Project: Two storey/part single storey side and rear extensions

[kai]

This is a follow on from a thread back in June 2021 in this forum section whereby I purchased around 106 SQM of land from a farmer to the rear of my property. This purchase was always going to be part of a bigger project. Since the purchase and renovation of the ground we are now moving on to build.

Timeline:

• September 2022: Garden work complete including new perimeter fencing
• October: 2022: Sourced Architect and local planning consultants to help with application
• November: 2022: Revisions and submission
• January 2023: Approval of full planning (after some back and forth) with local authority (this is where the local planning consultant was of huge benefit)
  
  Jan-Feb
• Source builders (quotes, references etc.)
• Structural Engineer Calculations
• Architect to build out plans for building control
• Sort a new mortgage

This will likely be a slow burner thread as we honestly have no idea how long a build of this nature will take until we go into detail with a building contractor.

I only have around 10 months left on my mortgage; however I am hoping to clear the mortgage from savings and start a new mortgage as soon as we settle on build costs and contingency. At this point, i have in my mind (£80-£100K) excluding contingency and kitchen cost.

This is the design we settled on; there is some work to the front of property and side; but the following image gives a good idea of the goal. We have also decided to connect the garage as it has already been part converted as an office already (thread also on this forum). However, this will connect to the main house via a full glazed panel. The only other change we are thinking is a bath tub in the master in-front of the window as it overlooks the forest and is completely private.

 

[kai]

Inb4 heckles about no interior door to office.

This has been going back and forth with the architect. Working from home full time 100% (way before Covid was a thing) - i find being almost disconnected from the house and walking from the back door to office as a disconnect.
However, the wife wants double doors put in the boot room. I however want the storage space.

Bottom line: we will likely have an interior doors added.

 

[kai]

Will be interesting to see what sort of prices you get back.
Who is writing the spec and how many builders do you have in mind to go out to?

We have six different builders lined up. We are doing a fair amount of due diligence this time after being stung on the previous extension.

I was kind of cheeky; we have an award winning architecture firm near us. I reached out and asked them what builders do they use. To my surprise they provided their list for our area.

We have had one quote come in; but it has a lot of assumptions as we did not have all the details back in December. Total Cost to Undertake Works: £96,747.99excl. VAT All prices based on drawings provided by the architect.➢ Costs provided for budget purposes only –this is not a fixed price sum and rates are up for discussion.

I had our architect look over the inital quote "I believe they’ve used a professional QS (Quantity Surveyor) to do that for them so the prices are based on a national / regional index rather than local knowledge or the builder working it out himself (with subbies) which means the index will be slightly inflated."

I am still hopeful for 80-100k

 

[kai]

Looks awesome.

An internal door to the office would be a must for me, for the sole reason my cuppa tea would be cold by the time I got to the office!

I envy your home to office mileage .

I would never go back to working in an office.
It's likely some type of door will be included. It would be cool to have hidden door in the boot room. You have to open the cupboard door to walk through

 

[kai]

Looks good, just make sure you have a steelwork detail for them to be hidden in the ceilings wherever possible, looks far better than bulkheads. Particularly if ceiling height an issue.


Id also get a door to office

Ideal world @ but i have been advised!

"
The ideal situation is to have the steels flush with the floor (no bulkhead) but in my experience, this is very rarely possible due to joists span direction or simply because the steels are so big.



If the builder can do it, then great but for your own expectations, I would recommend you anticipate that you’ll have a bulkhead

 

[kai]

I think particularly for the kitchen/living room steel the connection detail and temporary works (acro propping) would be complex, but to be honest I'd say would make significant visual improvements, even if you said it cost 5k more due to complexity.


Ive got ones hidden in my ceiling from when an extension was done and think visually it is better than the ones I had put in as bulkheads to connect an extension - even with a 2.6m ceiling height

There's 3 steels in kitchen ceiling below you can't see /hidden in ceiling

Spoiler

I did this knock through from old house to 2012 extension (or my builders did..)


Plastered


Finished (sorry I've not cleaned for this photo..)



Kitchen (this is going to get a new worktop and tiles) - there's a large steel that runs above the hob across to the fridge which you can't see



[

Id really quiz your builders on can they do it / price for it, and have they done it for. They might need to take up carpets/flooring in above rooms.

Are you staying in the house during the development? I recall you said that previously you looked at moving, are you going to consider the renovation cost vs just moving or you all in now?


Also p.s. You still doing the bodybuilding/physique stuff? I recall that near 10 years ago in the sports arena forum... I don't visit there often now

• Id really quiz your builders on can they do it / price for it, and have they done it for. They might need to take up carpets/flooring in above rooms.
  Yes, if you see the interior plan; the entire staircase is moving. There will be a lot of disruption so new ceilings, flooring etc.
  
  
• Are you staying in the house during the development? I recall you said that previously you looked at moving, are you going to consider the renovation cost vs just moving or you all in now?
  We have a freind who lives opposite that have offered for us to move in (not as bad it sounds). They have a job that means they are away 2-3 months a time or for longer. The house is empty 80% of the year so we will likely cover everything for them. However, it might be possible to live in the house (not sure yet) but i have a 1 year old and a bulldog so ... yeah!
  
