Poll: Ryzen 7950X3D, 7900X3D, 7800X3D

[FredFlint]

I'm guessing you didn't know that was there?

Its not anymore, MS is also to blame as they allow a rootkit to install, wonder how much asus paid them for that!
Its also a pain to remove, SC DELETE AsusUpdateCheck dose not seem to do it, had to delete the exe and the reg stuff:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\AsusUpdateCheck
then reboot, seems to be gone now, wish I went with MSI now!

 

[Brizzles]

Footnotes at the bottom of the EXPO tech page.

Yeh, I found that eventually.

But that's a bit like Samsung advertising a TV with Dolby on their website, only to go to the Dolby site saying it will void your TV warranty if enabled.

Misleading at best.

 

[jigger]

Yeh, I found that eventually.

But that's a bit like Samsung advertising a TV with Dolby on their website, only to go to the Dolby site saying it will void your TV warranty if enabled.

Misleading at best.

Not really. If Samsung sold its TV’s in kit form maybe, but even then still not really.

 

[LtMatt]

Yeh, I found that eventually.

But that's a bit like Samsung advertising a TV with Dolby on their website, only to go to the Dolby site saying it will void your TV warranty if enabled.

Misleading at best.

The problem is you are looking for disclaimers on the product full spec pages, they don't exist there.

However, they do exist on this Ryzen product page, the AM5 page and the EXPO tech page. They can also be found on the Ryzen Master Tool page.

 

[facboy]

WTF?

lol i have it too. so where is this option in the bios?

in...well not fairness...'less badness', i don't seem to have armoury crate installed.

 

[FredFlint]

lol i have it too. so where is this option in the bios?

I used the search on the main page and search for: install rootkit

 

[Brizzles]

The problem is you are looking for disclaimers on the product full spec pages, they don't exist there.

However, they do exist on this Ryzen product page, the AM5 page and the EXPO tech page. They can also be found on the Ryzen Master Tool page.

Fair point

 

[eddiew]

Its not anymore, MS is also to blame as they allow a rootkit to install, wonder how much asus paid them for that!

Not just Asus, as far as I know the UEFI specification allows for boot-sequence injection of libraries and executables. I've seen a hint that Gigabyte do it too, but less aggressively. In theory any manufacturer can.

I'm surprised more OEMs aren't using it to ensure their bloatware (or at least a downloader for their bloatware) is forced in, even if you fully wipe the machine and start again. It's ripe for abuse.

 

[Rawr]

Footnotes at the bottom of the EXPO tech page.

PCWorld had Steve on to discuss this

AMD CPU Failure Testing, New Intel CPU Naming & More | The Full Nerd ep. 255

Join The Full Nerd gang as they talk about the latest PC hardware topics. In this episode the gang is joined by special guest Steve from @GamersNexus to chat...

www.youtube.com

https://www.amd.com/en/technologies/expo

Steve is basically saying what were saying really with regards to the warranty debacle. Commenting that he wouldn't review with EXPO on if they're suddenly going to start refusing warranties for using it, since as we just said it's pretty suspect they're advertising a feature in their performance stats which the user apparently isn't meant to use because it voids warranty.

 

[eddiew]

Commenting that he wouldn't review with EXPO on if they're suddenly going to start refusing warranties for using it

This is what we need all reviewers to say. AMD won't want to be re-reviewed at 5-10% slower, and no single motherboard manufacturer wants to be the "slow" board because they're the only one not warrantying EXPO.

As long as reviews hold them to account, they'll do the job properly and sort out proper safe EXPO settings that will be like 99.9% the same and won't explode any more CPUs.

If reviewers don't do that... then it's just going to be messy.

 

[LtMatt]

Steve is basically saying what were saying really with regards to the warranty debacle. Commenting that he wouldn't review with EXPO on if they're suddenly going to start refusing warranties for using it, since as we just said it's pretty suspect they're advertising a feature in their performance stats which the user apparently isn't meant to use because it voids warranty.

This is what we need all reviewers to say. AMD won't want to be re-reviewed at 5-10% slower, and no single motherboard manufacturer wants to be the "slow" board because they're the only one not warrantying EXPO.

As long as reviews hold them to account, they'll do the job properly and sort out proper safe EXPO settings that will be like 99.9% the same and won't explode any more CPUs.

If reviewers don't do that... then it's just going to be messy.

Here is Intel saying the same thing.

XMP Warranty void

Hello, I'm running on an I5 9600k and I wanted to ask if my CPU warranty is voided even though i've been running on XMP since the day i bought it. I have been in no way informed of XMP being "overclocking" and something that voids the warranty, all I was informed of is that it's the way of...

community.intel.com

 

[Rawr]

Here is Intel saying the same thing.

XMP Warranty void

Hello, I'm running on an I5 9600k and I wanted to ask if my CPU warranty is voided even though i've been running on XMP since the day i bought it. I have been in no way informed of XMP being "overclocking" and something that voids the warranty, all I was informed of is that it's the way of...

community.intel.com

I mean yes, no one is saying it's just AMD that's doing it. This is a AMD thread though so we're of course talking about AMD.

