Soldato
I suspect EPS configured for comfort has a part to play in modern cars feeling "clinical".
Show Us Your Motors!
- Thread starter Lopéz
- Start date
I suspect EPS configured for comfort has a part to play in modern cars feeling "clinical".
While it affects manuals less since around 2011/12 or so things have been tweaked for "eco" as well which takes away from the pleasure of driving a bit - even more so if you specifically select eco driving mode.
Soldato
Sound deadening, smaller petrol engines with turbos, the fact some hatchbacks are blisteringly quick and too easy to drive fast, the lack of manual cars..etc etc
Absolutely! Most modern cars feel so insulated and numb that most brands most certainly did peak 2000-2010. Brands knocking great cars out today are very limited, Toyota are a stand out with the Gazoo Racing line of cars, but most other brands have just lost it in both styling and subjective feel and excitement at road legal speeds. Oh you can still buy a brand new Caterham.
The only stuff that I have found an improvement over what came before in someways are *some* of the modern hybrid supercars, the Ferrari 296 for example I found more enjoyable than the 488/F8 before it, but I still preferred my 458 and the 812 is still superior. The Mclaren Artura I will stick my neck out and say it is the best Mclaren yet to drive and do everything, just has for me one weakness, I am not blown away by its looks. That aside these cars with some options are 250-400k so silly money for a car or a toy. The issue is hybrid fixes turbo lag by using EV to give instant hit, but this instant hit is some what NA cars had anyway, in short we went from NA to turbo, it negatively impacted powerband so now EV is used to correct that to good effect, or just go back to a decent powered ICE car and its not an issue.
This is why the peak cars from the 1990-2015 period are absolutely rocketing in price, low mileage 458's are 200k now, Mclarens are also starting to shows signs of moving up, Lamborghinis are on the up, petrol heads and enthusiast are realising that as a true experience, a true connection in all elements, subjective feel, sound, performance you can use and enjoy on the road the older ICE cars are simply in a league of their own.
The time to enjoy is now as no one knows what is going to happen 2030 onwards, will EV be the only option, maybe synthetic fuels will win or maybe we will just stick with our dirty oily smelly cars.
I for one am enjoying the moment, because if some get their way there will be no fun left in motoring on the road, not in the UK anyway.
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Soldato
It's an interesting discussion though perhaps warrants a specific thread for it.
Soldato
I also own a 2001 Boxster S it's a bit knackered but I love it.. manual shifter you can hear the car clunking into gear, the steering is heavy, it's a bit rattly but you can hear the mechanics of the car operate.. that adds something to the drive experience for me which you don't get anymore.
Exactly it become a numbers game back then everyone was chasing performance and actually the thing that most of us as petrol heads truly enjoy in a car is the connection and the ability to enjoy and push it hard on the UK road, which is something you truly cannot do with a conscience in a modern car, let alone a supercar.
If I get a bit fruity in the Alfa I am 100 leptons plus and that is in one of the more connected saloons on the road, some of the Audi stuff is so quick but even at insane speed you still feel like your driving like grandma to the shops yet if the officer spots you its jail time.
Think people are realising this now and is why peak cars, particular some manual supercars have truly exploded in price, perfect example is go drive a Caterham with just 100HP and tell me you did not enjoy yourself, go drive a Ferrari 308 with a manual and tell me you did not enjoy yourself, we all got blinded by numbers and truly forgot what we all truly enjoy and want in a car, excitement, connection, amazing sound. Problem with older stuff now, especially older super cars is you need to budget 5-10k per year in servicing and repairs.
I went to a 458 after my SVR because I did not want a slower car, even though in the dealership for same or less money were Ferrari 430 manuals and 430 Scuds, both of which have now shot up around 50-100k in value, whereas my 458 even the legend it is has only held value or gone up a bit. But I went that route as the idea of a slower car was a big no no even though there is nothing slow about a 430 on the road, but of course its no faster than most modern milk floats or performance hatches/saloons. Don't get me wrong, love the 458 I've made amazing memories with it and friends and oh what a car it is, but the mindset back then was certainly numbers, whereas times are changing.
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Soldato
Couldn't agree more
Soldato
Chavs these days… antisocial meets in cobham. Grrrr.
I didn't give you permission to post a picture of my mums car.
Soldato
@Gibbo I agree with your points about engagement and theatre Vs outright pace. That’s why I’m so taken with the Astons right now. They may not be the quickest but they dish up fun & theatre at regular speeds as well as being incredibly capable.
Golden hour in the sun, tried to capture the paint but just seems camera really struggles to pickup the effect Volcano Red has, but don't think I have ever looked back at a car as much as this one, the colour is like liquid in person even in the shade and when the sun hits the car it is like every shade of red has literally erupted:
In regards to the topic of how fun and engaging is it at legal speeds, well the 458 wins hands down, but saying that it is a lot more engaging than a 720S at legal speeds because of regular passive suspension setup, weighing less, not sure on the weight but its circa 1290kg dry, power delivery is savage on boost but you do end up going damn quick. The 458 though extremely capable thrills plenty at 30-80mph due to short gearing and an engine with a power band that is immense from 2000rpm upto 9000rpm but you never feel the need to rev it all way out. The 600 LT has longer gearing and the turbos are savage between 4000-8000rpm, as such you want to rev it out and it is very planted so its more a 60-130mph fun car, not ideal for UK roads but could be worse, some supercars literally feel numb and boring sub 100mph which are totally pointless for the UK.
