I had thought of that, but they sometimes collect water, but under the panels they should be OK, but they are going to have to lift of the panels to do the cabling anyway.
Ronski's Solar & battery DIY build with whole house backup
- Thread starter Ron-ski
- Start date
Just finished about 20 minutes ago in the pitch black, we got all the rails bolted through the roof today, and hopefully sealed. Had one mishap though, rather stupidly I threw a bolt up to my brother, it was too far away for him to catch, and down it came straight on to our old garden table, which after what seemed like a second or two promptly shattered into a gazillion pieces, at least it was the old one.
Its 6 meters top to bottom, 5.85 meters left to right in the above picture, and I can get 12 panels on there - see first post in this thread.
It depends on whether the panels can all face one direction, that would save shading each other, how you fix them is also a consideration, if the roof sub structure is strong enough you can use a ballasted system - concrete blocks or paving slabs holds the frame in place.
Its 6 meters top to bottom, 5.85 meters left to right in the above picture, and I can get 12 panels on there - see first post in this thread.
It depends on whether the panels can all face one direction, that would save shading each other, how you fix them is also a consideration, if the roof sub structure is strong enough you can use a ballasted system - concrete blocks or paving slabs holds the frame in place.
One thing I noticed today, is that the garage doesn't get much sun this time of year, the sun is so low that another tree and then a neighbours house, shades quite a bit of the roof.
@katie279 Yes that 4.5m width makes it a bit awkward, but I'm sure some could be squeezed on there one way or another.
There will be a smart way, but we wont have access to the required software. Easy PV should be able to do it, but I could never get it to arrange panels on an angle facing different directions on a flat roof, you can use the Renusol console mounting, but I still cant figure out how to rotate them to face a different direction. Actually if I create a pitched roof, then it gives me the option of landscape or portrait orientation, but for a flat roof you only have landscape offered - the software is rather lacking, and should just give the option to rotate the panel, after all with a Renusol console you can physically place it at any orientation.
But for purely experimental purposes you could draw two roof's at 30 degree angle occupying the same footprint as your flat roof just like you had a pitched roof on your garden room. Realistically though you wouldn't mount the panels at 30 degrees on a flat roof, so it would be best to work out what mounting system you are going to use first, so you know what angles you are dealing with.
Or as I did draw it in Sketchup, which can show shading, but unless you draw the surrounding tree's and houses it doesn't show them, but all that is a steep learning curve, I've been using Sketchup for many years.
But for purely experimental purposes you could draw two roof's at 30 degree angle occupying the same footprint as your flat roof just like you had a pitched roof on your garden room. Realistically though you wouldn't mount the panels at 30 degrees on a flat roof, so it would be best to work out what mounting system you are going to use first, so you know what angles you are dealing with.
Or as I did draw it in Sketchup, which can show shading, but unless you draw the surrounding tree's and houses it doesn't show them, but all that is a steep learning curve, I've been using Sketchup for many years.
@katie279 That's good, unfortunately I've never used any of the professional packages, used to use Turbo cad, then Floor Plan, then Sketchup.
Yesterdays progress, we must have had a shower overnight. I used CT1 mastic under and around the mounts, this is not affected by water, and can actually be used in the wet.
Yesterdays progress, we must have had a shower overnight. I used CT1 mastic under and around the mounts, this is not affected by water, and can actually be used in the wet.
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@ANDARIAL I did briefly, but the felt was replaced in 2009, using a high performance felt and a 3 layer system bonded with hot bitumen (15 to 25 years plus life), which came with a 10 year guarantee, so I'm sure its got plenty of life left in it.
Trouble is if I'd replaced the felt with EDPM or fibreglass I would probably end up with an entirely new roof (its not very flat and puddles in one corner) at great expense, and requiring a lot of time to do.
Worse case I have to take the panels and brackets off for it to be replaced, its not difficult to remove the panels/brackets.
Trouble is if I'd replaced the felt with EDPM or fibreglass I would probably end up with an entirely new roof (its not very flat and puddles in one corner) at great expense, and requiring a lot of time to do.
Worse case I have to take the panels and brackets off for it to be replaced, its not difficult to remove the panels/brackets.
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Yep, thats the hard part done, the last four brackets were a bit rushed, my brother wasn't available today, and he needed to get home and it was getting dark, but hopefully they are correct.
Normally solar mountings are very forgiving as the rails are adjustable and of course the mounting clamps just slide along the rails, but the method I designed isn't adjustable without adding more height, but there will be a little flexibility, hopefully our measurements are spot on.
Just bolts and nuts to fit the other brackets, we used plenty of polyurethane mastic (CT1), which is brilliant stuff, so hopefully there will be no leaks - there is one mount I'm concerned about as it sits in the middle of a puddle that was an inch deep yesterday. Its a garage so there is no internal ceiling, so leaks will be easily visible, and it will be some time before the actual panels are fitted. I could have gone with a ballasted system, but calculations I did showed that the roof rafters were not strong enough, and even with my brother walking around up there they were flexing quite a bit.
It'd be nice if I can get it up and running by Christmas, but still quite a lot to do, and depends on the electrician.
Normally solar mountings are very forgiving as the rails are adjustable and of course the mounting clamps just slide along the rails, but the method I designed isn't adjustable without adding more height, but there will be a little flexibility, hopefully our measurements are spot on.
