Ryzen 3600 Voltage

Old Man · 23 Jul 2019 at 23:36

PowerPie5000 said:
I've cleaned up and updated Windows along with installing all the latest drivers and Windows is also now using the Ryzen balanced power plan instead of it's own.
.

Which mobo?

PowerPie5000 · 24 Jul 2019 at 01:06

Old Man said:
Which mobo?

Asrock X470 Taichi with the latest bios (3.43). I do have a beta BIOS (3.46) from one of the Asrock team on a German site, but I'm not sure if I should bother as it uses AGESA 1.0.0.3AB (or ABA?) that AMD have pulled due to some problem or bugs?

This chip just runs way too hot and wants to boost constantly at voltages nearing 1.5V. I have to close all background apps for it to enter idle states, and even then it idles at around 50C with a good cooler and good case airflow.

I'm starting to think AMD still had some bugs and BIOS issues to iron out, but at the same time they wanted to release their chips on the 7/7 date.

I can see all sorts of complaints over the net regarding the Ryzen 3000 series (voltage, heat, boost speeds etc...). My chip has been hammered with high volts and temperatures just from gaming. Some benchmark scores are also starting to drop slightly and I really hope it's not CPU degradation starting to settle in already.

xraycat87 · 24 Jul 2019 at 02:34

If it helps, I'm running prime 95 as we speak and this is my stats, stock cooler but decent system cooling....

Old Man · 24 Jul 2019 at 10:20

PowerPie5000 said:
Asrock X470 Taichi with the latest bios (3.43). I do have a beta BIOS (3.46) from one of the Asrock team on a German site, but I'm not sure if I should bother as it uses AGESA 1.0.0.3AB (or ABA?) that AMD have pulled due to some problem or bugs?

This chip just runs way too hot and wants to boost constantly at voltages nearing 1.5V. I have to close all background apps for it to enter idle states, and even then it idles at around 50C with a good cooler and good case airflow.

I'm starting to think AMD still had some bugs and BIOS issues to iron out, but at the same time they wanted to release their chips on the 7/7 date.

I can see all sorts of complaints over the net regarding the Ryzen 3000 series (voltage, heat, boost speeds etc...). My chip has been hammered with high volts and temperatures just from gaming. Some benchmark scores are also starting to drop slightly and I really hope it's not CPU degradation starting to settle in already.

Found this:

Reports of Ryzen 3000 High Idle Voltage Exaggerated, a Case of the "Observer Effect"
https://www.techpowerup.com/257312/...age-exaggerated-a-case-of-the-observer-effect

an0nym0us · 24 Jul 2019 at 12:28

PowerPie5000 said:
Asrock X470 Taichi with the latest bios (3.43). I do have a beta BIOS (3.46) from one of the Asrock team on a German site, but I'm not sure if I should bother as it uses AGESA 1.0.0.3AB (or ABA?) that AMD have pulled due to some problem or bugs?

This chip just runs way too hot and wants to boost constantly at voltages nearing 1.5V. I have to close all background apps for it to enter idle states, and even then it idles at around 50C with a good cooler and good case airflow.

I'm starting to think AMD still had some bugs and BIOS issues to iron out, but at the same time they wanted to release their chips on the 7/7 date.

I can see all sorts of complaints over the net regarding the Ryzen 3000 series (voltage, heat, boost speeds etc...). My chip has been hammered with high volts and temperatures just from gaming. Some benchmark scores are also starting to drop slightly and I really hope it's not CPU degradation starting to settle in already.

AGESA ComboAM4 1.0.0.3ABA is the dodgy one that was recalled:
https://www.techpowerup.com/257514/...ggy-company-pulls-it-from-motherboard-vendors

If you have that in a BIOS update file, don't flash it.

Dash RipRock · 24 Jul 2019 at 17:23

https://youtu.be/JscRwIH3OAY

THis should clear some stuff up.

PowerPie5000 · 25 Jul 2019 at 14:18

Asrock have just released a new BIOS today for the X470 Taichi (and probably other X470 boards too). It's version 3.50 and the description just says "Update AMD AGESA Combo-AM4 1.0.0.3"... It doesn't say if the AGESA is the AB or ABA version. I know Asrock are a little slow when it comes to the BIOS side of things, but hopefully they won't be using the dodgy AGESA version that AMD puled about a week ago.

Anyway, I think I'll go ahead and give it ago... Even if it does say it can't be downgraded once flashed (although I managed to revert back to 3.43 when I tested the 3.46 beta BIOS).

PowerPie5000 · 25 Jul 2019 at 14:50

Ok not sure why my previous post is in black font, But nevermind.

