The 5 year plan to £50k

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It's interesting to hear this. Not gonna lie, I honestly thought for a while that you just got lucky and were often in the right place at the right time or had a career handed to you by mom & dad. It's certainly changed my perception to learn that it wasn't actually plain sailing and that it did take some dedication and sacrifice.

Good on you dude, well done, for realsies :)

Cheers bud... did take some effort... but birthed with high intelligence and a pushy academic for a mother certainly helped.

I'd say I had 3 bigger career steps. 2 of them felt like luck, only 1 effort. The 2 were the second job out of uni and the current one... both calls out of the blue from recruiters.

First, was driving through snow covered Scotland for work while working and barely managed to pull over to take the call... almost didn't. Ended up leading to position.
Second was also while at work... popped out to take the call as a vape brake... were calling me about a better senior network engineer position... but recruiter mentioned that MD said he had read my CV as a potential Technical Director and so when asked where I wanted to be in 5 years, as per typical interview question, mentioned that and he said straight away he was considering me for that now.

Effort one was the jaunt to Switzerland to run a managed service which the company hadn't done before... only got that due to the effort I'd put in with them... so that was truly earned... but then lead to the current position thanks to the experience it gave me and basic terminology I learned ha.
 
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If you're talking circa 100k by age 30 then there are various approaches for non-grads. Sales is the obvious one - various recruitment consultants, estate agents etc.. without degrees exceeding that amount.

You've covered city jobs I guess, the typical barrow boy types have been replaced in various areas by grads but I guess there are still some opportunities out there. (Brokers perhaps and some commodities firms - there is still one open outcry trading floor left in London, the LME)

One interesting one is barrister's clerks, the barrow boys of the legal world, they're potentially replaceable going forwards but some of them seem to earn some serous $$$. Again similar types to the city - Essex boys, East End of London types.

Chartered accountancy is another one, you can qualify in approx 4 years without a degree AFAIK.

Lastly various tradesmen in London, see for example the TV show a while ago re: Pimlico Plumbers, all the "drains men" were on over 100k, the plumbers were on a bit less.

Yeah, success in sales and recruitment are probably the easiest options for this kind of money by my age.

I popped to Hatfield McLaren today to share in the collection of my uni friend's 540C today.

He did the same Physics course as me (but completed it and got his masters) & worked hard in financial recruitment for many years... he's done well and just upgraded his Aston Martin V8 Vantage.

Other than me, he's the only grad from my year, the year before or after me that I know has even been successful. I still know of a few guys who got their masters and a still unemployed 8 years later. And they have a masters from a good red-brick! From how I've seen them post on social media... I think they have the entitlement disease.

For non-grads... the way is to work for some crummier companies who have good contracts and put the big company names on your CV... really helps and as you've done genuine work for them, even if it's in a basic form... as long as you can talk around the project, you're set. Some of the names on my CV in the early days I had not done much for but was able to talk about it well, for everything I'd mentioned.

Those names really strongly helped me secure 2 of my 3 big career steps. The first I was told in no uncertain terms that the names on my CV got me the job. Eg, HSBC, RBS, HBOS, Lloyds, Tesco, BT, Thomson Reuters, Goldmann Sachs, JP Morgan, Helix, Cogent, Genesis, Probitas, various investment banks & hedge funds I'd never heard of at the time... some I still don't have a clue about even after looking for hedge funds to manage my funds!

I had worked for them, so there were no lies involved on my CV or in my talking around the subject... so don't go that route... just find how you helped the projects and either made them or saved them money... that REALLY helps.

Had one great win from my early days for a project for Tesco... only simple thing with software imaging tills. I gave them the method to reduce the build time which shortened their time sensitive overnight deployments for new tills and made larger one-night projects easier to complete with less man power... that's a killer in interview but it was as simple as changing the method really slightly.

Their build strategy was really old for really old hardware. The build had to be decompressed from zip on the server and then loads of small files were copied across the network which, as I'm sure most of you are aware, can be a really slow process... till builds were taking 1.5-2 hours to complete each and you could only do about 3 at a time.

As the hardware had improved... including marginally larger HDDs... there was now enough space to decompress files locally. So the build updated slightly to copy the zip file locally, decompress and then process. This cut the build time down to 30 minutes and on their 100mbit networks, 10 tills could now be done at the same time. So fewer people needed and more could be done at once.

