Project: Two storey/part single storey side and rear extensions

[kai]

Update: It turns out he hasn't ordered the doors that were supposedly placed before Christmas. They were supposed to arrive last Friday and be fitted this week as promised. Despite our continuous chasing, today we've been informed that it will be another 2-3 weeks before they arrive, according to him. We've reached our limit and made it clear that we won't accept any more delays. We informed him that the cost of the doors will simply be deducted from the final payment.

He seemed to agree, futher indicating that he hasn't ordered them as he would have issues canceling the order etc. However, he insisted that the replacement doors must be within a certain price range. We informed him that we've found a local supplier who can deliver and fit them within 7-10 days, and the price will be non-negotiable—it's simply deducted from the final payment, end of discussion.

Additionally, regarding the Juliet glass, it was supposedly suppose to be here last Friday as we have been chasing every day. However, today, a builder asked if he could enter our bedroom to take measurements. When I inquired about the purpose, he mentioned he needed to size up for the Juliet glass so it can be ordered. He requested that I keep it quiet as the Developer told him not to tell us, but he didn't want to enter the room without first asking for permission.

 

[kai]

you didn't seem to have shown us outdoor picture - but you already have a steel frame of some kind to take glass

wrt to bathroom pics & sink waste - did the professional snaggers check out/sign off the plumbing and waste falls.

Not sure i understand; the juilet balcony will be fixed into the brickwork. It's not a balcony we can stand on.

The snagger will still be carrying out his work when the developer say's he has finished.

 

[kai]

That waste is interesting.... does that mean when the bath drains it'll smell of turd?

The toilet waste soil and pipe going is from the basin. Bath is other side of the room and on a separate connector.

Nightmare all round tbh, that includes the OP and the builder. It screams of being poorly specified, poorly managed and poorly communicated, unfortunately some of that is on the OP.

I agree (to a certain extent; in my defense, I'm not in the trade, and it's not like I'm involved in this type of process frequently. About 95% of the processes we've been through was entirely new to us.

Furthermore, regarding items being poorly specified, I'm not sure how much more specific we could have been. Our architect, who is an award winner, provided extensive specifications and made efforts to communicate with the developer throughout the process. When the developer refused to work with our architect, we tried bringing in a (QS), but unfortunately, that route also failed. Yes, the quote being more clear is 100% on me; but when i put forward a QS breakdown; at quote level he refused to review and wanted to go off his working knowledge and 30+ years in the trade.

We should have been wiser and had dates and works scheudle/time-frames built into the contract - that is on me! (we was promised a works scheudle verbally but that never materialized)

 

[kai]

Just don't let the u-bend of the sink run dry (if Bob The Bodger even fitted one) or you will get sewer smells through the sink plughole as dlockers mentions. I'd give that system thorough test to make sure it doesn't gargle back.

You really need to gather up all the evidence of unprofessionalism, lost money, poor workmanship, delays, anguish and lost hair follicles and let it be known that under no ******* circumstances will you be giving a reference to anybody. Would you really want somebody else to go through all what you have?

We are taking further action to ensure that no one else has to endure such an ordeal. Sadly, we've discovered several clients experiencing even worse situations—projects dragging on for three years without essentials like kitchens, front doors, or even running water.

Regarding the plumbing issue, I believe I'll need to hire a plumber to come and inspect the work. Last night, after officially moving in, we ran the kitchen sink only to find the entire unit flooded. It turns out they didn't connect the overflow pipe properly; it was just loosely shoved at the back without a seal. The pressure of the water pushed it out, resulting in a complete soaking of everything.

We ordered our front doors yesterday, opting for two composite doors. However, we quickly discovered that it's nearly impossible to order the size of door we need for our side entry in composite material, as it's under 2 meters. As a result, we had to settle for a fully glazed uPVC door, similar to the full-height front window. What we find amusing is how he claimed to have ordered this door when it's not really feasible. This further confirms our suspicions that he hasn't even placed the order.

 

[kai]

He's already given a reference to the builders next potential client - by means of letting them into the house to 'have a look around' - basically endorsing the builder.

Couldn't make it up.

9 posts and all largely negative . Not that this justifies a response.

If you actually read my post I invited them in and told them my opinion's with factual evidence and photos. Because they got invited in; does not mean I was endorsing him in any way shape or form.