  We previously engaged on having a house built; but it fell through (we luckily got all our money back). We love the location we live and its really difficult to find something on par, we would looked at houses 2-3x times the cost of this but had an overlooking garden or somemthing that was a deal breaker for that amount of £
  
  
• Also p.s. You still doing the bodybuilding/physique stuff? I recall that near 10 years ago in the sports arena forum... I don't visit there often now
  Yes. LOL, i still train 4-5 times a week. Gone are the days of being a fitness model; hahaha but i like to keep lean (8-10% b.f year round). I now work long hours, so the dedication and commitment is a little difficult as i got older

 

[kai]

I may have missed it, but what's the total floor area of the extension?

Interested because we are about to embark on a double story extension both front and back, making the house a large "T" shape.

Honestly, i am not 100% sure. I am awaiting on the detailed plans to come back that will have everything for building control.

Have you looked into getting an extension on the front of the property; each council is different but apparently any changes to the front can be a nightmare and are often declined.




As a separate note, i should have become a structural engineer. First quote in - 5/6 beams and a steel portal frame calculation - £1,700 WOW

 

[kai]

We are down to the final two builders. We met with one builder on-site Friday and walked around the project. We also got to chat with the owners.

We now have the Draft Building Reg Plans and elevations plan. There is still plenty to do, such as the sections and details, as well as write up the construction specification. However, its something for the final two builders to review with the aim of finalizing a fixed quote.

Both builders can start work in April / May time frame so provided we get the quote nailed down over the next few weeks i can secure the funds (re-mortgage) and things should start moving quickly. Both builders see this as a six month project.

 

[kai]

Our preferred builder has caused a few red flags this last week; so we have gone back to the drawing board.

• We visited a huge house the builder is near finishing (million+ house so was very impressive)
• The quality of the work was excellent
• We spoke with the owners as they were in the house at the time - all seems to be going well.
• We then met at our house to walk through everything, to provide more context for him to prepare a final fixed quote.
• He pushed and pushed to find out our max budget - i reluctantly provided and said £150K (my mistake). He knew what sort of ball park we was working with beforehand not avoid any time wasting on both sides.
• He requested we list everything down on paper that we want. As such that weekend we provided a pretty detailed list

The quote arrived Sunday evening; whereby he has simply put his company name on top (no mention of any i.e. fixed quote, assumptions etc) and copy and pasted our list word for word with zero changes and put the price at the end (suprise, its the max budget).

TOTAL £150,000.00 Holding deposit required 10% (£15,000.00) 3 payments throughout project.
He refuses to provide any breakdown other than this is the total for the job. Plus he wants basically £60K to start (holding and £50k)


The quote also does not also include any figures for bathrooms; kitchens; flooring's; etc. All of which has been confirmed (verbally) are included, only over the phone he has said, ive ballparked £25K for kitchen and utility.

Is this normal practice for some builders? As you can appreciate this is a lot of money for us; and a huge project from our standpoint. I have asked that we have full clarification in writing on several items such as any assumptions. He does not seem to be able to provide this and wants to base everything off this quote.

We approached another contractor early on in the process who has provided full breakdowns including individual items as listed by a QS. He was able to do this; without the level of detail we have provided this builder.

 

[kai]

So the builder has come back after i told him there is no way i can work to the following specification; i need further break downs etc.

I now receive the following email quote:

Partial demolition of existing extension, rubble to be removed.
Foundation to be raft construction, drainage to sewers connect to existing.
Scaffolding around extension to be built.
As set out on previous quotation carpentry, plumbing, electrical, plastering included.
Pc sum for utility room and kitchen, appliances, worktops plus fitting. £20,000.00.as per plan
Bathroom and ensuite same standard as client visited. £2500.00 per suite.
Flooring to match existing

If you require full breakdown by a QS extra cost to cover their fees will apply.

Like its better but even still its really light on deliverables. Also wants to charge for us to have a cost breakdown err?

 

[kai]

Mortgage offer has been accepted today (what a palaver). It is now with the legal team of Halifax. With a bit of luck, i will have the funds next week and the work starts the 1st week of May.

The builder thinks we are looking at 5-6 months. We plan to live at the house (until they need to breakthrough) - has anyone lived at home while extension work has been going on (any tips)?

 

[kai]

Spent some time this weekend doing some 3D planning and renders; so we can walk around the house (virtually) to see the flow but also get an understanding on what we need to purchase etc. Here are a few snapshots.

There should be a huge flat skylight above the corner couch and two vaulted ceiling velux windows each side of the barn door as we have a glass walkway. However, i am not that good on the program to be able to add these


Another angle of the kitchen



New Master Bedroom


Snug

 

[kai]

@kai looks great, what's the projected cost to build?

We almost have our plans finalised, going to be submitting for planning (8 week process atm), by the end of month!!!

