Permabanned
You have had an amazing result not finding much rust, those are normally rotten unless they have had some repair work done already.
Project Bentley
- Thread starter JRS
- Start date
I think the initial restoration was done right. It's the chasing of the crap that was left by the second 'restoration', i.e. cacked-up blow-over and bodged-up everything else, that we're trying to undo now.
Structurally, there's nothing wrong. Mechanically, the engine is fine. It's these niggly, crappy little faults we've got to get sorted. Little bits of cosmetic rot in the body, paint issues, that's being done by the body 'n' fender shop. Brightwork, seals, the bumper end-caps (notorious on this era of R-R/Bentley for being mis-shapen and looking like ****), random trim....that's Gary and I sorting one step at a time. Mechanically though, she's actually sorted. Our tame mechanic and Gary, with yours truly chipping in (I'm not a god-like mechanic, but I can get stuck in if something is ****** up)** have got her to the point where we can safely say that she's not going to embarrass the driver by acting up. Electrically, she's a bit of a recalcitrant minx, like all old cars. But since the only thing that absolutely refuses to work is one of the cigar lighter sockets in the back, I'll forgive her that little foible!
***edit***
** - oh yes, and one of his friends as well who helped us change the spark plugs. Much of the smooth running of that engine can be attributed to him. Great guy
Caporegime
- Joined
- 13 Nov 2006
- Posts
- 26,029
Looking good, it will be a fine machine after getting its well deserved loving. 
Cheers sigma, we're certainly doing our best with the old girl.
I know I've said it on here before, but it stands repeating - straight restorations are not too bad, undoing bodged-up and cack-handed work is the real problem. You shouldn't see screwed-up paint on rust-free panels - unless you fail to prep the surface properly, which the guys who painted this car in the past (before Gary owned it) obviously ****** up on. You shouldn't see vacuum pipe "repaired" with electrical tape, unless you buy a car that Bubba The Retarded Hillbilly™ worked on at some point in the past. And you definitely shouldn't see bits of wiring loom bypassed with crap wires simply because Bubba's cousin Cletus couldn't figure out where the original wiring was supposed to go once he'd disconnected it. A sensible human being would find a wiring diagram and sort it out, but not Cletus - he just tucks it into the nearest space he can find, forgets about it and splices (badly) another cable in up-stream....I found one of those delightful little puzzles right in the front of the centre console, and pulled almost 40cm of redundant wire out. Fortunately, Gary was indoors making me a coffee and missed the resulting bad-tempered and sweary tirade....
I know I've said it on here before, but it stands repeating - straight restorations are not too bad, undoing bodged-up and cack-handed work is the real problem. You shouldn't see screwed-up paint on rust-free panels - unless you fail to prep the surface properly, which the guys who painted this car in the past (before Gary owned it) obviously ****** up on. You shouldn't see vacuum pipe "repaired" with electrical tape, unless you buy a car that Bubba The Retarded Hillbilly™ worked on at some point in the past. And you definitely shouldn't see bits of wiring loom bypassed with crap wires simply because Bubba's cousin Cletus couldn't figure out where the original wiring was supposed to go once he'd disconnected it. A sensible human being would find a wiring diagram and sort it out, but not Cletus - he just tucks it into the nearest space he can find, forgets about it and splices (badly) another cable in up-stream....I found one of those delightful little puzzles right in the front of the centre console, and pulled almost 40cm of redundant wire out. Fortunately, Gary was indoors making me a coffee and missed the resulting bad-tempered and sweary tirade....
A couple of chunks of car missing....
Man of Honour
I haven't posted in the thread for a while but I'm still reading with interest, it looks in remarkably good nick underneath the paint - those chunks missing aside. I know a little bit about how frustrating it is trying to fix something that has been bodged by someone and they've not documented how/why they've done it but I suspect with cars it's on a whole different scale.
Soldato
Eep! Should look fantastic when it's done, though.
News from the paintshop. Some good, some bad.
Firstly, an historical curiosity - confirmation that this car has been painted more than a few times in the past. We're talking multiple blowovers, not necessarily done with all due care. The car was beginning to look a bit like a patchwork quilt before this latest escapade, with different shades of what should be the same colour starting to make an appearance!
Secondly, a gripe - the guy doing the welding is having to re-do some work that had been done before under Gary's ownership, because the quality isn't up to scratch. The bodyshop that did the previous job on it had a decent reputation once upon a time....guess we know now why they aren't there any more.
Thirdly, some better news - the car has had a full inspection underneath now, and it's perfect. Once these bits of body are sorted, the car should be very easy to maintain in great condition.
Fourthly, a confession - I don't have a fourth point to make
Firstly, an historical curiosity - confirmation that this car has been painted more than a few times in the past. We're talking multiple blowovers, not necessarily done with all due care. The car was beginning to look a bit like a patchwork quilt before this latest escapade, with different shades of what should be the same colour starting to make an appearance!