Steve actually comments on Intel in that video even during the same part of the discussion. Mentioning their video where they actually tried to get a warranty rejected from Intel by saying they'd used XMP multiple times but they still accepted, they commented AMD was probably the same but haven't tried it. It's the motherboard manufacturers where the comments were actually focused on because apparently at first some of the board partners were rejecting warranties when this issue first came to light. Which isn't a very good look.

 

[delta0]

All the performance figures used to promote AM5 were done with EXPO enabled, with no disclaimers. I bet the legal department are scouring the small print

Still no disclaimer or warning on AMD.com

AMD could run themselves into legal issues through misadvertising if they aren’t careful. If they are now classing EXPO as a non-standard feature in order to achieve advertised performance it would be no different to a car manufacturer promoting a performance that requires an ECU tune in order to achieve a 0-60 time. They will have to start advertising without EXPO and not promoting it in anyway going forward. They will have to consider what to do about previous sales where it is advertised as a standard feature in order to achieve RAM speeds and advertised performance.

 

[gazzadubs]

AMD could run themselves into legal issues through misadvertising if they aren’t careful. If they are now classing EXPO as a non-standard feature in order to achieve advertised performance it would be no different to a car manufacturer promoting a performance that requires an ECU tune in order to achieve a 0-60 time. They will have to start advertising without EXPO and not promoting it in anyway going forward. They will have to consider what to do about previous sales where it is advertised as a standard feature in order to achieve RAM speeds and advertised performance.

​

Types of misrepresentation​

A misrepresentation is a statement of fact (not opinion) which is made by a seller before a contract is made.

If you relied on that statement when deciding whether or not to go ahead with your purchase, and this then turns out to be wrong, you may be able to claim compensation.

There are three types of misrepresentation and your path to redress will depend upon whether the false statement was made fraudulently, negligently, or innocently.

 

[LtMatt]

I mean yes, no one is saying it's just AMD that's doing it. This is a AMD thread though so we're of course talking about AMD.

Steve actually comments on Intel in that video even during the same part of the discussion. Mentioning their video where they actually tried to get a warranty rejected from Intel by saying they'd used XMP multiple times but they still accepted, they commented AMD was probably the same but haven't tried it. It's the motherboard manufacturers where the comments were actually focused on because apparently at first some of the board partners were rejecting warranties when this issue first came to light. Which isn't a very good look.

Yep that's fair enough on the motherboards if true.

 

[stooeh]

Its not anymore, MS is also to blame as they allow a rootkit to install, wonder how much asus paid them for that!
Its also a pain to remove, SC DELETE AsusUpdateCheck dose not seem to do it, had to delete the exe and the reg stuff:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\AsusUpdateCheck
then reboot, seems to be gone now, wish I went with MSI now!

You will be pleased to know my MSI board prompted an MSI driver install window on first boot to Windows. Rebooted, BIOS updated and that thing disabled!in BIOS. I assume (or hope) it is less tenacious than than Asus' installer...

 

[Rawr]

You will be pleased to know my MSI board prompted an MSI driver install window on first boot to Windows. Rebooted, BIOS updated and that thing disabled!in BIOS. I assume (or hope) it is less tenacious than than Asus' installer...

Yeah I had the same happen on a MSI board. For what it's worth I did install MSI Center and then later uninstalled it because as expected it was pretty useless and I can't see any remnants left over from it unlike those screenshots of the Asus thing. I also didn't actually disable the thing in the bios and it hasn't prompted me to install again.

 

[VeganNinjaZombie]

Well I seemed to have fixed the performance issues in MW2 and other titles. The new security feature in Windows "Kernel-mode Hardware-enforced Stack Protection" was causing performance issues.
Turning it off doubled my frame rate in MW2, now hitting 400fps plus in the benchmark tool when CPU bound instead of 150-220..
I was getting 80-90fps on shipment with a 7950X3D and RTX 4090, with like 30% GPU load before turning this off.

Setting voice chat to friends only also improves performance by a lot in the Steam version, but that has been a bug for good while...

I only used MW2/WZ2 for the benchmark tool and performance testing, I had given up on that game months ago lol...
Booting it up makes me want to hide my status on Steam thanks to the complete incompetence and greed from Infinity Ward/Activision, now it has pay 2 win mechanics... Count me out.

 

[VeganNinjaZombie]

Its not anymore, MS is also to blame as they allow a rootkit to install, wonder how much asus paid them for that!
Its also a pain to remove, SC DELETE AsusUpdateCheck dose not seem to do it, had to delete the exe and the reg stuff:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\AsusUpdateCheck
then reboot, seems to be gone now, wish I went with MSI now!

Asus and bloatware name a more popular duo.

 

[01001101]

I just wanted to ask if anyone has attempted overclocking again since the new 1413 bios roll out last week?

I'm still running default settings with the exception of the manual memory timings. Not EXPO.

I'm a little hesitant tbf due to the recent findings from G\N and a bit concerned that I might have accidentally permanently damaged the 7800X3D and maybe other components in some way, I'm not sure.

I'm just trying to be cautious I guess because this is my first return to building a gaming pc since 2011 and just want to make sure it doesn't degrade in performance or worst case brick itself prematurely.