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Scrypt mining gold rush finally ends

Buckster said:
only on some cards at a guess

my card gets hotter in Furmark than any benchmark - I also get the highest power draw from the wall - electricity wise in Furmark than any other tool

my card is a 570 but a custom one - I think the reference ones throttled down
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Think it was 400/500 that started it, GPU-Z made a special build you could disable the protection at your own risk

I would watch as some custom cooler's/aftermarket do not cool the VRM's well and that is what burnt out.

The built in testers in AB or Precision is near same and safer/covered by manu.
 
People here seem to be hung up on the GPU part of things. I'd be much more concerned about the power circuitry. I doubt on consumer cards it has been designed to be run at max load for months on end. That is far more likely to fail than anything else.

Also a glut of very cheap second hand parts is going to be bad for AMD's bottom line and inventory.
 
jh30uk said:
Think it was 400/500 that started it, GPU-Z made a special build you could disable the protection at your own risk

I would watch as some custom cooler's/aftermarket do not cool the VRM's well and that is what burnt out.

The built in testers in AB or Precision is near same and safer/covered by manu.
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cheers - I'll try the built in testers

interestingly when I RMA'd a card to Gigabyte they used Furmark as a test :)
 
subbytna said:
lol @ miners now realising buying ten 290s for mining mightn't have been such a good idea.
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Whilst I defend mining in general, this is a statement I can agree with, however there is logic behind their purchases.

Bitcoin was nothing. Early adopters were getting thousands of coins every day on a couple of GPUs, and look what happened to that. It's that hope that spurred people on to buy huge GPU farms and mine. Unfortunately it didn't all go as well, so many folks are sat with cards they don't want to use (I'm still mining, this whole "gpu mining is dead" thing is greatly exaggerated).

The problem arises when people went into debt for these rigs. In some cases, 10 grand or more. These aren't rich folks either, just your average joe looking for a quick buck. For those guys, this dip represents an extremely painful time at the moment as they're stuck with interest rates and thousands of pounds of debt. Whilst I feel for these guys, it was a silly move to jump into debt in what is ultimately a very optimistic gamble.

Personally I have a few cards still mining. These ASICs coming soon are just a big scare. Coin devs are moving onto other stuff which evades asics and I'm still not spending anything I can't afford to write off, so if it makes a buck or two then great, if not, meh.
 
Diddums said:
Whilst I defend mining in general, this is a statement I can agree with, however there is logic behind their purchases.

Bitcoin was nothing. Early adopters were getting thousands of coins every day on a couple of GPUs, and look what happened to that. It's that hope that spurred people on to buy huge GPU farms and mine. Unfortunately it didn't all go as well, so many folks are sat with cards they don't want to use (I'm still mining, this whole "gpu mining is dead" thing is greatly exaggerated).

The problem arises when people went into debt for these rigs. In some cases, 10 grand or more. These aren't rich folks either, just your average joe looking for a quick buck. For those guys, this dip represents an extremely painful time at the moment as they're stuck with interest rates and thousands of pounds of debt. Whilst I feel for these guys, it was a silly move to jump into debt in what is ultimately a very optimistic gamble.

Personally I have a few cards still mining. These ASICs coming soon are just a big scare. Coin devs are moving onto other stuff which evades asics and I'm still not spending anything I can't afford to write off, so if it makes a buck or two then great, if not, meh.
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I own 10 AMD GPUs and have never mined on any of them.
 
Gregster said:
The biggest issue I see with this is "who done what with the card in question" For example:

Man 'A' gets his card and starts mining. He carefully sets volts and always keeps an eye on the temps. The cards run 24/7 for 3 months but temps have been good and under volted. The bubble bursts and he decides he wants to recoup some money, so sells his card.

Man 'B' gets his card and starts mining. He raises volts and sets the fan to 100% (or allowed max). Temps are constantly over 95c and time and again, the card is crashing. He gives the card a damned good beasting. the bubble bursts and he decides he wants to recoup some money, so sells his card.

Both sell the card and the unsuspecting buyer see's 290 for sale. Did a little mining but well looked after.

That is the biggest problem for me.

Check the MM (for those that can), tons of AMD GPUs for sale and the same with ebay.
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That isn't a problem.

Person A buys a 290x he games a bit, or mines, the card hits 95C and throttles and stays at 95C the whole time. He undervolted his card, the card still went to 95C then throttled.

Person B overvolts, it hits 95C and throttles, it runs at 95C the whole time.

Person C games, he overclocks and maybe overvolts, the card goes to 95C, it stays there and throttles or not.

There is no difference, it's under warranty and supposed to run at up to 95C.

The fact is MOST miners undervolted, overvolted, whatever are MUCH more likely to run the fan significantly higher and actually have significantly lower temps as a result.

My mining rigs are in another unused room with the fans roaring and the temps lower. I've had these 2x290's in the same room as me for gaming, they ran hotter and had a lower fan speed because the same fan speed(60-65% being enough depending on weather to bring the temps down to sub 85C) as when mining in the other room is simply unbearable.