Seems like such a small thing, but as it improved the capability of a large project with a tight budget... it got me noticed, promoted to lead engineer and not long after promoted to a much much better position which got me out of Tesco & high street bank installs and into installing MPLS systems for stock feeds into large investment banks. Plus a great story that is still referenced on my CV today. Only spent ~14 months with that company, it was also the company where I met my wife.



Accountancy and plumbing... yes... good earners... but horrible jobs to do over a long term and excel at unless you are pre-disposed to it.
 
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Soldato
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Thanks for that @crinkleshoes - very interesting reading. My previous boss is a "degree-less yobbo", and is easily the best boss I've ever had. I dropped out of Uni on the first attempt too (I should probably add that bit of backstory), and spent 6 months on the dole before finding some basic clerical work in London for a further 12 months, before heading back to Uni for another go (after figuring out what went wrong the first time).

Again, there seems to be some sort of key turning-point which focuses people's attention and priorities. And taking "chances", as in your move to Switz could have gone badly, etc.

32k to 100k is quite a leap, well done!

:)
 
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I was just chasing more money and/or better hours and/or easier/more interesting/more technical work in my first few positions.
This was pretty much me in the early years, too. Maximise what I could earn without hating what I did... though often I did hate it but thought I was doing OK at the time, so you keep looking for what's next.

Sounds like very similar paths, shame we never caught up when you were in Basel! Saying that, you have a 720 and I don't :p Hopefully my supercar collection should start soon, when I can maximise the fruits of my last few years labour. I'm 32 though, have 3 kids, 2 dogs and just need my Hurracan Performante and house build to finish it off haha
Give me 3 years... I think I can do that...
 
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Thought I might add my career path to the thread.

School: Failed 13+ common entrance to get into the good local private school. My dad was adamant about private education, as he worked hard in order to be able to afford it. I ended up at the private school you go to if you fail to get into all the good private schools. Failed my AS Levels spectacularly (1 E grade and 3 U's!). Went to a local 6th form which opened my eyes quite a bit.

2003-2006 spent at the illustrious University of Plymouth. Enjoyed it. Spent three years making documentaries, was angling towards a career in that industry. Got some great summer internships at literary agents and publishing houses that looked pretty good on my CV and allowed me to dodge a career in publishing as I realised publishing wasn't for me. My sister was working as an HR manager for a City headhunting firm. She told me I'd be crap at headhunting... so I decided to go into headhunting.

2006: Joined a rival firm to hers. Very ambitious company with charismatic owner. £17.5k base with commission. Worked like a dog. 8am-8pm minimum hours in the office. Commute would take over an hour each way, so I don't really remember much of the first few months. Somehow managed to afford a bedroom in a flat share in Parsons Green, 10 doors down from the office. Lived with 5 Australian women (during my time in that flat I lived with 15+ of them, although they didn't like me as I was working so much). Total comp from starting in June through to end of the tax year in March was around £30k.

2007: The company started growing, and I hit a couple of targets in order to establish and run one of the teams - institutional and corporate sales in banks, hedge funds, asset managers, brokerages, etc. Had a decent year at work, hit targets, slaved away at the desk but there was a decent camaraderie amongst us as we were all in the same boat - think about 6 of us out of 20 consultants hit the annual target, which was purposefully set at a very high level. Very stressful environment. Moved to plush offices off Pall Mall. Didn't really have much of a life as I worked so hard. Salary £18k, total comp with commissions of £100k on the nose.

2008: The markets fell apart and the whole environment was awful to work in. Company had grown to about 40 people, although staff turnover was insane. I reckon 75 people worked at the company across 2018. Only 3 of those 75 hit the annual target, but from the outset I'd looked for opportunities within a crumbling banking market, so as banks and funds collapsed I looked to move teams or team heads into smaller firms. I ended up at almost 200% of my target for the year, but the stress placed upon us top performers to essentially prop up the company was starting to take its toll. I was regularly having panic attacks, particularly towards the end of the year, would go to A&E most weeks thinking I was having a heart attack. Ended up having a total nervous breakdown. Anxiety and chronic fatigue meant that I barely saw the office in December of that year, and I quit the first day back in January. I was a quivering mess by the end of it. Salary throughout the year jumped considerably going from £18k to £24k to £36k to £75k - the £75k raise was implemented the month I decided to leave, so I don't think I saw any of it. Total comp for the 9 months I worked was again £100k.