Secondly, a gripe - the guy doing the welding is having to re-do some work that had been done before under Gary's ownership, because the quality isn't up to scratch. The bodyshop that did the previous job on it had a decent reputation once upon a time....guess we know now why they aren't there any more.
Thirdly, some better news - the car has had a full inspection underneath now, and it's perfect. Once these bits of body are sorted, the car should be very easy to maintain in great condition.
Fourthly, a confession - I don't have a fourth point to make
Permabanned
All i can say is you have been really lucky with what you found, iv seen some absolutely horrible ones.
Some more shots of it stripped:
Some more cutting of crap metal and adding of better metal should have been done by the time I type this. As an addition to my previous post, there's a reason the underneath of the car is perfectly solid - it's been Waxoyled three times in its life!
Also, Gary found a slightly less expensive way of getting a proper Winged 'B' mascot for the front of the car. Find one that someone has converted into a paperweight, and convert it back!
Some more cutting of crap metal and adding of better metal should have been done by the time I type this. As an addition to my previous post, there's a reason the underneath of the car is perfectly solid - it's been Waxoyled three times in its life!
Also, Gary found a slightly less expensive way of getting a proper Winged 'B' mascot for the front of the car. Find one that someone has converted into a paperweight, and convert it back!
Associate
Wow...what a car...watching with interest
Permabanned
That was a very good idea for the flying B i wouldnt have thought of that.
Wow...what a car...watching with interest
Cheers mate!
Ah, you see pal - we're smarter than the average bears!
So, an update.
Got some photos to post, will get them up as soon as I can. Bodywork and paint should hopefully be finished midway through this month so we can start the reassembly. Going to have to do that without the original starter motor however, as the venerable Lucas unit cried enough when the paintshop guys tried to move the car the other day.
*sigh*
Upon being told this by Gary, I did what any mate would do - hunted for a way to save him money and improve the car at the same time Such a solution exists - Powerlite makes a reduction-gear starter to replace the original Lucas that draws less power, weighs less, and spins the motor quicker. It's also a ****-load cheaper than sourcing a Lucas one would be! A quick call to Holden Vintage & Classic to confirm that the part will strap onto the '89 car, and all is well. Starter should be delivered this week or next.
Got some photos to post, will get them up as soon as I can. Bodywork and paint should hopefully be finished midway through this month so we can start the reassembly. Going to have to do that without the original starter motor however, as the venerable Lucas unit cried enough when the paintshop guys tried to move the car the other day.
*sigh*
Upon being told this by Gary, I did what any mate would do - hunted for a way to save him money and improve the car at the same time
Such a solution exists - Powerlite makes a reduction-gear starter to replace the original Lucas that draws less power, weighs less, and spins the motor quicker. It's also a ****-load cheaper than sourcing a Lucas one would be! A quick call to Holden Vintage & Classic to confirm that the part will strap onto the '89 car, and all is well. Starter should be delivered this week or next.
I'm sorry, but I didn't really follow the original thread too much.
Just how serviceable was the car before all of the work you put in? I've really fallen in love with some of the old Sprints/Spurs/Mulssanes/Turbo Rs at work and am starting to talk myself into saving up and buying one as my next car.
As always, if there is anything you think I can help with get in contact. If I can't help I'm sure I know someone who can.
Just how serviceable was the car before all of the work you put in? I've really fallen in love with some of the old Sprints/Spurs/Mulssanes/Turbo Rs at work and am starting to talk myself into saving up and buying one as my next car.
As always, if there is anything you think I can help with get in contact. If I can't help I'm sure I know someone who can
.
If by 'did', you mean 'mackled up beyond belief', then yeah
Last time that car came up for sale, the then-owner gave the full story - the show spent far more than they claimed, sold it at a loss, during the painting they had to replace the dash as they melted the original in the oven, it had a bloody big patch of filler in the back passenger-side arch, and he'd spent £400 putting that 'restored' car through the previous MOT.The stuff that was needed to make it truly usable was getting the drivers seat control module working, bottom ball-joint on one side, a top-up of LHM and a vacuum pipe in the engine. Everything else has been about making it pretty again - the leather, the wood, the body and paint, rubber seals, etc.
You know that hoary old cliché about how if you can afford two of a car you can afford to run one?
To be honest, they aren't as bad as all that. The biggest problem is when you have work done by a shop - people look at, assume you're moneyed, and double their prices. We've been lucky with some local outfits when we've had to call on them, but others want to charge the Earth or simply refuse to have anything to do with it (even though at the end of the day it's probably less complex than the nearly-new Audi they've got parked in the workshop....go figure).
If you're serious about having a Bentley, save up for a Turbo R. Motronic rather than K-Jet fuel injection from '87 (the Mulsannes didn't get Motronic until 1990), Panhard rod at the back, stiffer anti-roll bars front and back, firmer dampers and springs. If you want the R-R, get one with the best brightwork you can find, even if it means having to do work on the car in other areas, because replacing trim on one of those can bankrupt you!
As always, if there is anything you think I can help with get in contact. If I can't help I'm sure I know someone who can
Know anything about the cruise control on the '89 model? That's the next job after we reassemble the car - get that thing working.
