Other shooting in America

muon · 22 Sep 2018 at 12:41

muon said:
Suggest you read OP for correct chronology.

It is lucky the dead guy didnt have a submachine gun or something in his house. I believe under stand your ground laws he would be entitled to kill the two guys that just drew weapons at him.

That highlights the stupidity of it all. Taking guns away would have stopped anything serious happening as it was the handgun that escalated things very quickly.

CREATIVE!11 · 22 Sep 2018 at 12:43

I was also trying to listen carefully and I think at 2 mins he says "gimme that gun" or get me that gun could he have been talking to his wife to hand him a gun?

muon · 22 Sep 2018 at 12:53

CREATIVE!11 said:
I was also trying to listen carefully and I think at 2 mins he says "gimme that gun" or get me that gun could he have been talking to his wife to hand him a gun?

Don't think he would have gone inside to get a baseball bat if he had a gun inside.

jsmoke · 22 Sep 2018 at 13:03

muon said:
It is lucky the dead guy didnt have a submachine gun or something in his house. I believe under stand your ground laws he would be entitled to kill the two guys that just drew weapons at him.

That highlights the stupidity of it all. Taking guns away would have stopped anything serious happening as it was the handgun that escalated things very quickly.

I don't think it would have been of much use in his house.

The fact of the matter is there have been, are and will be a lot of aggressive violent people in America. Now imagine you live in a remote or country area how are you going to defend yourself especially if it's multiple people v. one if the case arises. All very well living in a built up city with police, people, cameras around.

Tefal · 22 Sep 2018 at 17:02

CREATIVE!11 said:
I was also trying to listen carefully and I think at 2 mins he says "gimme that gun" or get me that gun could he have been talking to his wife to hand him a gun?

Or perhaps he was talking to the guys waving guns about infront of his wife....

Tefal · 22 Sep 2018 at 17:03

jsmoke said:
I don't think it would have been of much use in his house.

The fact of the matter is there have been, are and will be a lot of aggressive violent people in America. Now imagine you live in a remote or country area how are you going to defend yourself especially if it's multiple people v. one if the case arises. All very well living in a built up city with police, people, cameras around.

But nearly all the gun crime is in the built up areas with police people and cameras.

dowie · 22 Sep 2018 at 17:43

CREATIVE!11 said:
I was also trying to listen carefully and I think at 2 mins he says "gimme that gun" or get me that gun could he have been talking to his wife to hand him a gun?

Tefal said:
Or perhaps he was talking to the guys waving guns about infront of his wife....

nah because he then says "I'm gonna put a 9 in this ****er", it was in reference to him getting a gun - so giving them yet another reason to justify why they're brandishing

deuse said:
I would like to know why the old guy suddenly moved to his left?

jsmoke said:
Yep I noticed that also why I thought he was shot at, maybe guy threw bat at him.

Total wild west stand off and shootout. Imagine back in the real WW days with no camera phones and the like.

Edit. Pause at 2.13 you can see the bat thrown at him.

Yup, he's told not to move any closer to him, so he ignores the warning/threat and move closer to him with the bat, two warning shots are fired, he then throws the baseball bat at his head, they then both shoot him.

muon said:
Don't think he would have gone inside to get a baseball bat if he had a gun inside.

he didn't go inside to get a baseball bat - his brother handed him a baseball bat...

this is a guy we now know has mental issues and a history of violence, he's facing two guys with guns in some silly argument and supposedly is worried about the safety of the kids (who they don't even bother to get inside) - rather than getting him to calm down, take him away knowing he is a bit mental the brother instead hands him a bat and the wife films the whole thing!

Chojin · 22 Sep 2018 at 17:54

Guy deserves a darwin award. When you're standing in front of two guys with guns, it's not a good idea to say "shoot me".

