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So just how are AMD going to shoot themselves in the foot with the NAVI launch?

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by bru, May 1, 2019.

  1. Calin Banc

    Hitman

    Joined: Aug 14, 2009

    Posts: 773

  2. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 3,603

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    Funny how AdoredTV gets ripped apart when the Navi rumours were favourable and is now given credence when the Navi rumours are negative.
     
  3. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2006

    Posts: 11,828

    Same way high power usage and heat is apparently fine when it's Nvidia, but not when it's AMD :p
     
  4. eeii

    Gangster

    Joined: Feb 3, 2017

    Posts: 258

    Location: Mondas

    Water block companies around the world rejoice. Which is great for me. Nice cheap crappy blower please so I can slap a new water block on it and spank the ar$e off it. :D
    Most AMD cards love water ;)
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
  5. Calin Banc

    Hitman

    Joined: Aug 14, 2009

    Posts: 773

    I'm usually open to what he has to say, regardless if it's good or bad against a company.

    If Navi will be good or not remains to be seen. I'm more in the boat of "there is no such thing as a bad card, only bad prices". If they can give Vega 56 performance at no more than 200-220 dollars (or less for a potential 4GB variant), it will be good.
     
  6. Darujhistan

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 28, 2011

    Posts: 3,422

    Tbh if it isn't all that I'll happily buy a V64 and pair Ryzen 2 with that. I've held off since last September waiting for R2 and Navi, but there's a limit.
     
  7. Dalandius

    Gangster

    Joined: Jan 5, 2014

    Posts: 226

    This is AMD so poor availability and driver support, on both counts I am hoping to be wrong.
     
  8. bru

    Soldato

    Joined: Oct 21, 2002

    Posts: 6,828

    Location: kent


    It is daft because in the Navi thread he is being trashed for talking Billy.
    But it does just go to show how much we all want to right about how we think the chips will fall so to speak.
    Only a few more weeks and then we can see just what AMD plan to bring to the market, let us hope the CPU arena is as good as rumours seem to say it is and that the GPU side of things is better than the latest rumours.
     
  9. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 3,603

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    ^^ oh yes

    Since all of the rumours have gotten out of control and now contradictory, I'm going to state my personal hype train as where I'm coming in and what I'm waiting for. We'll see how disappointed I end up in a month or two:

    For my new rig, I want a Navi card to trade punches with the RTX 2070, to do so with a single 8-pin power connector and to cost no more than £300. And a waterblock.
    For my other half's new rig, I'd be happy with existing Vega 56 performance for no more than £250.

    I'm about to sort through all my old rat blankets so I can make a start getting hankies for me to cry into when Navi doesn't meet those modest, 2019 expectations.
     
  10. bru

    Soldato

    Joined: Oct 21, 2002

    Posts: 6,828

    Location: kent

    Well your wants are not to outlandish, so I reckon you will get two out of three, not sure which one will be a let down for you though.
    Well at least I hope it is only two out of three and not worse.
     
  11. ANDREW GREEN

    Gangster

    Joined: Sep 17, 2018

    Posts: 313

    Last edited: May 6, 2019
  12. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 3,603

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    Cheers Andrew! :p I did mean to type £200 for that one ;) although by the time I get the money together Vega 56 will be off the shelves, plus I'd need to get a new PSU as well.
     
  13. Th0nt

    Soldato

    Joined: Jul 21, 2005

    Posts: 6,023

    Location: N.Ireland

    You can undervolt a tad to run it much cooler with less power, what psu you currently got?
     
  14. ANDREW GREEN

    Gangster

    Joined: Sep 17, 2018

    Posts: 313

    To be serious though. I'd expect AMD can hit 2070 with Navi 10 but I'd expect it to take some power to hit it. How much that will be is a guessing game but I'd expect their top Navi 10 unit to hit 295 Watts, because why not. It'll max out their tech. And we can expect that anywhere between R7 and Vega 64. And it at least has to hit Vega 64 because it's replacing that part and it should beat it because well it's replacing it.

    Vega 56 performance at £200 would be pretty impressive but you might have to wait to say Black Friday to get that price and the same with 2070 Navi for £300. Sooner or later those prices will come up, it's just how long you're willing to wait and be happy with your hardware. Personally I'm quite happy with my hardware for nearly all games and are only let down a little by a few, which I plan on playing after an upgrade. And I can hold off on that until I get the right deal. Partly because I'm happy playing games that are more than 3-4 years old.

    And on a side note I doubt I could tell the difference between Vega 56 and 2070 performance, unless maybe at 4k where it starts to really slow down
     
  15. FoxEye

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 17, 2006

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    Location: Cornwall

  16. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 30,636

    Location: Ireland

    Cliff notes would be nice, not gonna listen to a lot of long winded bollox that could be summed up in a quarter of the time.
     
  17. FoxEye

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 17, 2006

    Posts: 19,531

    Location: Cornwall

    Yeah. He spends so much of his time responding to things people say on his Twitter or some crap.

    Guy is seriously full of himself.

    It's like a forum spat only blown up into a video post for the added bonus of listening to him drone on!
     
  18. Panos

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 9,350

    Location: NE Lincolnshire

    :D
    Or Intel......
     
  19. Grim5

    Hitman

    Joined: Feb 6, 2019

    Posts: 628

    Sad.. it’s not that bad, Intel has heat issues but the power draw is way overplayed imo

    https://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/intel-core-i9-9900k-processor-review,5.html

    https://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-ryzen-7-2700x-review,7.html

    Not sure how reliable guru3d is, posting on a phone it was one of the first to come up but those two reviews that indicated that while playing games the 8700k drew less power than a 2700x and under full multithread stress load the 9900k and 2700x drew the same power

    I think people just assume because the 8700k/9700k/9900k get really hot that they use a lot of power - I haven't heard anyone say the 2700x is a power hog, probably because it has the perception that it’s more efficient because it runs cooler.

    Out of interest, does anyone know the chip size between amd and intel? I know Intel has some really **** TIM design leading to heat issues, but why does Ryzen run so much cooler, is the die/chip itself larger therefore the heat has a larger surface area to dissipate over?
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2019
  20. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 13, 2006

    Posts: 61,485

    There is a relationship between power draw and thermal output - while not quite 1:1 similar power draw will result in similar amounts of heat generated though the efficiency of the cooling will change the sensor numbers for how hot they run.

    The reason people slate the power draw is because they don't understand how Intel specify TDP and don't bother checking the CPU datasheet.

    Ryzen CPUs tend to be quite big which probably helps heat dissipation - the IHS alone is as big or maybe slightly larger than the substrate of an equivalent Intel CPU - the IHS on an equivalent Intel CPU is maybe even approaching 20% smaller area though that is just a comparison from memory.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2019