They can choose to ignore my advice; that’s on them but not sure what else I could have done. If I had been given this information; I certainly would not have made the choice to proceed.

 

[kai]

Any decent person would have refused to showcase your home.in these circumstances, and if they had been manipulated to do so - at least have the humam decency to warm them of the nightmare you have experienced.

I am not going to go into detail here. I'll repeat my statement "... and told them my opinion's with factual evidence and photos"

 

[kai]

Refused to show them around your house.

I showed some photos and outlined my timeline in the hallway as the door was open and back forth with trades .

I did not show them around the house.

 

[kai]

Update: Toilet has been fixed (it also goes back to the tiles) however instead of replacing with the toilet we picked (and paid for) it's been replaced with a WC2GO ScrewFix budget! toilet. A £60 all on one package deal, cistern and toilet seat; it look's ok in the photo but its very cheap and plasticky! - we had this done yesterday when both I and the wife was not present.

Also little things; its something i can replace no problem but i now have to go buy/fit a push fit in matt black to match as we had already paid for it on the previous toilet.

I am not happy with the pipe work either; so i am going need to box this in or something

 

[kai]

What on earth is with this guy?! That pipework is simply horrendous.

Looks like the sink waste runs into the toilet waste - that’s a recipe for disaster, and likely another shortcut taken

This is exactly what is happening. The sink waste water is going into the toilet pipe and into the main soil pipe. I believe something like this was used.

Viva 90° Flexible Pan Connector Inc Pipe Boss

SLINKY-FIT Pan Connectors are a very flexible pan connector which have a wire reinforced giving them strength and stability in the most flexible situations. They also have a Smart-Flo design extension tube which helps to prevent any sediment build up which could cause a future blockage.• 1¼" top...

www.toolstation.com

 

[kai]

The sink waste running into a boss on the soil pipe is not really an issue (other than cosmetic) as long as the flush does not suction all the water out of the sink trap. If it does there are traps with valves that will solve the issue.

Yes, its not really aesthetically pleasing or is the direct pipe feeding into it. My wife has covered it up with a small laundry basket for now. No issue with sink trap (right now) But eventually we are going have it covered and new toilet or vanity toilet put in.

How far are you from this being over? I've not used the word finished for a reason.

Not long , we sourced our doors last week without informing the developer, resulting in nearly £4K off the bill (he knows as we told him, just no the cost or we have placed an order). If the Juliet glass doesn't arrive by Friday, we'll also source that ourselves. The only remaining issue is the extensive pointing needed outside, and we're in the dark about the color he picked for the lamitex. We're pushing him to finish that this week, but he's citing bad weather.

Hope you've pushed back on this, what a nightmare this guy sounds like.

It's coming off the bill. I am taking £300 off for a new toilet and £150-200 for fitting. That again will be shown will the rest of receipts. We have spent so much on materials here and there for the guys ; like even really basic stuff like builders caulk, mastic etc as he will not let trades pick stuff up without him sourcing and simply delays things further - we just want them gone and finished.

The tiling looks sub par also.

The finish really makes all the difference, it's a shame they've done this

Hadn’t even noticed the tiling at first, but on closer inspection of the photo, the wall tiling really isn’t great.

I’m no tiler, but I’ve fitted tiles a lot better than that…looks like someone doesn’t take enough pride in their work.

It's not amazing; the tiles do however need to be cleaned and buffed. its a very poor job on the mastic etc which i need to sort.

Here is a higher resolution.

 

[kai]

I'd change the toilet unit to something like this from my house. Will hide all the plumbing.

I'm doing the same for my downstairs bathroom.

This is exactly what we did downstairs and in the ensuites.

That looks really nice @Buffman , love the wall tiles.

 

[kai]

Does anyone have any suggestions here?

They finally cleared the rubbish today, and the new brickwork on the garage is now visible. To me, this looks of a pretty poor standard. A local firm did 95% of the work to a good standard. However, this section was done at a later date by a 17/18-year-old hired for a few days. It looks pretty rough.

Apart from re-pointing (being done next week), is there anything that can be done under the door/aco drain to remove the large smudges of cement?

The drive is also pretty much ruined; it has large gouges and cement stains like the one in the picture all over it. I assume acid will shift the cement.

