X when running an Nvidia Geforce GTX 1080 Ti GPU!

Link: https://tinyurl.com/y87glxh6 (Google translated)

Battlefield 1, Warhammer 2, F1 2017, Rise of the Tomb Raider and The Witcher 3 are showing similar issues according to the article.

 

[jigger]

Windows has been a piece of crap OS for more than a decade, they are a pretty useless company with some very badly designed software, what they have is a monopoly routed from the fact that because they have 90% of market share 90% of software is for Windows which then perpetuates the existing monopoly.

I'm sorry, it very very difficult to be fair and kind to Windows, to be fair to Windows its not to be kind to them.

A lot of content creators don't use Windows where they don't need to.

I'm not supporting Windows it's been a pile of dung for decades. I'm just pointing out that what AMD have done with CPU's since the launch of Win10 is probably a decade ahead of what Microsoft thought possible.