Palit

[J.D]

Hmmm, not good. Is this really what ATi is still like?

Still like? . 9800Pro, X800XT PE, 7600GT, X1900XT, 2900Pro, 8800GTX, 4870, 6950. No driver crashes, no BSODs or any problems what so ever with both Nvidia and ATI. Both have been rock solid and I've heard a lot about Nvidia and ATI equally although been lucky enough to never once experience anything worth mentioning.

I was getting driver crashes with this 6950 but......in games and that was due to an unstable overclock. I'd expect the same with an unstable overclock on any Nvidia card also . Everything is fine since I sorted my overclock out. I tested my overclock on Heaven and 3Dmark but they are useless. Fired Crysis up and my PC fired a crisis back at me and pretty quickly 10-15 minutes then either BSOD or driver crash, mostly driver crash and recover though.

I personally think if the fan ramps up with the 6950 then you'll notice it but if Anandtech reports it as being 10db quieter than the GTX 480 and 3.3db quieter than the GTX 570 then maybe it's me just becoming more sensitive to noise .

On average the cards (6970/570) are pretty equal but as you have mentioned, Dirt 2 has an increase in performance you desire although both would be very playable. What about other games?. I really think you should spend some time reading reviews and seeing performance figures in games you're interested in as you're going to get too many varied replies from me and others with different experiences.

I'm wanting a GTX 570 for other reasons which has nothing to do with noise or performance as I'm happy. The fan could be quieter as anything above 50% then I'd want my headset on but that depends on how much you push it regarding heat output.

Whatever you get, I hope you can just install and game with an acceptable noise. If you want to save money then I think you know what to do. If you don't mind the extra outlay then again I think you know what to do. Maybe decide that first and then that will help decide what you're getting.

 

[The Running Man]

If its a reference board fitted with a reference cooler how can it be anything different?

Well the boards are reference but the coolers arent always...

Hmmm, not good. Is this really what ATi is still like?

In my experience yes. When i cleared out the 5830 i had a choice of 5850 and a GTX 460 (i also bought and sold a gtx 470 too).

In the last 12 months ive had:

MSI Cyclone 460
Gigabyte 460
Sparkle reference 460
Zotac GTX 470

Sapphire 5830

None of the nvidia boards gave me any BSOD or driver issues. The ATi did. I cant say much more than that.

If i was spending over £150 on a graphics card, is 10% swing in price that much to pay for a better brand? personally i think not. Given upto £15 difference id take the Zotac (5 year warranty), Asus, Gigabyte/MSI in that order.

 

[[TW]Fox]

Well the boards are reference but the coolers arent always...

The cooler is a reference cooler. It's quite obviously such in the photograph of the card.

If i was spending over £150 on a graphics card, is 10% swing in price that much to pay for a better brand? personally i think not.

It is if its pointless spend and every card is the same, though?

 

[The Running Man]

The cooler is a reference cooler. It's quite obviously such in the photograph of the card.

It is if its pointless spend and every card is the same, though?

Why ask the question then? All i can give is my opinion based on previous cards, the warranty length (see my edit above).

Personally the Palit would be at the bottom of the pick list. Simple.

 

[kylew]

If its a reference board fitted with a reference cooler how can it be anything different?



Hmmm, not good. Is this really what ATi is still like?

No, it's not, and it's ridiculous that people still suggest they are. You'll find those that suggest ATi drivers simply never work, will also insist that nVidia never have any problems ever. They'll also ignore you if you point out that such issues aren't the norm (for either AMD or nVidia) but nVidia cards do have them too.

I think it's simply down to the fact that so many people fall for nVidia's marketing on how they're the best ever, never have any problems, and are a "premium" brand.

Funnily enough, these people who'd have you believe nVidia never have problems, will probably ignore the ridiculous amount of threads over the internet about the nVidia laptop GPUs that failed, there are whole forums dedicated to it, with a lot of posts...

But in normal circumstances, AMD drivers are just as good as nVidia's, and those that claim otherwise can't accept that they're the cause of their issues (PEBKAC) or they've been having hardware issues and need to RMA their card and stop acting butthurt that a piece of computer hardware has failed. Issues happen, but it's not the norm, and happens to both nVidia and AMD, just as any other brand.

Sorry about the rant, but it gets tiresome seeing people talking crap because they can't accept they've had issues with hardware.

For example to Nickg, you've had a problem with 1 ATi card, so condemn the lot? Nickg, what would you do if you had the same issues with an nVidia card? Say the same about them?