I updated the Asrock Taichi X470 BIOS to the latest 3.50 version released today and have already noticed something isn't quite right. My Ryzen 5 3600 now idles at 3.6GHz @ 1.038v.... Before it would idle at 2.2GHz @ 0.919v. I've just reinstalled the latest AMD chipset drivers too. This is using the "Ryzen Balanced" power plan and everything set to default/auto in the BIOS as before.

almoststew1990 · 25 Jul 2019 at 15:13

Try Power Saver mode in Windows. It sorted out my idling issues. I score slightly fewer points in benches if I forget to switch back to balanced. I might test to see if power saver and balanced give different fps in games, and if not I'll leave it in power saber until drivers and bios mature.

PowerPie5000 · 25 Jul 2019 at 18:36

The normal Windows balanced mode lets it idle properly, but Ryzen balanced doesn't. It has at least shaved a very small bit of voltage from the boost speed (maxes out at 1.450V now)…. But at the same time the performance has decreased very slightly in benchmarks, but not by much. It doesn't boost as often to 4.2GHz now either, but it still hits 80C+ with the cooler fan running flat out when playing a game for 20 mins or so (Apex Legends at the moment).

Orange Nexus · 25 Jul 2019 at 19:05

PowerPie5000 said:
The normal Windows balanced mode lets it idle properly, but Ryzen balanced doesn't. It has at least shaved a very small bit of voltage from the boost speed (maxes out at 1.450V now)…. But at the same time the performance has decreased very slightly in benchmarks, but not by much. It doesn't boost as often to 4.2GHz now either, but it still hits 80C+ with the cooler fan running flat out when playing a game for 20 mins or so (Apex Legends at the moment).

Do you mind trying this setting (i read another member used this)?

Windows Power: High Performance
Advance Power Option: Minimum Processor State: 1%; Maximum: 100%

PowerPie5000 · 25 Jul 2019 at 19:18

Orange Nexus said:
Do you mind trying this setting (i read another member used this)?

Windows Power: High Performance
Advance Power Option: Minimum Processor State: 1%; Maximum: 100%

Just tried it and it pretty much behaves the same way as windows balanced mode. Is it supposed to do anything differently? Asrock have definitely dialled back the auto voltages with their new BIOS as my cores never go over 1.450v now. Temps are still a bit crap though considering my case has multiple fans (positive airflow config) and a Matterhorn cooler which I have re-seated a couple of times now. The side panel on the case behind the motherboard gets absolutely baking during a gaming session!

Orange Nexus · 25 Jul 2019 at 20:23

PowerPie5000 said:
Just tried it and it pretty much behaves the same way as windows balanced mode. Is it supposed to do anything differently? Asrock have definitely dialled back the auto voltages with their new BIOS as my cores never go over 1.450v now. Temps are still a bit crap though considering my case has multiple fans (positive airflow config) and a Matterhorn cooler which I have re-seated a couple of times now. The side panel on the case behind the motherboard gets absolutely baking during a gaming session!

It is suppose to allow the cpu to downclock, vcore to go down during idle, and not lose performance. I use CPUz Bench to test each mode.

PowerPie5000 · 25 Jul 2019 at 22:13

Orange Nexus said:
It is suppose to allow the cpu to downclock, vcore to go down during idle, and not lose performance. I use CPUz Bench to test each mode.

Windows balanced plan also allows the cores to downclock and the volts to drop to around 0.9v. It's a shame the Ryzen balanced plan can't do the same. CPU-Z bench shows better results using the Ryzen power plans instead of Windows default plans... But only a slight difference.

It's strange as the Ryzen balanced plan dropped the clocks and voltage when idling before I updated today to the latest BIOS from Asrock.

an0nym0us · 26 Jul 2019 at 10:02

From what AMD_Robert said on reddit, sounds like AMD have still got some updates in the works.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/cbls9g/the_final_word_on_idle_voltages_for_3rd_gen_ryzen/

What about Ryzen Balanced vs. Windows Balanced Plan?

By now, you may know that 3rd Gen Ryzen heralds the return of the Ryzen Balanced power plan (only for 3rd Gen CPUs; everyone else can use the regular ol' Windows plan). This plan specifically enables the 1ms clock selection we've been promoting as a result of CPPC2. This allows the CPU to respond more quickly to workloads, especially bursty workloads, which improves performance for you. In contrast, the default "Balanced" plan that comes with Windows is configured to a 15ms clock selection interval.

Some have noticed that switching to the Windows Balanced plan, instead of the Ryzen Balanced Plan, causes idle voltages to settle. This is because the default Balanced Plan, with 15ms intervals, comparatively instructs the processor to ignore 14 of 15 clock requests relative to the AMD plan.

So, if the monitoring tool is sitting there hammering the cores with boost requests, the default plan is just going to discard most of them. The core frequency and clock will settle to true idle values now and then. But if you run our performance-enhancing plan, the CPU is going to act on every single boost request interpreted from the monitoring tool. Voltages and clock, therefore, will go up. Observer effect in action!