So, the new starter finally arrived (manufacturer was on a shut-down, so Holden didn't get stock when they thought they would). Currently being fitted.
New problem - we've got a leak! Specifically, when the car was put in the air to get the starter motor swapped out, something looking suspiciously like LHM was seen dripping at the back (LHM being that green oil found in Citroen hydraulic systems along with the cack-handed self-levelling setup in the back of R-R/Bentley models of this vintage). We'd noticed a few marks on the driveway before, obviously with the suspension unloaded the leak is a bit worse....filing this one under 'sort another time'. Until then, we'll just have to keep topping the system up.
Next week the car should get some paint on it. And once it comes back I've got a rush-job on my hands to get the car together for a little outing that it's been promised for in September.
New problem - we've got a leak! Specifically, when the car was put in the air to get the starter motor swapped out, something looking suspiciously like LHM was seen dripping at the back (LHM being that green oil found in Citroen hydraulic systems along with the cack-handed self-levelling setup in the back of R-R/Bentley models of this vintage). We'd noticed a few marks on the driveway before, obviously with the suspension unloaded the leak is a bit worse....filing this one under 'sort another time'. Until then, we'll just have to keep topping the system up.
Next week the car should get some paint on it. And once it comes back I've got a rush-job on my hands to get the car together for a little outing that it's been promised for in September.
It's taken me a while to get around to posting this, because the story makes me almost want to weep with frustration about how a fairly simple job just snowballs.
The car went in to get some bodywork tidied and fresh paint. There was a bit more bodywork to do than was initially thought, so this made the job take longer. The starter motor packed in while the car was being shunted back and forth at the paintshop, so we ordered one. The manufacturer of them was on a shut-down, so it took longer to arrive than anticipated. It eventually arrived, and was handed to the mechanic to fit.
It didn't.
One strangled curse later, I ask Gary to confirm that the starter motor was the right model, and that Holden hadn't sent the wrong one by accident even though they'd invoiced for the correct one (3spd and 4spd cars use different motors, obviously). It was. But none of the bolt holes lined up. There was a good reason for that as it turned out - they'd been drilled wrong. In fact, we're pretty sure that the entire batch was drilled wrong. So someone has probably lost their job over that one....
Scott the mechanic took the dead motor over to a local auto electrical outfit and asked them to rebuild it. He didn't tell them what it came off, apparently they guessed at several things but didn't get the answer until he told them. Meanwhile, Holden are refunding Gary for the unusable starter motor. Scott then refitted the original motor, and it works perfectly. Apparently they had to do quite a bit to it, as these motors don't fail at the first hint of trouble - they wait until they're completely destroyed before giving up
Anyway, now that the car is back on the ground again the leak at the back appears to have stopped. Hoping it was just overfill combined with the system being unloaded. Which would be nice, because that God-awful mess that R-R/Bentley stuck on the back of these cars and laughingly declared to be a good rear suspension is a bit expensive to sort.
Car probably won't be back and on the road in time for the outing we were hoping to give it (MOT's up next week as well, so we need to reassemble the car before we can get that done). Hoping we get a better September than August was, I've had my fill of working on that car in the rain.
The car went in to get some bodywork tidied and fresh paint. There was a bit more bodywork to do than was initially thought, so this made the job take longer. The starter motor packed in while the car was being shunted back and forth at the paintshop, so we ordered one. The manufacturer of them was on a shut-down, so it took longer to arrive than anticipated. It eventually arrived, and was handed to the mechanic to fit.
It didn't.
One strangled curse later, I ask Gary to confirm that the starter motor was the right model, and that Holden hadn't sent the wrong one by accident even though they'd invoiced for the correct one (3spd and 4spd cars use different motors, obviously). It was. But none of the bolt holes lined up. There was a good reason for that as it turned out - they'd been drilled wrong. In fact, we're pretty sure that the entire batch was drilled wrong. So someone has probably lost their job over that one....
Scott the mechanic took the dead motor over to a local auto electrical outfit and asked them to rebuild it. He didn't tell them what it came off, apparently they guessed at several things but didn't get the answer until he told them. Meanwhile, Holden are refunding Gary for the unusable starter motor. Scott then refitted the original motor, and it works perfectly. Apparently they had to do quite a bit to it, as these motors don't fail at the first hint of trouble - they wait until they're completely destroyed before giving up
Anyway, now that the car is back on the ground again the leak at the back appears to have stopped. Hoping it was just overfill combined with the system being unloaded. Which would be nice, because that God-awful mess that R-R/Bentley stuck on the back of these cars and laughingly declared to be a good rear suspension is a bit expensive to sort.
Car probably won't be back and on the road in time for the outing we were hoping to give it (MOT's up next week as well, so we need to reassemble the car before we can get that done). Hoping we get a better September than August was, I've had my fill of working on that car in the rain.
Associate
Looks like you've got your hands full with this! It will be a lovely car once back on the road though and the feeling that you've saved something worthwhile will be all warm and fuzzy.