 

[kai]

Yeah there has been a few **** ups and maybe the builder has some anger issues but tbh OP has ended up with quite a nice product. The plumber looks like the biggest clown.

I got the impression that the OP created a spec and expected the builder to follow it. In the OP own words "I'm not in the trade, and it's not like I'm involved in this type of process frequently. About 95% of the processes we've been through was entirely new to us", there was probably tension from the start especially if the builders experience and knowledge is being questioned. Maybe the OP is a difficult client?

I think its more unrealistic to expect a project of that size to not run over, from what the OP said it hasn't by much anyway.

The developer had a pretty detailed specification provided by the architect and structural engineers, totaling well over 100 pages. Additionally, I provided 3D renders of every room and top-down views.

I understand that my posts are going to come across as one-sided (there is no one to argue the case from the other side); however, overall, we have ended up with a resonable end product. It' wasn't like we did things on the cheap. Down this area, £160K get's you a lot for your money. We didn't just go with the cheapest quote.

The biggest issues have been the plumbing and 1st fix carpenter (both of which the developer has confirmed has been an embrassement to his work and both been fired, so we are told)

Nevertheless, the journey has been somewhat chaotic. The original outline aimed for completion by September 2023. Unfortunately, this deadline kept getting pushed back, making it clear that we had nowhere to live after December. Despite all assurances and promises, a definite completion date has still not been given. We moved in a little over a week ago, but we still have no secure doors, and work on the exterior has not even begun. We have gone with our own window and door company now and will sort finance out later.

What was initially planned as a 4/5-month project is now looking like it will take 12-13 months to complete. While delays were expected, the process, struggles, and outright lies/aggression were not. We are told we are the lucky ones, because we have been stubborn, contacting him frequently and not backing down and following up with formal emails etc it has had no choice to push on or end terms. Some projects (we have been told) are still going on 3 years down the line without basic items like heating or running water.

Also in my defense:
Imagine some guy coming up to you dismissing all of your experience and presenting an alternative path.

I expected something a bit more than 5-6 bullet points on a page (the first quote given). For that sort of money, i was going to need more information as every other builder has provided breakdowns, 2 of them are doing full QS excersises to ensure accuracy. Alarm bells should have been ringing then (again this is on me and lesson learnt)!

All of that should be a walk in the park for someone with "30 years experience" you're almost excusing his behaviour.

Didn't he steal one of the ovens as well?

Ha, i almost forgot about that. The oven that was still on our bill (even though it was refunded to his account) went magically missing and i later found was used on another job.

 

[kai]

We have received our Juliet glass, but it's not what we ordered with the developer (surprise, surprise), both in terms of color and its depth from the wall (the non-opening side will be extremely difficult to clean). At this point, I'm somewhat exhausted by the hassle of arguing and have decided to live with it for the time being. I plan to either have it sprayed white or wait until we get building sign-off to replace it with an actual frameless single glass piece.

From the outside, it looks okay, apart from the combination of satin chrome on black on white

Not so great from the inside the inside.

He is due to start the landscaping outside next week and is already mentioning drainage and various other considerations that impacting him doing what is quoted. Although we have technically paid most of the amount due, with only £6,500 remaining (of which we have used £3,900 to purchase front doors independently), there are still outstanding issues.

I have a landscaper and gardener whom we've worked with in the past coming tomorrow to provide a quote. I believe we are at a point where we should have him finish the pointing work on the outside next week, and then we can consider refusing to pay the remaining £2,600, as correcting or rectifying many of the issues could end up costing us significantly more

 

[kai]

Don't let him anywhere near the garden!

The developer had penciled in one day to get everything done this week, including digging out and replacing the old slabs, covering an area of around 36 square meters. However, he refused to replace any slabs he had broken or not protected.
We made the decision to hire a reputable landscaper we've used in the past to handle the leveling and runoff. It became apparent that it would take him and his team around 2-3 days just to dig out the area and level it properly. Additionally, he refused to reuse all the old slabs, claiming they were unusable due to damage caused by the developer. Based on the landscaper's recommendations, we've decided to deck the entire area with good quality composite decking, allowing for a level walkout from the kitchen. Although the landscaper can't start the work until June, we're willing to wait to ensure it's done properly.

