Six Nations 2017 (4th February - 18 March)

Dis86 said:
Some stinkers from the referees there gave Italy a bit more credit than I think they were due but...England need to pull their socks up. Start like crap every time.
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The referee had an excellent game, he did absolutely nothing wrong the stinker was from England's thick as **** forwards who can't play school boy Rugby and are clueless of the laws. Everybody in white pretty much played like a donkey today and deserved to have had a loss served up to them.
 
TheMightyTen said:
The referee had an excellent game, he did absolutely nothing wrong the stinker was from England's thick as **** forwards who can't play school boy Rugby and are clueless of the laws. Everybody in white pretty much played like a donkey today and deserved to have had a loss served up to them.
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All you've done throughout every post is criticise them. Starting to think you have a tiny bias.

Anyhow...Italian try number two...the intercept was a result of an early tackle on haskell. Not picked up by the ref.

How many high tackles did he flag?

Did he card any Italian player for their constant encroachment during the line outs?

And the commentators mentioned a few times something I'd noticed, the Italian scrum collapsing but England being penalised for it.
 
Dis86 said:
All you've done throughout every post is criticise them. Starting to think you have a tiny bias.

Anyhow...Italian try number two...the intercept was a result of an early tackle on haskell. Not picked up by the ref.

How many high tackles did he flag?

Did he card any Italian player for their constant encroachment during the line outs?

And the commentators mentioned a few times something I'd noticed, the Italian scrum collapsing but England being penalised for it.
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That and the second Italian try being a direct result of the fallen Italian and medics causing a big gap in the English line, he should have stopped the game but didn't.

If I was playing I'd have run into the one of the Italians, making it look like a tackle of the ball. Would start rock up the penalties and if big enough boys hit the players hard enough they'll stop it.
 
Abraxaz1 said:
That and the second Italian try being a direct result of the fallen Italian and medics causing a big gap in the English line, he should have stopped the game but didn't.

If I was playing I'd have run into the one of the Italians, making it look like a tackle of the ball. Would start rock up the penalties and if big enough boys hit the players hard enough they'll stop it.
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True yup. Pitch decorum dictates you either avoid the area or put the ball out of play. You don't use that player to obstruct opponents and prevent them tackling.
 
Some great ranting from Eddie Jones and the England players in regards to this 'no ruck formed' business.

I thought it was clever from the Italians, and even though 'Italian' is right next to 'dirty tricks' in the sporting dictionary, I think it's innovative and you can't expect the Italians to compete in a conventional way against England at Twickenham.
 
The Italians, if anything, deserved to be further ahead at half time. Regardless of the Italian tactic England looked clueless.
Seems to be a lot of sour grapes coming from England's coaches and some ex players complaining about what Italy were up to. Not fair at all. It's not a new law or something they're taking advantage of. Similar to not engaging in a maul and one man running around the back to take them out.

Thing is, after it became obvious they were going to try it continuously the England backrow and scrum half should have been licking their lips. No Italians within a metre of the tackle to get up a head of steam and half the Italian team waving their arms around in the England backline. Pick and go, pick and go. Eventually they'll have to contest a breakdown, ruck formed half the Italian team offside, easy peasy. The Chiefs tried it for a while but don't anymore because you just leave yourself so open.

Luckily for England they figured it out and ran in some nice scores!
 
All credit to the Italians for trying something different imo. I'm quite disappointed in the negative comments coming from the English coaches and ex-players, making out that it "wasn't rugby". It was a fascinating game to watch and a far, far more interesting spectacle than watching England thump the Italians 60-0 or something. It was within the rules and forced the players to think, and once England had wised up a little it led to some interesting gameplay, with us just powering through the middle. Was great seeing that rolling maul after Launchbury's catch.

Personally I'm hoping to see teams try that uncontested trick more often for the variation!
 
I just can not get over how clueless supposed Professional players are, the skills session with the juniors I coach last night they were all "but sir, after the second time why didin't they just drive through the middle or hold a blue player.............." these are 11-14 year olds :rolleyes:

Of all the home nations we now know the England players are mostly thick, Ireland would have coped easily as they play with a heads up intelligence, Wales would have struggled because pretty much to a player they are as dim witted as the white, Scotland would have had it worked out in the first quarter (particularly if it was a game where Laidlaw was fit), France would have struggled, shrugged their shoulders and start to blame each other. If Italy had tried that against the All Blacks they would have been torn a new one.

