Ryzen "2" ?

Mercutio · 9 Oct 2017 at 13:31

Well, if a completely different LP (that's known to scale much better than finfet) + lessons from 1st gen don't see an improvement... there's clearly little point.

So we have:
1) first lessons and improvement on a complete new architecture (consider sandybridge improvements intel side for a moment, basically the same place)
2) a (much) better LP (I'll dig out links)
3) a die shrink

I don't see why we're all sat around going "well, it might just be a toss up on performance vs Ryzen gen 1."

That seems... unduly pessimistic.

The performance gap, right now to Intel is 10-15%, based on clockspeed. IPC is nigh on par, assuming you give it the right ram sticks and can be arsed tweaking it (and it's not some pile of crap from 3-5 years ago that can ONLY run on 1 core). Completely tweaked and set up well (youtube vid linked elsewhere here) and it's... at least within "a head" of Intel. I'd think it more naysaying than being realistic to assume that they won't be basically at a point where the gaps closed. I _think_ that's being quite objective about it?

chroniclard · 9 Oct 2017 at 13:39

I'm hopeful but not yet ready to fully board the hype train.

Mercutio · 9 Oct 2017 at 13:40

chroniclard said:
I'm hopeful but not yet ready to fully board the hype train.

Understandable

This was the youtube vid I was on about. Yes the dudes gone to some pretty anal lengths to pull everything out of the Ryzen but... those figures are... interesting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6yp7Pi39Z8

I'm _NOT_ fanboying either. Intel in current rig, come March when I intend to be upgrading, I'll go with whatever (though I am more bang for buck so... eh...). It's a horrifically immature platform presently though. This sort of stuff would be more "standard" with lessons learned and applied at design/build stage which... a redesign for a different LP would require anyway.

chroniclard · 9 Oct 2017 at 13:49

Mercutio said:
Understandable

This was the youtube vid I was on about. Yes the dudes gone to some pretty anal lengths to pull everything out of the Ryzen but... those figures are... interesting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6yp7Pi39Z8

I'm _NOT_ fanboying either. Intel in current rig, come March when I intend to be upgrading, I'll go with whatever (though I am more bang for buck so... eh...). It's a horrifically immature platform presently though. This sort of stuff would be more "standard" with lessons learned and applied at design/build stage which... a redesign for a different LP would require anyway.

Think I am not far off his settings, will have a watch later(speakers at work suck).

Flight · 9 Oct 2017 at 13:57

Could we see improved/enhanced motherboards with the next wave of Ryzen or are the potential upgrades limited to the processors ?

Doobedoo · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:01

Yes they will be releasing x470 range of motherboards with the new processors.

Not sure exactly what extras or benefits that will bring though.

chroniclard · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:08

Doobedoo said:
Yes they will be releasing x470 range of motherboards with the new processors.

Not sure exactly what extras or benefits that will bring though.

Main benefit will be extra cash for motherboard vendors!

Mercutio · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:08

Flight said:
Could we see improved/enhanced motherboards with the next wave of Ryzen or are the potential upgrades limited to the processors ?

Well... Ryzen is pretty much a full on SoC. The motherboard is basically just for I/O. Maybe more PCIe lanes?

jigger · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:26

Mercutio said:
Well... Ryzen is pretty much a full on SoC. The motherboard is basically just for I/O. Maybe more PCIe lanes?

Another 10Gb DMI from the SOC would be really nice.

Mercutio · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:29

Onboard 5gig/10gig NIC (depends on cost to add) would probably turn my head as well

Doobedoo · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:32

chroniclard said:
Main benefit will be extra cash for motherboard vendors!

Possibly although your not required to buy it you could always stick with x370.

Scougar · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:35

beany_bot said:
Hmmm, an 8 core Ryzen with same clocks and IPC as Coffee would be nice. but as others have said "there is always something else" around the corner. Fact is, Coffee lake i7 is now a substantial upgrade for me.

woah there boy... woahhhhh....

Don't get ahead of yourself here... this is how rumours start.

jigger · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:45

Mercutio said:
Onboard 5gig/10gig NIC (depends on cost to add) would probably turn my head as well

Yeah pretty much read my mind. On board 10Gb/s NICs plus still keep 24 lanes of PCIE.

Motherboard makers could get really creative. 20 SATA, a load of SAS connections, no problem.

jigger · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:49

Scougar said:
woah there boy... woahhhhh....

Don't get ahead of yourself here... this is how rumours start.

Yeah everyone stay calm. Before we know it CPU's will be crushed by the millions.

jaffveyda · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:52

Scougar said:
woah there boy... woahhhhh....

Don't get ahead of yourself here... this is how rumours start.

Hype train confirmed, Zen 2 to be faster than Covfefe Lake.
First rule on this forum, we don't talk about trains.

BongoHunter · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:52

jigger said:
Yeah pretty much read my mind. On board 10Gb/s NICs plus still keep 24 lanes of PCIE.

Motherboard makers could get really creative. 20 SATA, a load of SAS connections, no problem.

If it's just PCIE for fast NICs and storage you need then just go TR 1900x on the cheapest board you can find!

Scougar · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:52

jigger said:
Yeah everyone stay calm. Before we know it CPU's will be crushed by the millions.

lol.

But with all sincerity, expectation for the Zen+ (Not Zen2, that comes later) is a minor uplift in performance. Whether that comes from the process improvement, increased clocks or both, we do not know until AMD releases the information or we test it.

jaffveyda · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:53

...i quoted myself

jigger · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:56

BongoHunter said:
If it's just PCIE for fast NICs and storage you need then just go TR 1900x on the cheapest board you can find!

ASRock already workout cheaper. It's not proper 10Gb/s but its close.

haszek · 9 Oct 2017 at 14:59

beany_bot said:
Challenge accepted I'm going to California in Nov. If I can't get one there (currently £250). Then I'll sit tight and wait for Ryzen 2 to come and show it's hand.

I thought prices are inflated there as well and Microcenter is selling them for... $500 (not quite £250

and you don't have delid and warranty around here).