Poll: Poll: Prime Minister Theresa May calls General Election on June 8th

[Vidar]

Dolph, we agree on something a Universal Basic Income is a much better idea and I believe should be brought in and remove the current means tested systems. This would ultimately save the tax payer millions, by disposing of the likes of job centre plus which seems to serve absolutely no purpose whatsoever anymore. The question is though at what rate do you set it? And what other measures would you take to ensure that this additional income for the majority of people is not taken advantage of by greedy money grubbing land lords for example?

I would certainly love to see this as one of labours manifesto policies!

Personally I believe that if this was to come into fruition it should be set at a rate for a single person to afford a 1 bedroom flat, pay council tax, and have the same amount of money as JSA to live on per week. With those having children allocated extra in line with what would have been paid in child benefit/tax credits. Implementing it though, especially when considering disability etc would be an absolute nightmare to get right.

 

[jjwf]

It says something... it's say companies can see the direction of travel, which I highlighted a long time ago. It's a sensible thing to do, imo, but they don't have to.

No what is says is, there have been at least 3 cases were the defendants have lost so a precedent has been set.

 

[Tefal]

Hence why a universal basic income is a better idea. Stop means testing people, stop compensating people for bad decisions, and stop punishing people for not complying with arbitrary rules.

Only adjust the system relating to simple, objective and measurable changes, and apply it to everyone the change applies to (for example, having a child could increase payment)

It will never fly though, as this country likes being able to punish or reward people based on ideology, and we don't have sufficient legal protections to prevent it.

So what happens if you introduce this minimum basic income and a fairly sizeable chunk of your workin age population decides that they'd rather the less money and the massivly increased leasuire time?

Suddenly youre in a bit of a pickle come budget tine

 

[kindai]

So what happens if you introduce this minimum basic income and a fairly sizeable chunk of your workin age population decides that they'd rather the less money and the massivly increased leasuire time?

Suddenly youre in a bit of a pickle come budget tine

The idea is it really is the absolute minimum, to the point of if you do that you would be living on rice and chicken for every meal for the rest of your life.

How much luxury and lifestyle you have would be from actually having a job.

 

[Caged]

If people want to take the minimum income and live a subsistence lifestyle then so what, they might end up creating something that has a much higher value than a Tesco job would have provided.

 

[Vidar]

So what happens if you introduce this minimum basic income and a fairly sizeable chunk of your workin age population decides that they'd rather the less money and the massivly increased leasuire time?

Suddenly youre in a bit of a pickle come budget tine

I can't find the link unfortunately but I do remember reading an article that showed evidence when it had been trialed that this was not the case... what was found that generally more people returned to education, had less stress and spent more which had positive effects on the economy

 

[jjwf]

Not a binding one. Unless you can evidence that fact. Fin.

I've already pasted the links, despite asking you on numerous occasions to put up a link showing were a defendant has won a similar case you still haven't. Either put one up or except your wrong.

 

[Deleted User 234324]

With the rapid advancement of robotics its only a matter of time before a universal basic income will be absolutely required as the number of low skill jobs declines through automation.

 

[Greebo]

Anybody else notice that May's little rally today there wasn't a single mention of conservative on any of the signs? They all referred to just May. When did this become a presidential election?

 

[Ryan-3]

Initially they were the only party to have voiced any sort of intent to not go hammer and tong for full-bore hard brexit. Labour had just been silent on the issue when this poll was created and so the Lib Dems...*snip*

Ah, that might be the reason they're so popular on the poll.

EDIT: Sadly Tim Farron is not exactly inspiring me towards that end though - again he has possibly an opportunity of a lifetime here and is just ******* it away so far.

This is what puts me off the Lib Dems. They've never had a leader that I can get behind (in my lifetime at least). I know a lot of people dislike Jeremy Corbyn, and a huge portion of the right wing media like to slate him whilst praising our almighty strong and stable leadership, but I actually like him. I remember him being called out by dodgy Dave for what he was wearing. His response highlights just why I like him.

 

[jjwf]

https://www.fpb.org/business-support/holiday-pay-rulings-overtime-and-commission

In Bear Scotland v Fulton, the EAT decided that non-guaranteed overtime pay should be included in the calculation where it is part of “normal remuneration” and that a gap of more than three months broke a series of holiday pay underpayments (this is relevant for backdating claims).

Other cases, such as Lock v British Gas and Williams v British Airways have established that regular commission payments and allowances “intrinsically linked” to performing a role (such as flying time for pilots), should also be included when calculating holiday pay. The Lock v British Gas case returned to a tribunal, following a CJEU ruling and has since been appealed to the EAT. In February 2016 the EAT confirmed that the Working Time Regulations 1998 should be interpreted to correspond to the EU working time directive and that holiday pay should include commission.

 

[Tefal]

What happens if you do it and people start doing things which create more value, more for the economy, help out aging family more and therefore stop them being a burden on the state, etc... suddenly you're in dream land come budget time.

We need trials. I think there's one in Finland soon. There was one in Canada or the US but that wasn't self-funding.

If that was true then everyone on IS A would be doin that...

 

[Tefal]

I can't find the link unfortunately but I do remember reading an article that showed evidence when it had been trialed that this was not the case... what was found that generally more people returned to education, had less stress and spent more which had positive effects on the economy

How does that have a positive effect on the ecobomy?
They are producing nothing

 

[Tefal]

If people want to take the minimum income and live a subsistence lifestyle then so what, they might end up creating something that has a much higher value than a Tesco job would have provided.

Or they just take the basic income top it up by selling a bit of weed/mcat, odd bit of shoplifting and generally do exactly as the people on long term benifits do now?

 

[Caged]

Or they just take the basic income top it up by selling a bit of weed/mcat, odd bit of shoplifting and generally do exactly as the people on long term benifits do now?

Cool, let's hear your suggestions then

 

[Dis86]

Like now we give child benefit out, right? Does the fact that a significant number of people spend that money on themselves/drugs/whatever and don't meaningfully help their kids mean we shouldn't have child benefit?

I honestly don't understand child benefit/the point of it. Surely before one has a sprog they way up whether they can afford it?

 

[jjwf]

You're certifiable . Please tell me you don't advise people on these matters. You sound like a classic misinformed union idiot.

I refer you back to my god analogy...

Losing an argument, typical resort to insults, like I said your clueless.

 

[Dis86]

Child benefit isn't just for relatively poor people. It's about trying to help out most families (just not the richest).

But why should other people be paying for you (not you per se!) to have a child? It is your choice. A decision which should not be taken lightly. Financial considerations should be a big part of it. Can't afford it, don't have kids.

 

[Vidar]

How does that have a positive effect on the ecobomy?
They are producing nothing

Right so someone returning to education, bettering themselves and getting a more highly paid job at the end of it doesn't benefit the economy? People with more disposable income and added financial security spending more in the shops doesn't benefit the economy? People being able to comfortably pay their bills, feeling more valued etc not taking time off sick with diagnosis of things like depression doesn't benefit the economy?

 

[Kenai]

Nope, keep dreaming, put up your links showing a defendant that's won, oh dear, you can't, another loser who's as bright as a dark night in November.

We're still deeply rooted in the "not actually arguing about the same thing the other guy is" stage of the discussion I see.