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dirtydog · 24 Dec 2006 at 14:51

Jokester said:
The Damilola Taylor case was dogged with controversy though over dodgy police tactics (paying witnesses effectively), police incompetence, cases getting thrown out, and multiple retrials.

The Kris Donald case appears to have went smoothly with clear culprits being found quickly and found guilty in court without any of the above issues occuring.

Jokester

I remember home secretary Jack Straw even visited the parents or the funeral and stuff didn't he?

I think we all know that if Kriss Donald had been an ethnic minority then more would have been made of the case than was done.

Jokester · 24 Dec 2006 at 14:56

dirtydog said:
I think we all know that if Kriss Donald had been an ethnic minority then more would have been made of the case than was done.

I disagree, people from ethnic minorities get murdered all the time, I think the main reason his case got so much light was because of his age and the fact the police made such a mess of it.

What about the case of the black kid that got an axe in the head, didn't get anymore press in my opinion than the Kris Donald case. And it was very similar in it's outcome, straight forward case to solve without any **** ups on the part of the police.

Jokester

cleanbluesky · 24 Dec 2006 at 15:20

starscream said:
Exactly that. Enlightenment means to gain understanding about a subject. The more understand/knowledge/wisdom you have on a given subject, the better position you are to pass comment on it, whether good or bad.

But religion is a socially constructed idea, learning about social constructions does not automatically mean you are discovering the truth. Learning about lies does not make you more enlightened.

cleanbluesky · 24 Dec 2006 at 15:24

starscream said:
If not, who should be the judge of whether a person can or can not practice such an ideology?

It is obtuse to believe that society allows people to practice all ideologies freely, there should not be any special allowance for if that ideology also happens to be a 'religion'

Well lets use the Sikh religion as an example, as that's whats being talked about here. If a person wants to criticise this ideology, consider these 2 statements

A) I dislike like Sikh religion as having studied the Granth a disagree with....etc etc
B) I dislike the Sikh religion because....ummmm......

To me A is enlightened criticism, B is a bigoted opinion.

We're not talking about the Sikh religion, we are talking about religions in general - no-one has said they dislike the Sikh religion, please stop using the word 'enlightened' as it is a subjective term and does not help us further the debate, both would be opinion yet one is an opinion with accompanying reason, I don't believe any ideology should be accepted regardless of merit be it religious or otherwise

starscream · 24 Dec 2006 at 15:28

cleanbluesky said:
But religion is a socially constructed idea, learning about social constructions does not automatically mean you are discovering the truth. Learning about lies does not make you more enlightened.

Indeed, and it is through education and learning that the truth and lies can be seperated.

kibblerok · 24 Dec 2006 at 15:43

haha thread of the year tbh

Robosapien · 24 Dec 2006 at 16:48

Imagine there's no Heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

phykell · 24 Dec 2006 at 18:28

^^^^
Damned hippy

Seriously though:

"More than 200 Sikhs from around the UK gathered in Edinburgh to hold a two-hour prayer vigil following the boy's claims."

I wonder if the kirpans are out for him in Edinburgh?

-Mike- · 24 Dec 2006 at 18:31

WHY does he keep posting threads like this?

VIRII · 24 Dec 2006 at 18:42

starscream said:
Exactly that. Enlightenment means to gain understanding about a subject. The more understand/knowledge/wisdom you have on a given subject, the better position you are to pass comment on it, whether good or bad.

No it doesn't really, it usually refers to something on a spiritual level not an educational one. I even posted the dictionary.com link for you

starscream · 24 Dec 2006 at 18:49

VIRII said:
No it doesn't really, it usually refers to something on a spiritual level not an educational one. I even posted the dictionary.com link for you

Enlightenment (or Brightening) broadly means "the acquisition of new wisdom or understanding". However, the English word covers two concepts which can be quite distinct: religious or spiritual enlightenment (German: Erleuchtung) and secular or intellectual enlightenment (German: Aufklärung).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightenment_(concept)

I was referring to intellectual enlightenment, hence the references to education and learning

RoboCod · 24 Dec 2006 at 18:50

-Mike- said:
WHY does he keep posting threads like this?

To keep stirring up and exaggerating issues and problems that aren't actually as bad as they seem. I think we call it sensationalism. All the PC gimp's should stop pandering to this kind of crap.

VIRII · 24 Dec 2006 at 18:52

starscream said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightenment_(concept)

I was referring to intellectual enlightenment, hence the references to education and learning

Of course you were

In response to learning about new religions

It was a poor choice of words to use, stick to education if you mean aducation about religion and enlightenment if you mean a spiritual awakening in a thread about religion...

Visage · 24 Dec 2006 at 18:59

Captain Planet said:
To keep stirring up and exaggerating issues and problems that aren't actually as bad as they seem. I think we call it sensationalism. All the PC gimp's should stop pandering to this kind of crap.

If we stopped people pandering to knee-jerk sensationalism then GD would consist of just 6 threads a day, all of which would begin with the words 'Spec me a...'

Spie · 24 Dec 2006 at 19:07

Visage said:
If we stopped people pandering to knee-jerk sensationalism then GD would consist of just 6 threads a day, all of which would begin with the words 'Spec me a...'

You forgot your predictable posts making sweeping generalisations about our fine members.

cleanbluesky · 24 Dec 2006 at 19:16

starscream said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightenment_(concept)

I was referring to intellectual enlightenment, hence the references to education and learning

Get with the times, were into postmodernity now

Visage · 24 Dec 2006 at 20:10

Spie said:
You forgot your predictable posts making sweeping generalisations about our fine members.

Good point.

6 threads starting 'Spec me a...' and 3 threads by me taking the Michael would be more accurate.

Happy Christmas.

VIRII · 24 Dec 2006 at 20:19

Spie said:
You forgot your predictable posts making sweeping generalisations about our fine members.

He's special though, a bastion of moral conscience, a guardian reader and person with strong moral conscience who likes to remind us how he was educated in one of the top universtities in the country and owns more than one dwelling.... socialism in action or is that egotistical hypocrisy hmmm.

VIRII · 24 Dec 2006 at 20:20

Visage said:
Good point.

6 threads starting 'Spec me a...' and 3 threads by me taking the Michael would be more accurate.

Happy Christmas.

Yet you still read the posts and post here yourself :confused:

I wonder if you'd be able to stand up straight if I removed that pole from your bowels.

Azza · 24 Dec 2006 at 20:27

Woops double post.

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