*** Rogue One: A Star Wars Story *** (NOW WITH SPOILERS)

[ChroniC]

Wow such high praise. I thought it was average. Watchable maybe enjoyable but it did nothing for me to excite me to say it was great..
Would need another viewing to determine why I didn't enjoy the start so much. The weirdness of the chopping and changing worlds with big signposts telling me where they were and music trying to drive home to me the fact I should be on the edge of my seat kinda ruin it (aka the pacing at the start was just way to fast).
By half way I was losing a decent amount of interest.
That said the second half was good. I say second half, from the rebels leaving for Scarif..
Comedy robot was a completely waste of time, didn't enjoy Starwars stand up (a poor attempt at a c3po personality) and some of the lines were so corny.. The ending comes to mind when the signal tower blasts out in loud words.. Signal aligned ready to send your signal now! That's very imperialistic, Not..
Darthvaders catwalk strut out didn't command the fear it should have either and his force claw hand was ridiculous.
Definitely not the best starwars ever.

PS.. Those cgi faces were comically obvious.

 

[Vale]

I caught a late showing over at Dudley last night. Thought it was a solid 7/10.

Spoiler

Not sure what the thinking was behind killing off ALL the new cast, the blind guy and his laser rifle wielding mate could have escaped on a ship and that would have enabled them to have their own story line/film which could have been good. The droid was good, did not care much for Jin or the Asian commander with her. Expected so much, maybe my expectations ruined it but I thought it would have been better than it was. Still 7/10 worth a watch.

Liked the Vader bit, space battle was good also. The Princess Leia at the end reminded me of how hot Carrie Fisher used to be, spin the clock forward 36 years to what she looks like now - If I'd have married her in '77 I'd be asking for a refund right about now.

 

[Kyo]

The music I can forgive because the guy had only a month to score it, that is a fraction of what they normally get. I bet John Williams would have got 6 months + to score any one of them.

The CGI I can forgive in terms of where they are, but how they used it it felt too much and too up front.

It is the characters that I found lacking. We had about an hour before the movie really got going and we learn nothing about anyone but Jyn really. We only know Cassian has been fighting since he was 6 years old and that he will shoot his own side, that was his ONLY line about his background. We know Bodhi (the pilot who rebel) was influenced by Jyn's father but that was it, I don't know much about the 2 monks are they both monks?

An hour to introduce character we really could have known more about them and would help me care more at the end. The characters in Rogue One is far too one dimensional.

I think they could have done better. Don't get me wrong I loved it but for me I think they could have been even better.

Music - why didn't they use John Williams original tunes? It is Star Wars and is in the same universe. The music was almost like a poor man's rip off or off key version of original music. I get they wanted the have its own identity but missed a trick imo. Which leads to my next point.

Opening - why didn't they use the famous opening crawl.???

CGi - really good points mentioned by some, if shows like Westworld can do a good job, the grade for this calibre of movie simply wasn't good enough. The latest Final Fantasy really sets the bar of just how good it can be.

- did I mention Donnie Yen????. I'd rather they saved him to be a new Jedi Knight in the future upcoming films.

 

[v0n]

- did I mention Donnie Yen????. I'd rather they saved him to be a new Jedi Knight in the future upcoming films.

They can't. R1 takes place before original trilogy. Not only does original trilogy stipulate Luke being the last Jedi knight but episode VII happens 30+ years after RoTJ. Donnie Yen would have to play 90 year old guy in ep VIII.

 

[Kyo]

They can't. R1 takes place before original trilogy. Not only does original trilogy stipulate Luke being the last Jedi knight but episode VII happens 30+ years later. Donnie Yen would have to play 90 year old guy in ep VIII.

You missed my point!

I'd rather they saved Donnie for another character down the line in the up and coming movies following the force awakens. It was a bit of a waste considering he could have brought a lot more to the table, particuarly the fight choreography like Jedi Knight, light sabre battles. He would be on par iifnot better than Darth Mauls battle sequences.

In this movie, it was a little disappointing how under utilise he was.

 

[Steampunk]

Vader's single handed invasion of the Rebel ship at the end was excellent. Someone whined about it being a few blokes in a tiny corridor - have you even seen A New Hope?!?

That's what makes it a great scene. Vader doesn't send in the troops, he goes himself. There's thirty of them, he can't do anything but walk down the corridor, but Vader's not trapped in there with the Rebels, the Rebels are trapped with Vader, and they are crapping themselves.

The fact it was the only Jedi/lightsaber scene makes it even stronger - this is what the Rebels fear above all else, ie Vader as the embodiment of the Empire and will of the Emperor unstoppably coming to kill them all.