It annoys the hell out of me that after all the gains of last season England are fast travelling backward now, in skill set and tactical focus, the execution is poor and there are to many individuals reverting to type rather than playing with the team ethic of last season. The rankings may say they are 2nd in World at the moment but the reality is that team actually wers Green at the moment.
 
TheMightyTen said:
I just can not get over how clueless supposed Professional players are, the skills session with the juniors I coach last night they were all "but sir, after the second time why didin't they just drive through the middle or hold a blue player.............." these are 11-14 year olds :rolleyes:

Of all the home nations we now know the England players are mostly thick, Ireland would have coped easily as they play with a heads up intelligence, Wales would have struggled because pretty much to a player they are as dim witted as the white, Scotland would have had it worked out in the first quarter (particularly if it was a game where Laidlaw was fit), France would have struggled, shrugged their shoulders and start to blame each other. If Italy had tried that against the All Blacks they would have been torn a new one.

It annoys the hell out of me that after all the gains of last season England are fast travelling backward now, in skill set and tactical focus, the execution is poor and there are to many individuals reverting to type rather than playing with the team ethic of last season. The rankings may say they are 2nd in World at the moment but the reality is that team actually wers Green at the moment.
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Only have to wait a week and a half to find out the answer.

And please stop typing 'would have'. Even your 11-14 year olds would know better.
 
I do wonder if they'll change the rules if more teams use it (not all game but at crucial moments that might be contentious), not because of England complaining but simply because it's one more thing the poor refs have to look out for. Now you'll have players shooting around to intercept a pass from the 9 and the ref will have to think, crumbs there's no one from their team contesting over the tackle atm but was there a split second ago? Are their players within 1 meter of the tackle and therefore offside? It's a lot to process in the split seconds it all happens along with all the other things they need to be mindful of.

Not sure how you'd change it though. Ruck formed once the defence has a man through the gate and over their tackled player regardless of the opposition whereabouts? Maybe with 2 men forming pillars? Opposition defence within a couple meters of the tackle area considered within contestable range of ball therefore ruck whether they are contesting or not?

Player are so used to the tackle area becoming a ruck you can see it's just drilled into them. We're protecting tackled player therefore it's a ruck... wtf are they doing so far offside?
A bit ridiculous not to know the rules when it's your profession.
 
Professionalism in rugby has removed the real World think for yourself experience from the modern player. When England last won back to back Grand Slams there were solicitors, soldiers, policemen, surgeons, builders and labourers in the team. All of them in different ways had to think for themselves on a daily basis. They would have worked out what to do. Modern rugby players are identified earlier ushered into development schemes and told what to do in every situation all the time. When Lancaster's men lost so heavily to Wales in 2013 it was obvious they had the wrong game plan and were under committing at the breakdown allowing Wales to bully them. The players on the pitch couldn't change this by themselves and still can't. They are capable of being brilliant in enacting a move or tactic but naïve in analysing one.

As an aside to the above I once fell out with a coach for the reverse of the above, I was playing for the 1's at 12 and we were getting torn apart in the backs, the coach came on an told us to man up. We ignored him and huddled to discuss how we change our tactics and moved to an aggressive blitz defence which stemmed the flow. Shame professionals can't apply critical thinking themselves.
 
Just had an email through from our regional Referees committee clarifying Law 16 ;), looks like they are expecting every Tom, Richard & Harry to have a go at ruckless rugby this weekend and mayhem to ensue. The referees have also been instructed to not call tackle or ruck and leave it up to the players to decide what's going on in front of them. I expect a lot of amateur Rugby is going to be blighted with high penalty counts for a few weeks :(
 
Well none of that shenanigans igans at the game today thankfully. Shocking display by the referees again however. Even the away fans were booing as it took so much away from the game.
 
Big Billy back in the England training squad for the Scotland game after a good 72 minutes for the Fezs against Falcons, I expect to see him make an appearance off the bench against Scotland and to start against Ireland. Really good news because England desperately need some front foot ball off of big carriers to use their skill set properly :)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/39175184
 
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