Just bolts and nuts to fit the other brackets, we used plenty of polyurethane mastic (CT1), which is brilliant stuff, so hopefully there will be no leaks - there is one mount I'm concerned about as it sits in the middle of a puddle that was an inch deep yesterday. Its a garage so there is no internal ceiling, so leaks will be easily visible, and it will be some time before the actual panels are fitted. I could have gone with a ballasted system, but calculations I did showed that the roof rafters were not strong enough, and even with my brother walking around up there they were flexing quite a bit.
It'd be nice if I can get it up and running by Christmas, but still quite a lot to do, and depends on the electrician.
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Yeah that would be a nice target.
Think we've just set Ron-ski a target.....
Don't let the entire forum down, Ron-ski!
Hmmm, not sure on that, I've got a weeks holiday between now and then, I effectively loose two weekends, and dependant on the electrician.
We've used it at work for years, it really is fantastic stuff, well worth the extra expense over silicon, and if you shop around you can get it cheaper than a lot of places.
Just been up and measured, the front set of frames are roughly 10mm out on the diagnonals, and one of the rear frames is not level, but hopefully I've got enough wiggle room to allow for that.
Back to work, only came in to check my drawings.
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Today's progress.
I got all the rear frames completed and the snorkel fitted through the roof for the cables. The frame on the left is not level, there must have been something under the angle gauge, it means one slope is 9 degrees and the other is 11, which should be fine, all the others are at 10 degrees.
One problem is the panels nearest the edge of the roof will hit the roof, so I need to get some 10mm spacers to space them up, I knew it would be close, but its too close. I expect I'll have the same issue with the ones in the foreground, its easily rectified though, just more expense.
I got all the rear frames completed and the snorkel fitted through the roof for the cables. The frame on the left is not level, there must have been something under the angle gauge, it means one slope is 9 degrees and the other is 11, which should be fine, all the others are at 10 degrees.
One problem is the panels nearest the edge of the roof will hit the roof, so I need to get some 10mm spacers to space them up, I knew it would be close, but its too close. I expect I'll have the same issue with the ones in the foreground, its easily rectified though, just more expense.
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Yet more parts arrived today.
3 meters 120mm, 7 meters each of 70mm orange & black, and 1 meter each of 35mm orange and black.
Two 32A DC rotary isolators.
Just realised the above isolator isn't ZJ Beny, whilst it looks the same there are various differences, so they are going back.
3 meters 120mm, 7 meters each of 70mm orange & black, and 1 meter each of 35mm orange and black.
Two 32A DC rotary isolators.
Just realised the above isolator isn't ZJ Beny, whilst it looks the same there are various differences, so they are going back.
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I've returned the above isolators and ordered genuine ones from ZJ Beny, should be here in a week or so.
No, spoke to the supplier and he hasn't got any outside of the affected serial number range. He's expecting another twenty in this week and will check them, but he gave the impression that it would be quite some time before replacements were available.
My two T class fuse arrived yesterday, still need to source a 400A ANL fuse for Lynx Shunt.
Currently been trying to work out what lugs I need for all my cables, getting there slowly.
Currently been trying to work out what lugs I need for all my cables, getting there slowly.
Here you go, if your order is over £120 use this code for 15% off........... 15%BLKFRI-VICTRON
Victron Energy ANL-fuse 400A/80V for 48V products (1 pc) - CIP142400000
Victron Energy ANL-fuse 400A/80V for 48V products (1 pc) - CIP142400000 product brought to you by BMS Technologies LTD Offering free next working day delivery.www.batterymegastore.co.uk
They've been out of stock for weeks, I've found somewhere else that has them for £12 + P&P, was just waiting until I needed something else they have, or they are on eBay for £18 or best offer delivered.
@Mafia_GF If you think they are expensive, don't look at the prices of T Class fuses, some places are charging £80 per fuse, I found them for just over half that. When it comes to fusing I rather pay a bit extra and know I've got something thats rated for the situation its used in.
That's my cable lugs ordered, hopefully I've worked out the correct ones and not forgotten any. Next on the list will be heat shrink.
There is just so much that goes into building your own, seems never ending.
There is just so much that goes into building your own, seems never ending.
I'd hate to think what I've spent on shipping, I'm also going to have quite a few parts that aren't required, but they will get sold.
Yes that will come eventually be done, but first I need to build the battery.
Talking of bootlace terminals, I don't think there's that many that I actually need, a lot of the connections should be used with bare wire, its really only terminals where the screw, screws into the wire that require them (there are some other types, such as spring loaded). Victron actually recommends against using them on their MPPT charge controllers, and the terminals on the MCB's & PV fuse holders are the same design.
Talking of bootlace terminals, I don't think there's that many that I actually need, a lot of the connections should be used with bare wire, its really only terminals where the screw, screws into the wire that require them (there are some other types, such as spring loaded). Victron actually recommends against using them on their MPPT charge controllers, and the terminals on the MCB's & PV fuse holders are the same design.
I agree totally, I spend a lot of time trying to find the cheapest safe options, I don't like paying over the odds for something, but if there is one thing I've learnt in 30 years as a mechanic/workshop manager, cheapest is not the best option, but often exactly the same part can be purchased from a factors rather than main dealers.
Talking of being overcharged, just had an email from that popular auction site, one item caught my attention, an official Cerbo GX protection kit, consisting of a Panasonic capacitor, some heat shrink, and instructions all for the princely sum of £9.99, not a bad profit for a 40p capacitor, a bit of heat shrink, sheet of paper and postage 
I'll just order the capacitor from RS Components should I require it, free delivery as well on our credit account.
I'll just order the capacitor from RS Components should I require it, free delivery as well on our credit account.