Around £160K - but that is everything (kitchen, x2 bathrooms, utility, interior / exterior doors etc) (we had quotes over £250K) it was wildly different from builder to builder.

Good luck, everything just takes ages.
just make sure you factor Building control fees, structural engineer, potential addtional architectural fees and in my case i had to pay fees to borrow/change mortgage etc.

 

[kai]

The calm before the storm; the ground work starts next Tuesday. The scheudle of work for the foundation is two weeks. The existing extension will be more or less also coming down; but will be utalizing the existing raft.

This past weekend i had the task of digging up plants; borders etc but will give a good indication of the footprint from the drone shot as we will be connecting the existing extension; with the red square (double extension) plus connecting the garage as the utility room/existing office..

 

[kai]

Looking forward to the updates on this, should be a cracking project.

Like already mentioned regarding dust, it will get everywhere. When big smashy smashy and dusty works are happening, try tape up door and or have a dust sheet hung up to help on exposed penetrations. It will get everywhere!

Now, the important bit from me (that I say to everyone doing these builds).... Where is you lighting plan?

If the answer is "builder / sparky" is sorting it, then you will need some help, as a builder or sparky usually have less than no clue on how to spec lighting!

The right lighting can make even a average house look incredible, plus doesn't have to coat a bomb.

I have been using the 3D render program; including location of sockets etc. We have agreed with the builder that every room will have spotlights; apart from the master bedroom (vaulted ceiling) and bedside mounted wall lights. While the kitchen island will also a hanging pendants. The house is also fully kitted out, as of today in Philips Hue. Every lamp in every room, etc is controlled.

I have also have marked out on our plan for wanting picture lighting; and outside wall lights.

Examples



Boot Room Entry:



Bedside lights and hanging pendant.

 

[kai]

Getting to this point; its been expensive and not something i had initally thought would have cost as much. i.e Building Control (£900) Structural Engineer (£1,600), Local Planning consultant help (£500).

If anyone is planning something like this; i would say add a good amount of contingency. I am saying this without even a spade going into the ground yet

I am going to try keep a log.

• Planning, Building Control Architectural Design etc £4,680.00
• Mortage Fees (transfer; early repayment fees ) £2,129.03

*if i include the purchase of new garden land and landscaping done prior to planning submission as it was required due to proposed size of extension.

• New Land Purchase (est 100SQM) £4,322.00
• Landscaping New Land / Fence £6,660.11

Total £17,791.14

 

[kai]

le just doing a little dig through the forums, as I'm thinking of converting my garage to an office/gaming space, and wow! I'm actually scared just to think how much it might just cost! Mine is no where near as complex as yours! But I do think I'll need to submit for planning.. this is going

I did a full log of my garage to office - might want to check that out. There are also other members who have done the same.

Garage Conversion (Office & Utility Room)

Working from home full time, I find it difficult to sometimes separate a work-life balance, especially as I work really long hours. We have also needed to convert one of the bedrooms into an office. As such, I recently decided to split our office into an office/utility. The garage is not...

forums.overclockers.co.uk

You will easy spend north 100k for the whole lot I reckon

We have a fixed price project with our full spec at £160K

This also includes
2x Ex Composite Doors
Solid Oak Doors throughtout including a sliding barn door
1 master bathroom suite (including new tiles,finishes)
1 en-suite (including new tiles,finishes)
Kitchen & Utility
Appliances
Flooring (LVT) throughout
Quartz Worktops

Looks great, that’s going to be a huge steel supporting the original upstairs of the house. Just bare in mind that you may get cracking for settlement upstairs when they remove the strkngboys / acrow props

I have over 130 pages of calculations such as stress loading etc; here was the overview part i think you are reffering to.

 

[kai]

Are you getting the structural steelwork put into the ceiling so you don't have the "bulkhead" in your room reducing ceiling height? That's what I'd do if you can!

Got quite a lot of steelwork in my house and much neater where it is /can be hidden.

To give you a flavour, the big steel (if it ends up being the larger size) will be 305mm height and approx 300wide which is pretty chunky. Google will tell you the steel dimensions if you're not familiar.


Edit: whoops I realise I asked this before! Any updates on the builders proposal?

The plan is to try and get a lot of the steelwork lifted (if possible). However, in some cases it can look like a feature of the room. It is going to be reviewed as we go along.

Builders proposals; are finalized - we selected a contractor (£160k fixed) - how close we stick to that is another thing; but we have everything listed and he has signed off against it per the design. Offically;' ground work starts next Tuesday (Gulp!)

 

[kai]

Day 2: Foundations well underway. I am hoping they are going be poured by Monday.

 

[kai]

How's it getting on @kai ?

Steel was fitted Thursday with 2 layers of A393 mesh.

Friday; we had the concrete poured (it was a fully loaded 8m3 truck via chute)

It's really hard to appreciate from the photo's how big the area actually is. The fact it will be going connecting to the garage, existing extension and kitchen as one open plan is hard to comprehend