Tefal · 22 Sep 2018 at 17:59

dowie said:
nah because he then says "I'm gonna put a 9 in this ****er", it was in reference to him getting a gun - so giving them yet another reason to justify why they're brandishing

Yup, he's told not to move any closer to him, so he ignores the warning/threat and move closer to him with the bat, two warning shots are fired, he then throws the baseball bat at his head, they then both shoot him.

he didn't go inside to get a baseball bat - his brother handed him a baseball bat...

this is a guy we now know has mental issues and a history of violence, he's facing two guys with guns in some silly argument and supposedly is worried about the safety of the kids (who they don't even bother to get inside) - rather than getting him to calm down, take him away knowing he is a bit mental the brother instead hands him a bat and the wife films the whole thing!

Warning shots? Shooting somone in the chest and the head is not a "warning shot"

dowie · 22 Sep 2018 at 18:08

Tefal said:
Warning shots? Shooting somone in the chest and the head is not a "warning shot"

note I referred to two warning shots

I didn't claim that shooting someone in the chest and head constituted warning shots, I'm referring to the two shots initial fired by the old guy with the pistol to which he responds by towing a baseball bat and to which they both respond by shooting him

jsmoke · 22 Sep 2018 at 18:32

Can't believe I'm wasting so much time on this but hey ho. So if this article is correct it looks like the Millers instigated it all and if so I hope they get the maximum sentence.

The joys of redneck neighbors.

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/community/fort-worth/article218728710.html

Nitefly · 22 Sep 2018 at 18:51

Wow what a ridiculous waste of life. So much opportunity to defuse that situation. Screaming threats at two guys whom are armed like that was just.... crazy. Terrible all round.

233 · 22 Sep 2018 at 19:04

sounds like angry people on both sides but to take someones life over a mattress is a frightening indictment of the state of affairs in the USA. The problem is gun ownership and the "right" to bear arms is so enshrined in their culture the laws on gun ownership will never change. you can only hope that there is a change in attitudes towards the use and prevalence of firearms over the coming years but i very much doubt it. Other countries manage entirely fine with high levels of gun ownership and done seem to have anywhere near the level or extremeness of incidents the US have so its not about access to firearms but more about both the attitude of the people and the attitude towards the use of firearms. Regardless of blame there are now children without a father and 2 families potentially destroyed through one angry encounter

Tefal · 22 Sep 2018 at 21:07

dowie said:
note I referred to two warning shots

I didn't claim that shooting someone in the chest and head constituted warning shots, I'm referring to the two shots initial fired by the old guy with the pistol to which he responds by towing a baseball bat and to which they both respond by shooting him

They aren't warning shots, he shot him, he threw the bat they then finished him off with the shotgun.

jsmoke · 22 Sep 2018 at 21:57

How do you know that Tefal, why was the woman not screaming until after the shotgun blast?

dowie · 22 Sep 2018 at 21:58

Tefal said:
They aren't warning shots, he shot him, he threw the bat they then finished him off with the shotgun.

Doesn't seem like it, seems like the old guy fired towards him, he then threw the bat at him - he's still standing at this point, then the old guy and the son fire at him and he's on the ground

hux · 22 Sep 2018 at 22:14

Yeah I reckon the first two were warning shots, he then threw the bat and it was shoot to kill.

Shameful waste of life, and shows how nutty the world is becoming.

CREATIVE!11 · 22 Sep 2018 at 22:36

hux said:
Yeah I reckon the first two were warning shots, he then threw the bat and it was shoot to kill.

Shameful waste of life, and shows how nutty the world is becoming.

Worst part about it is children from both families lose their fathers.

One is dead and the other is going to jail for a potentially long time.

All over a mattress....................................

VoG · 22 Sep 2018 at 22:42

I don't think they where warning shots i just think there aim was off on the first 2 shots, I can't help but wonder if Mr Orange did something suddenly off camera that escalated things from being mouthy on both sides to shots fired, either way totally avoidable & utterly idiotic.

rebel rebel · 22 Sep 2018 at 23:14

Apparently the dead man had previous of attacking people. He once assaulted a mailman for attempting to deliver mail to his home.