People might stick 6 cards close together in a basement, but the fan is also at 100% and either running cooler or at worst at the same temp as gamer/light user.

Worst case is the cards throttle at the same temp while mining so who cares. The reality is most people whack the fans up and drop the temps lower than your average gaming card will reach when gaming.
 
drunkenmaster said:
That isn't a problem.

Person A buys a 290x he games a bit, or mines, the card hits 95C and throttles and stays at 95C the whole time. He undervolted his card, the card still went to 95C then throttled.

Person B overvolts, it hits 95C and throttles, it runs at 95C the whole time.

Person C games, he overclocks and maybe overvolts, the card goes to 95C, it stays there and throttles or not.

There is no difference, it's under warranty and supposed to run at up to 95C.

The fact is MOST miners undervolted, overvolted, whatever are MUCH more likely to run the fan significantly higher and actually have significantly lower temps as a result.

My mining rigs are in another unused room with the fans roaring and the temps lower. I've had these 2x290's in the same room as me for gaming, they ran hotter and had a lower fan speed because the same fan speed(60-65% being enough depending on weather to bring the temps down to sub 85C) as when mining in the other room is simply unbearable.

People might stick 6 cards close together in a basement, but the fan is also at 100% and either running cooler or at worst at the same temp as gamer/light user.

Worst case is the cards throttle at the same temp while mining so who cares. The reality is most people whack the fans up and drop the temps lower than your average gaming card will reach when gaming.
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It doesn't matter what people say, as for me, I would not want to gamble on a second hand card unless it was massively discounted and the same goes for folding. If I knew a card was folding 24/7 regardless of nVidia or AMD, I wouldn't touch it.
 
drunkenmaster said:
Worst case is the cards throttle at the same temp while mining so who cares. The reality is most people whack the fans up and drop the temps lower than your average gaming card will reach when gaming.
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Great, so the one mechanical piece, the one most likely to fail, is the part that sees highest wear. Sign me up for that!
 
Gregster said:
The biggest issue I see with this is "who done what with the card in question" For example:

Man 'A' gets his card and starts mining. He carefully sets volts and always keeps an eye on the temps. The cards run 24/7 for 3 months but temps have been good and under volted. The bubble bursts and he decides he wants to recoup some money, so sells his card.

Man 'B' gets his card and starts mining. He raises volts and sets the fan to 100% (or allowed max). Temps are constantly over 95c and time and again, the card is crashing. He gives the card a damned good beasting. the bubble bursts and he decides he wants to recoup some money, so sells his card.

Both sell the card and the unsuspecting buyer see's 290 for sale. Did a little mining but well looked after.

That is the biggest problem for me.
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The thing I do agree with is your first line and this applies to all second hand cards. IT doesn't matter if it's a gaming or a mining card or anything you buy second hand. It's buyer beware.

But for the 290 cards at least, it's not possible to go above 95 degrees. The card throttles to maintain that 95 degrees. The line "temps constantly going over 95c time and again" is wrong.

At the end of the day it's how well the card was looked after by the owner be it a gaming or mining card. And that's all that matters.
 
melmac said:
The thing I do agree with is your first line and this applies to all second hand cards. IT doesn't matter if it's a gaming or a mining card or anything you buy second hand. It's buyer beware.

But for the 290 cards at least, it's not possible to go above 95 degrees. The card throttles to maintain that 95 degrees. The line "temps constantly going over 95c time and again" is wrong.

At the end of the day it's how well the card was looked after by the owner be it a gaming or mining card. And that's all that matters.
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So you are saying it is impossible for a 290 for example to go over 95c? Genuine question.
 
Gregster said:
So you are saying it is impossible for a 290 for example to go over 95c? Genuine question.
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Never seen it happen, it'll just throttle (Which is why I repeat it's not designed to run at 95c, as it throttles at 94c, which then means it's going under 95c, when it gets back to 94c, guess what it does? Throttle) it's to remain under 95c.

It's very very shady to say it's designed for 95c, as it's incapable of really running at 95c.

The fan should ramp up to compensate for the heat, not performance diminish.
 
Gregster said:
So you are saying it is impossible for a 290 for example to go over 95c? Genuine question.
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Yeah it can't. It's hardware limited. AS soon as it hits 95 degrees it increases fan speed to cool it down. It increases the fanspeed to whatever is set in the overdrive settings. Lets say you have it in uber mode for the 290x, it increases fan speed to 55% when it reaches that speed and if it still needs to cool down then it throttles performance.
 
melmac said:
Yeah it can't. It's hardware limited. AS soon as it hits 95 degrees it increases fan speed to cool it down. It increases the fanspeed to whatever is set in the overdrive settings. Lets say you have it in uber mode for the 290x, it increases fan speed to 55% when it reaches that speed and if it still needs to cool down then it throttles performance.
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Pretty much the same as the GK104/GK110 cards. My Titans for instance will throttle at 70c (not that I see that because of water). They only throttle by 13Mhz at a time and just enough to keep it cool.
 
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