 

[Raymond Lin]

But that's why it worked. These were disposable heroes. They ain't coming back. We won't hear about their names in the next instalment (Ep 4). Their mission was pre-defined, the outcome was predictable and known. They were merely cast of Guns of Navarone, Where Eagles Dare or Magnificent 7 but in space. And just like you don't need to know indepth portfolios of Maj. John Smith's team to cheer them on during their adventures on the way to Schloss Adler, or know what motivated Sam Chisholm's sidekicks to defend small, insignificant town in the middle of nowhere, we don't really need to know Rogue One's crew by their childhoods, tear jerking "American Idol" back stories and we can totally get by with mere one liners explaining their skill sets. I think it was ideal arrangement.

Btw, about the "monks" (Chirrut and Baze, and no, Chirrut was a monk from Jedi Temple, Baze was assassin by trade) - the funniest thing I read after premiere was some critic in metro rubbing her column to "Star Wars' first gay couple". See - perfectly ambiguous character development - some see samurai in space, others see rainbow shooting fringe flicking fab-h-ulous...

I disagree.

Characters is what make a movie stand the test of time, think of the great movies, you think of the characters. Even within Star Wars Universe we think of the characters but apart from K2SO and Baze, the rest of them feel like cannon fodder, like a no face Stormtrooper that are a dime a dozen.

I don't think that is a sign of why it works, do you?

 

[v0n]

Characters is what make a movie stand the test of time, think of the great movies, you think of the characters. Even within Star Wars Universe we think of the characters but apart from K2SO and Baze, the rest of them feel like cannon fodder, like a no face Stormtrooper that are a dime a dozen.

I don't think that is a sign of why it works, do you?

That's the difference between saga and a war movie - we don't need this kind of character involvement of the latter to deliver retrospective payoff, which in this case is "premise for episode IV". We don't need multipart love story boiling for several episode between Han and Leia, or gradually developed master-padwan relationships to understand why the characters would die for the cause. The plot is known to us - we know the outcome - it will be done - so the only purpose of the characters is the provision of battlefield camaraderie and sense of righteousnesses while performing common task against enemy - the crew of Rogue One from the get go was to be treated like almost everyone in Saving Private Ryan or Platoon.

 

[Raymond Lin]

That's the difference between saga and a war movie - we don't need this kind of character involvement of the latter to deliver retrospective payoff, which in this case is "premise for episode IV". We don't need multipart love story boiling for several episode between Han and Leia, or gradually developed master-padwan relationships to understand why the characters would die for the cause. The plot is known to us - we know the outcome - it will be done - so the only purpose of the characters is the provision of battlefield camaraderie and sense of righteousnesses while performing common task against enemy - the crew of Rogue One from the get go was to be treated like almost everyone in Saving Private Ryan or Platoon.

You are missing the point.

The point is good characterisation means bigger impact when they die, which leads to me caring that they die which means emotional impact.

As opposed to watching them drop like flies and I don't give a damn.

The latter leads to a weaker movie, not a stronger one. Being a 1 off is not an excuse or reason to have weaker characterisation.

 

[Richdog]

You are missing the point.

The point is good characterisation means bigger impact when they die, which leads to me caring that they die which means emotional impact.

As opposed to watching them drop like flies and I don't give a damn.

The latter leads to a weaker movie, not a stronger one. Being a 1 off is not an excuse or reason to have weaker characterisation.

If Captain Cassian had actually been likeable and charismatic, and not have had a jarringly thick Mexican accent, that would have made a noticeable difference to this movie. He was imo completely mis-cast.

 

[v0n]

The point is good characterisation means bigger impact when they die, which leads to me caring that they die which means emotional impact.

As opposed to watching them drop like flies and I don't give a damn.

The latter leads to a weaker movie, not a stronger one. Being a 1 off is not an excuse or reason to have weaker characterisation.

I understand what you want, but I don't think this was meant to be that kind of movie - personally I found the balance to be just right - the movie was strong enough and yet I think most of the viewers were happy not to be bummed out for the rest of the weekend by their beloved characters falling in slow motion with their chests pierced by laser beams while the adagio for strings rips the "feels" out of sobbing audience.

I was happy to dislike Diego Luna's a-hole character and not to remember his surname afterwards, I found it refreshing to find that the world of imperial opposition wasn't black and white after all and also included "nazi collaborators" like Galen Erso or his extremists/militant separatist buddy played by Forests Whitaker (talk about overplaying btw), neither of which could be supported by The Rebels nor cheered on as hero for simply being"in-a-way" anti imperialist.

Because we didn't have to invest in characters, we invested in the story and the it turned out great. Who's with me - who enjoyed this story more than watching Pandme Skywalker run around another sandy planet with BB8 and pulling force tricks out of her kimono?

 

[glenimp617]

seen the film twice now, and as expected it was better the second time around. I think with most star wars films, the first viewing you are in awe at the sets and battles so don't absorb everything on screen.

Spoiler

The cameos didn't bother me in the slightest, I actually quite enjoyed seeing the pair from mos isleys and r2/3po. Vader scene should have been longer!