The 600 LT the reaction from the public is insane, at the weekend cars in front will pulling over and mounting the curb just so I'd pass them so they could look, sticking thumbs out the windows. Parked up in a super market and let about three different kids sit in the car who came over with their different families, people absolutely love it, no one knows what it is apart from later that day I went to fuel up, a guy turned around, came to the fuel station just to ask if he could look at it as he had never seen a 600 LT in the flesh before. The public really adore it but I think the colour helps a lot as all age groups go mad for it, helps been the only 600 LT in Volcano Red in the UK is what Mclaren inform me.
Though it is firm, it is such a lovely and easy car to drive, nice to be able to return 35mpg plus on a run, but equally as capable of returning single digits when loud pedal is mashed.
In regards to the topic of how fun and engaging is it at legal speeds, well the 458 wins hands down, but saying that it is a lot more engaging than a 720S at legal speeds because of regular passive suspension setup, weighing less, not sure on the weight but its circa 1290kg dry, power delivery is savage on boost but you do end up going damn quick. The 458 though extremely capable thrills plenty at 30-80mph due to short gearing and an engine with a power band that is immense from 2000rpm upto 9000rpm but you never feel the need to rev it all way out. The 600 LT has longer gearing and the turbos are savage between 4000-8000rpm, as such you want to rev it out and it is very planted so its more a 60-130mph fun car, not ideal for UK roads but could be worse, some supercars literally feel numb and boring sub 100mph which are totally pointless for the UK.
The 600 LT the reaction from the public is insane, at the weekend cars in front will pulling over and mounting the curb just so I'd pass them so they could look, sticking thumbs out the windows. Parked up in a super market and let about three different kids sit in the car who came over with their different families, people absolutely love it, no one knows what it is apart from later that day I went to fuel up, a guy turned around, came to the fuel station just to ask if he could look at it as he had never seen a 600 LT in the flesh before. The public really adore it but I think the colour helps a lot as all age groups go mad for it, helps been the only 600 LT in Volcano Red in the UK is what Mclaren inform me.
Though it is firm, it is such a lovely and easy car to drive, nice to be able to return 35mpg plus on a run, but equally as capable of returning single digits when loud pedal is mashed.
Your assuming I drive beyond the speed limit, not saying I don’t but when I say the 60-130mph I’m not referring that I drive at 130 on the road in saying if speed limits did not exist then that is where the car would be amazing, but save those speeds for track or roads without speed limits.
Soldato
Gardening is in a different section
Soldato
But she did, last night.
kinell lovely gibbo pingsGolden hour in the sun, tried to capture the paint but just seems camera really struggles to pickup the effect Volcano Red has, but don't think I have ever looked back at a car as much as this one, the colour is like liquid in person even in the shade and when the sun hits the car it is like every shade of red has literally erupted:
In regards to the topic of how fun and engaging is it at legal speeds, well the 458 wins hands down, but saying that it is a lot more engaging than a 720S at legal speeds because of regular passive suspension setup, weighing less, not sure on the weight but its circa 1290kg dry, power delivery is savage on boost but you do end up going damn quick. The 458 though extremely capable thrills plenty at 30-80mph due to short gearing and an engine with a power band that is immense from 2000rpm upto 9000rpm but you never feel the need to rev it all way out. The 600 LT has longer gearing and the turbos are savage between 4000-8000rpm, as such you want to rev it out and it is very planted so its more a 60-130mph fun car, not ideal for UK roads but could be worse, some supercars literally feel numb and boring sub 100mph which are totally pointless for the UK.
The 600 LT the reaction from the public is insane, at the weekend cars in front will pulling over and mounting the curb just so I'd pass them so they could look, sticking thumbs out the windows. Parked up in a super market and let about three different kids sit in the car who came over with their different families, people absolutely love it, no one knows what it is apart from later that day I went to fuel up, a guy turned around, came to the fuel station just to ask if he could look at it as he had never seen a 600 LT in the flesh before. The public really adore it but I think the colour helps a lot as all age groups go mad for it, helps been the only 600 LT in Volcano Red in the UK is what Mclaren inform me.
Though it is firm, it is such a lovely and easy car to drive, nice to be able to return 35mpg plus on a run, but equally as capable of returning single digits when loud pedal is mashed.
Underboss
im really into the "cool red" colour at the moment, my new car will be in a similar colour
saw a new (ish) Fiesta today in a lovely "red" too, but yours Gibbo, is another level
cant wait to see it in person
saw a new (ish) Fiesta today in a lovely "red" too, but yours Gibbo, is another level
cant wait to see it in person