 

[Noobie-Wan]

Palit are like the Alba brand of graphics cards. Yes some of the hardware is there and functioning but its not good.

See the GT 460 VRM sinks issue.

they are a reference board but with cuts in quality in terms of the cooling/hardware.

Spend the extra £10 and buy an Asus, MSi, or something.



Drivers, BSOD, compatability. thats why id take the hit and go nvidia. I had a 5830 and ditched it for a 460 and i couldnt be happier as my system is rock stable now. With ATi i recieved driver crashes as did numerous other people.

If its a reference board fitted with a reference cooler how can it be anything different?

Hmmm, not good. Is this really what ATi is still like?

Palit GTX 460 are non-reference, none of the reference models I know of has a VRM sink on them except for the EVGA ***(for the win). Just that Palit sent 460 cards to reviewers that had VRM sink on them, which is very sly. Palit's premium brand Gainward however does have VRM sink on them.

Reference:

Palit:

 

[The Running Man]

For example to Nickg, you've had a problem with 1 ATi card, so condemn the lot? Nickg, what would you do if you had the same issues with an nVidia card? Say the same about them?

Of course, why wouldnt i?

I buy card, have bad experience, i tell people about it. I buy nvidia card, have good experience i also tell people about it.

the opposite could have been true, but in this case it was not. Hence i made said statement.

What would you do? Buy an ATi card, find out something is bugged and then lie about it?

 

[Gibbo]

Is there any reason not to buy one?

Looking at the 570.

Nope the 580's and 570's are both reference design cards.

But a GTX 480 is a better deal.

 

[arc@css]

probably just an Nvidia game, the same way AvP is an AMD game. If you play Dirt 2 a lot I would get the best card for it.

In Stalker for example the 6970 smokes the 570, heck it even gets close to the 580!

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/amds-radeon-hd-6970-radeon-hd-6950/19

AMD cards generally run the Stalker games better.

 

[[TW]Fox]

But a GTX 480 is a better deal.

I know

I wish I could put up with that fan because the performance is so great

 

[MikeHiow]

I think if you're looking at the 570, you may as well meet yourself in the middle, foot the bill for a cooler for your 480 and take the risk with the warranty.

Regarding ATIs and driver issues, I've had a lot of ATI cards - X800XT, 4850, 4890 and now 6950 and I've never had any real issues.

 

[The Running Man]

If i was buying right now id be tempted by an MSI GTX 470 with twin cooler...for half the price of a 570. True it doesnt perform as quickly but i mean how many FPS do you really need :/

 

[kylew]

Of course, why wouldnt i?

I buy card, have bad experience, i tell people about it. I buy nvidia card, have good experience i also tell people about it.

So, what brand would you buy if you suddenly had a problem with your nVidia card?

the opposite could have been true, but in this case it was not. Hence i made said statement.

The way you went about it screams "I can't accept I had a problem with my graphics card, ATI are crap and all their cards have problems"

What would you do? Buy an ATi card, find out something is bugged and then lie about it?

Accept that it's the nature of being "into computers" for things to go wrong sometimes and sort the issue out, be that and RMA due to faulty hardware, or realise that the dodgy bios I made with RBE is making the card act funny.

 

[Cleeecooo]

Well from what i've heard, the Gainward phantom cards are really really quiet so IMO, they are the best for your needs OP.
I've also heard the MSI 470's are pretty quiet too. Why not get two of them and SLI?

 

[bobert50]

I know

I wish I could put up with that fan because the performance is so great

I'm just a bit surprised that someone who looks at things in reasonable depth didnt realise the repuation the 470-480 reference designs have as "hoovers".

Also, on a side note i really don't like them stupid anandtech db readings. I've had several cards on their listings and it just doesn't ring true. I think some types of fans are just far more intrusive than others.

The Anandtech db graphs imo from experience of owning most cards at some point just doesn't make any sense.

IMO you went the wrong way fox last week. You should have got the 470 with the really nice cooler and overclocked it heavily. It'd have been a bargain and perfect.

 

[[TW]Fox]

I'm just a bit surprised that someone who looks at things in reasonable depth didnt realise the repuation the 470-480 reference designs have as "hoovers".

I have explained this on countless occasions. I shall do so again, one last time.

I am aware that the 480 had a reputation for having a loud cooler. However, the GTX280 also had the same reputation. I looked at various reviews all of which had graphs showing relative noise levels. It appeared from these that the situation with the 480 was exactly the same as that with the 280 - some people thought they were loud.

I was happy with the noise levels on my 280, so figured I would be happy with the noise levels on the 480 as well.