This project will address the bottom end of the garden and the mess left by the builder. We plan to tackle the top end later in the year, (around 50-60 sqm of decking needed) where we'll be installing a bar, pizza oven, and undercover pergola/kitchen, once funds.

We phoned the developer and firmly instructed him, "Do not touch our garden," emphasising that we would be installing decking later in the year. However, he immediately attempted to sell us composite decking cheap that he had left from another job and insisted on discussing the pricing of the remaining funds.





As for the driveway rear door this was fitted on Friday. It was so refreshing to actually have a company come in and take pride in the work. Arrive on time, put down dust-sheets and clean up after them. Faith is somewhat restored to know there are geniue companies out there wanting to provide a good quality service.

The developer will need to repoint the brickwork outside, as there are numerous gaps that need attention. Additionally, I've requested them to apply acid to the drive and address some of the bricks below the door. There's just some pointing left, and they need to finish the inside of the door reveal with plaster and proper finishing. Once these tasks are completed, we can finally move and get rid of him for GOOD

 

[kai]

Good to know you are nearly done with the build. It must be a bit of a relief.

As you have the time before the landscaper can start get a couple more quotes just to check the pricing and what he is telling you.
I get vibes he is trying to upsell you a bit and 2 to 3 days to dig out 36 square meters seems excessive unless he is hand digging it.

Yes, unfortunately, we had to dig out the area by hand because we no longer have the luxury of digger access, primarily due to the change in property entry and the existing decking in the way. Decking, although more expensive in materials, requires less labor, while slabs are more expensive in labor but cheaper in materials.

It was much the same and i feel the decking would look better.

 

[kai]

You dont even have a standard sized back gate access?

Yes, the new entry opens to stepped decking. When we initially had the decking built, we didn't have the extension in mind or access to the rear garden ever being there. We plan to remove the deck from this side of the garden and rebuild it when we're ready to incorporate the outdoor kitchen, etc. Unfortunately, we can't afford to have it all done at the same time right now. If we were able to do so, we could bring in the digger in expedite the process of the new decking / slabs further down.

 

[kai]

Would you not be better off starting doing this outdoor bit and the levelling out the same time so that you can get use of the digger rather then having all the ground worked by hand? surely saving money overall?

Now that we have decided to do the decking (in hindsight) it's a much better solution. This now gives the added benefit of the entire kitchen when the doors are open being linked to the outside at the same level, thus no digging is required. For older family, freinds etc just makes things so much easier with no added steps. Plus i think it will look a lot smarter than indian sandstone.

This is the decking colour we have picked and how the finish will be in terms of level.

 

[kai]

The saga continues, and the issues with the **** plumber's work persist. This morning, my wife was running a bath while I was eating breakfast in the kitchen. Suddenly, I heard a drop of water, then another, and I looked up to see water coming from the ceiling lights. I sprinted upstairs, thinking she had forgotten about the bath, but to my surprise, the bath wasn't even a quarter full.

I've turned off the water flow, but it has spread across the ceiling, and it's likely that the entire section of the kitchen ceiling will need repainting. I have no idea what damage it may have caused that isn't immediately visible—I'm hoping these things will just dry out over time.

My wife called the developer, who comically tried to blame the cold weather. Someone is supposedly coming on Monday, but she insisted it's an issue with the inside pipes and demanded that X (the competent worker) come up here immediately.


I believe it's coming from the freestanding bath tap. I assume floors are going need to come etc

 

[kai]

Surely the bath tap was tested after it was moved closer to the bath..??

I'd be asking for a copy of this bloke's indemnity insurance. Keep a receipt of every single penny the inevitable repairs and remedial work costs and send him the bill, via MoneyClaimOnline if necessary.

Yes, the bath tap was tested after it was moved, and we've used it several times already without issue.

Upon inspection, the issue was identified as a broken seal and a poor-quality shower hose leaking. This leakage caused water to drip onto the floor, running toward the back of the bath where the outlet is located, given that it's a freestanding bath.

The plumber who came to fix it on Friday essentially attributed the problem to a poor-quality freestanding tap. He mentioned something about it being a European product and lacking the British kite mark, indicating that the quality was not up to standard. As a precautionary measure, he replaced all the internal washers to ensure a more secure fix. I have also replaced the shower head with a bidget shower head (as he recommended) as it's only used to clean the bath.