EDIT 7/18/19 As a temporary workaround, you can use the standard Windows Balanced plan. Edit this plan to use 85% minimum processor state, 100% maximum processor state. (Example). This will chill things out as we continue to work this issue. Your 1T and nT scores shouldn't change at all (+/- the usual run-to-run variance). This will preserve boost, retain cc6 core sleeping, preserve idle downclocking/downvolting, but make the CPU more relaxed about boosting under light loads.

Please note that it is totally normal for your Ryzen to use voltages in a range of 0.200V - 1.500V -- this is the factory operating range of the CPU. It is also totally normal for the temperature to cycle through 10°C swings as boost comes on and off. You will always see these characteristics, as they're intended, so do not be surprised to see such values.

Please do not undervolt the chip or set a maximum processor state of 99%. These are ineffective and/or detrimental changes.

We appreciate the reports everyone has provided, and they are helpful. I will make an all-new post when I have a more comprehensive update to share. Thanks for your patience.

EDIT 7/22/19 Hope to have an update for everyone, soon. I will make a new thread for it. Thank you again for your patience. I've received kind messages of support over the past week, and I really appreciate it. I know people are eager to hear more. Soon.

C64 · 27 Jun 2020 at 22:20

my default voltage was 1.2 something on auto , msi b450 ga

PowerPie5000 said:
Windows balanced plan also allows the cores to downclock and the volts to drop to around 0.9v. It's a shame the Ryzen balanced plan can't do the same. CPU-Z bench shows better results using the Ryzen power plans instead of Windows default plans... But only a slight difference.

It's strange as the Ryzen balanced plan dropped the clocks and voltage when idling before I updated today to the latest BIOS from Asrock.

mines working on ryzen power plan min cpu state 99% max 100% but it's still down volting and operating like a 5% 100% windows power plan mines going as low as 0950

VortexA1 · 28 Jun 2020 at 16:44

PowerPie5000 said:
Asrock X470 Taichi with the latest bios (3.43). I do have a beta BIOS (3.46) from one of the Asrock team on a German site, but I'm not sure if I should bother as it uses AGESA 1.0.0.3AB (or ABA?) that AMD have pulled due to some problem or bugs?

This chip just runs way too hot and wants to boost constantly at voltages nearing 1.5V. I have to close all background apps for it to enter idle states, and even then it idles at around 50C with a good cooler and good case airflow.

I'm starting to think AMD still had some bugs and BIOS issues to iron out, but at the same time they wanted to release their chips on the 7/7 date.

I can see all sorts of complaints over the net regarding the Ryzen 3000 series (voltage, heat, boost speeds etc...). My chip has been hammered with high volts and temperatures just from gaming. Some benchmark scores are also starting to drop slightly and I really hope it's not CPU degradation starting to settle in already.

A voltage of 1.5v is perfectly ordinary for Ryzen, in fact it does that more often when it's taxed less and it's perfectly fine. Volts is not a problem there.

I thnk you're worrying too much, and unfortunately a lot of worries out there. 81 degrees is totally fine for Ryzen playing a game even with a different cooler.

Ryzen do run hotter generally but it's perfectly fine and well within their tolerances.

It does boost a lot in windows that is how it works, mine was noisy and changing the fan profile made it a lot quieter.

My 'two' cents. Just trying to alleviate your concerns mate.

Scottx125 · 29 Jun 2020 at 22:01

1.5v is the normal operating voltage of Ryzen 3000 CPU's. This is because at 1.5v the CPU is not drawing high amps. But when they CPU comes under load the voltage drops and the current goes up. So in reality Ryzen 3000 CPU's under moderate to heavy load only run between 1.2v-1.35v. For single core boosts they might go up to 1.5v and high current if there is thermal headroom.

In short Voltage is not the issue in CPU degradation, at least not at this level. The real threat is current which causes high temps and electron migration (high temp also increases the rate of electron migration). So long as you stay below 80c for consistent use and only go up to 90c for short duration's you'll be fine.

TNA · 29 Jun 2020 at 22:19

VortexA1 said:
Really? That goes against what AMD are saying, you lower voltage, you get 'higher boosts' but the overall performance drops.

That's not what what is happening with my 3600. Every benchmark I have run benefits significantly. Blender completes quicker and all runs quieter and consumes less power. I have been using it like this for over 6 months now, it has yet to crash or explode due to undervaulting.

By the way, I get 4.4GHz and every possible load, like a traditional overclock. None of this clocks jumping about business. And all at a cool 1.275v

C64 · 29 Jun 2020 at 23:23

TNA said:
That's not what what is happening with my 3600. Every benchmark I have run benefits significantly. Blender completes quicker and all runs quieter and consumes less power. I have been using it like this for over 6 months now, it has yet to crash or explode due to undervaulting.

By the way, I get 4.4GHz and every possible load, like a traditional overclock. None of this clocks jumping about business. And all at a cool 1.275v

how you running that overclock just leaving auto and putting 44.40 in frequency and an offset to keep at max 1.4 volts ?
whys all the 3600 data still so fresh I feel like the data is as if the 3600 came out last week or something