 

[gettothechopper]

I was happy to dislike Diego Luna's a-hole character and not to remember his surname afterwards,

Because we didn't have to invest in characters, we invested in the story and the it turned out great.

If you think about it - maybe this is the message of the film, in the Vader scene, to succeed the rebels literary have to pass the message along one to the other and die continually to do so, they are all unknown soldiers who you learn nothing about, but they progress the mission, just as real soldiers die in war for just a few inches or minutes or whatever is needed

without the Jedi to save them, the only way they can win is for normal people to die to progress the cause, the main protagonists also each die to progress the mission one tiny more step forward each time - and its just enough to win in the end.

Maybe who they are or the character arc or whatever doesn't matter so much? its just their success we need to care about

 

[gettothechopper]

ugh double post

 

[stewski]

For me it's a Star Wars movie with an emphasis on war. No there isn't a wise crackin Solo or even a likeable farm boy or princess front and center. Motives and methods of the rebellion are questioned and death for these arguably more complex characters is horribly inevitable.
An average score and some ill considered use of CGI do not prevent it being my favorite Star Wars movie bar the original and Empire. Do I think it will make as much money as the other lesser imo films, probably not.

 

[Zefan]

I wholeheartedly agree with those of you saying that the characters didn't need much developing by design. I don't think it was a mistake at all, I think it was very much on purpose.

For me, Rogue One developed one character - which just happens to be my favourite - more than any other movie has to date, and that is the Star Wars universe itself.

It was about the substance and character of the most well known time in the Star Wars universe, the galactic civil war. No lightsabres or Jedi doing backflips needed, it was telling it how it is for the little people, exactly what they need to focus more on going forward with their videogames IMO. I really hope Rogue One is mega successful so that more money is put in to developing things like the discontinued 1313, and pre-NGE SWG.

The biggest problem I have is with the music, I remember wishing it was better while watching it, and although it's difficult to know for certain before watching it multiple times, I feel that the music will most likely be much less memorable.

 

[Raymond Lin]

I understand what you want, but I don't think this was meant to be that kind of movie - personally I found the balance to be just right - the movie was strong enough and yet I think most of the viewers were happy not to be bummed out for the rest of the weekend by their beloved characters falling in slow motion with their chests pierced by laser beams while the adagio for strings rips the "feels" out of sobbing audience.

I was happy to dislike Diego Luna's a-hole character and not to remember his surname afterwards, I found it refreshing to find that the world of imperial opposition wasn't black and white after all and also included "nazi collaborators" like Galen Erso or his extremists/militant separatist buddy played by Forests Whitaker (talk about overplaying btw), neither of which could be supported by The Rebels nor cheered on as hero for simply being"in-a-way" anti imperialist.

Because we didn't have to invest in characters, we invested in the story and the it turned out great. Who's with me - who enjoyed this story more than watching Pandme Skywalker run around another sandy planet with BB8 and pulling force tricks out of her kimono?

For me, good characters can lift an average movie to a good one and a good one to a great one.

Rogue One to me is good, the lack of good characterisation prevents it to be great.

 

[Fubsy]

Well, we can't always have Hayden Christensen rolling around in the grass.

I agree with the lack of characterisation being a bonus for this film - it put the emphasis on the collective not the individuals. We have enough of that already with the Skywalkers.

 

[Raymond Lin]

Well, we can't always have Hayden Christensen rolling around in the grass.

I agree with the lack of characterisation being a bonus for this film - it put the emphasis on the collective not the individuals. We have enough of that already with the Skywalkers.

I said good characterisation

For the record, I don't think every movie needs in depth characterisation, there are plenty of movies I enjoy that do not, mostly things by Michael Bay but Star Wars is not Michael Bay and with Star Wars, the expectation is to have strong story with memorable characters and lines of dialogue that gets into the pop culture.

And i don't need or expect shakespeare level of characterisation, but I would've have liked more than a line of dialogue.

 

[Zefan]

I said good characterisation

For the record, I don't think every movie needs in depth characterisation, there are plenty of movies I enjoy that do not, mostly things by Michael Bay but Star Wars is not Michael Bay and with Star Wars, the expectation is to have strong story with memorable characters and lines of dialogue that gets into the pop culture.

And i don't need or expect shakespeare level of characterisation, but I would've have liked more than a line of dialogue.

Do you appreciate that some of the most iconic things from Star Wars are not people?

The element that has penetrated in to pulp culture most of all is the storm trooper, and they have zero characterisation in the way you describe it! When you see a kid's Star Wars lunchbox, what do you normally see? Storm troopers, the death star, AT-ATs, X-Wings, TIE Fighters. I'd argue that those are the real "Stars" of Star Wars. Ultimately this film catered more to Star Wars pop culture than any movie before. Just think of all the iconic things that appeared!

I understand that the saga on the whole has had memorable dialogue, but this isn't supposed to be one of those, so it isn't fair to compare it to that in the way you're doing.