Getting absolute information before purchase was not possible because most people with GTX480 experience were split into two camps:

a) People reviewing early samples who declared the cards VERY NOISY. These are the same people who did the same thing with the GTX280.

b) People who had spent £400 on a 480 (Hello Raven) and therefore would literally fight until the last breath to defend the honour of the card in a valiant battle of purchase justification.

I did all the research I could, and on this occasion there was no subsitute for personal experience. Sadly the card fell at the personal experience hurdle and as a result, it isn't the card for me.

The 470 was never the right choice either, I'd rather have just bought a 560 than one of those.

 

[bobert50]

I have explained this on countless occasions. I shall do so again, one last time.

I am aware that the 480 had a reputation for having a loud cooler. However, the GTX280 also had the same reputation. I looked at various reviews all of which had graphs showing relative noise levels. It appeared from these that the situation with the 480 was exactly the same as that with the 280 - some people thought they were loud.

I was happy with the noise levels on my 280, so figured I would be happy with the noise levels on the 480 as well.

Getting absolute information before purchase was not possible because most people with GTX480 experience were split into two camps:

a) People reviewing early samples who declared the cards VERY NOISY. These are the same people who did the same thing with the GTX280.

b) People who had spent £400 on a 480 (Hello Raven) and therefore would literally fight until the last breath to defend the honour of the card in a valiant battle of purchase justification.

I did all the research I could, and on this occasion there was no subsitute for personal experience. Sadly the card fell at the personal experience hurdle and as a result, it isn't the card for me.

The 470 was never the right choice either, I'd rather have just bought a 560 than one of those.

yea hence my bit about anandtech graphs being utterly worthless

 

[DIABLO]

Fox can you not just buy a cheap £25 passively cooled card to run the 2nd monitor so the idle temps drop on the 480, i know it negates some of the money saved on the 480 but it might be the best solution for you.

 

[[TW]Fox]

Interestingly Techpowerup got completely different results in Dirt2 than Anandtech did. Infact it seems that in Techpowerup's figures, the 6970 was 10% faster in Dirt2 than the GTX 480?

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GeForce_GTX_560_Ti/12.html

What do we make of that?

Not sure if I trust them given they put the fan noise of a 480 as considerably lower than a 280 in all tests

 

[Nelly]

You wouldn't happen to know what brands are and aren't UK RMA would you?

Gigabyte - UK RMA Base - 3 Year Warranty. (Around 2 working days to sort out.)

HIS - Hong Kong/China RMA Base - (If card bought from OcUK then they will deal with the warranty, even in the 2nd year, so should be no more than 3-5 working days.) Don't buy unless from OcUK.

XFX - UK RMA Base - 2 Year Warranty - (If card bought from OcUK then they will deal with the warranty, even in the 2nd year, so should be no more than 3-5 working days.)
(XFX only have lifetime warranty in the USA - they have a UK RMA base but their customer support is really poor having read various forums, stay away from them for sure) Don't buy unless from OcUK.

KFA2 - UK RMA Base - 2 Year Warranty (Galaxy's Euro Brand - RMA Base used to be BFG's)

PNY - France RMA Base - 2 Year Warranty (Around 3 Working Days)

Zotac - UK Phone Number - 5 Year Warranty registered with Zotac, otherwise 2 year Warranty. (Not sure how long RMA takes.)

EVGA - Germany RMA Base - 10 Year Warranty Only on some models (SC and F.T.W), other models 2 year Warranty (Around 2 weeks - possible graphics upgrade)

MSI - Netherlands RMA Base - 2 Year Warranty (Read forum threads - around 10 to 14 days RMA.)


--------------------------------------------------------------

Gainward - RMA via retailer only - 2 Year Warranty (Depends which retailer you bought it from as to the service you'll get.)

Inno3D/Force3D - RMA via retailer only - 2 Year Warranty ((Depends which retailer you bought it from as to the service you'll get.)

Palit - Hong Kong RMA Base - RMA via retailer only - 2 Year Warranty (Depends which retailer you bought it from as to the service you'll get.)

Asus - Czech Republic RMA Base - 2-3 Year Warranty (Anywhere from 2 weeks or 3 months without success!! for Graphics Card RMA) AVOID!

PowerColor - Taiwan ? ? ? - 2 Year Warranty (Avoid like the plague, RMA seems to be non-existant for european customers!)

Sapphire - Hungary RMA Base - 2 Year Warranty (Take over 4 weeks upto 8 weeks!) AVOID!