2009: Lay in a dark room and didn't get dressed for two months. Went and got a load of physical health checks done, which started to improve my mental health. Then realised the only way to get back on my feet was to get away, so a mate and I did 4-5 months in the US on a roadtrip. I wasn't totally back to normal but I was getting there. Came back to do an MBA op norf, started seeing someone in London so the MBA became part time. At the same time a couple of former colleagues had set up a headhunting firm, asked me to build the framework and database for capital markets on the basis that I'd get a cut of any revenues generated from it, but I didn't have to actually work beyond building the thing. Caught the bug again whilst putting it together, and then decided to join full time with my MBA put on hold. The plan was to have a go at it for a year, if it was successful then set up a sister company with their backing. Took a salary of £12k! Strangely going from £75k base to £12k didn't hurt at all, and I was invigorated. Rented a great place in London for double my salary which gave me the incentive to work hard - the flat is actually on the market right now https://www.primelocation.com/for-sale/details/47287557#5Rio2FceOvPcj2qW.97

2010: Markets rebounded and I had a great year. Started really getting back into the swing of things and became genuinely good (and appropriately knowledgeable) at my job. Building a headhunting database from zero candidates or clients into a very profitable business within 12 months is tricky, but improved market conditions helped no end. Salary went up to £24k, but all in I had a cracking year - total comp £185k.

2011: Had a go at building the sister company out, but suppressed markets meant a difficult environment in which to recruit into. Hired a guy to join my team and advised my bosses caution about expanding during tough markets. A lot of people left the firm and the company started to resemble my first employer, which was very depressing. A couple of good mates left the firm and I went to leave too, but they'd cocked up my tax code so as I was about to quit I got hit with an unexpected tax bill and had to stay in order to replenish my savings. Salary went to £50k and all in comp reached £115k.

2012: Hated it. Company moved from the heart of the City to Vauxhall obscurity, commute was crap, the whole company had basically become a mini-me of my initial firm. Had a strangely decent year up until I quit at the beginning of December, wasn't doing much work. They made me a number of ridiculous counter offers as I was the most experienced headhunter at the firm in London as the bosses were building a US office at the time - final counter offer was 3 months paid leave before coming back to work, massive salary, 8 weeks holiday a year, etc. I told them to retract the offer as I'd probably accept it and then quit a year later. They paid my outstanding commissions but stiffed me on the purchase of my share of the firm. I didn't really mind as I just wanted to cut all ties. Total comp was £90k for 7 months work from April '12 to December of that year.

2013
: I. Did. Nothing. It was great. Played computer games, read loads of fantasy fiction series that I'd been putting off. Watched a lot of football. Brilliant year. Got fat.

2014: Not particularly wanting to work in headhunting any longer, I took the time to sit out my non-compete clauses but in the end decided to pursue a wholly new client base and candidate pool to avoid any issues - the old firm still chased me and I had to spend a fair bit on legal fees proving that I wasn't breaching anything. Was a right pain. I mostly played Football Manager for 8 hours a day, and worked for 4 hours. Suited me fine. Could take as much holiday as I wanted, didn't have an alarm clock, etc. But I was always switched on and "on call" so despite the relaxed position I was without a proper break. Something that's continued ever since. I won't go into company details as that might be a bit weird, but financially I was around the same level as before but putting in about 25% of the hours I used to.

2015: Same as above really, with a slightly improved revenues. End of the year my girlfriend and I bought my mate (Alex) out of his share of our flat and then renovated. This meant I couldn't work from home, so I decided to have a go at becoming a real company, hired that mate and got a small office close to the City.

2016-2018: The business has gone extremely well. Revenues across my market have dropped somewhat since the heady days of pre-2008. That said, we've been building two great business areas - M&A and Private Equity on one side, and Credit and Fixed Income on the other. Brexit probably hasn't helped in particular, as City hiring levels are definitely down, but instead we've started undertaking work in the US, which of late has proved extremely lucrative. 2016 and 2017 revenues were very pleasing indeed, with me being able to earn more than I have previously. 2018 looks set to double our revenues of the previous year. We had a former colleague sit with us for 2017, which really helped my colleague Alex to realise his potential. We're now moving to a cracking 10-15 person office just of the Southbank, and looking to grow the team in London before making the most of my sister's spot in NYC - she worked in senior HR for one of the world's biggest hedge funds and her husband was an MD at a top tier US bank out there, so she's planning to join in the next year or two to open up business opportunities throughout the US, which is going to become our target market due to London/Europe being comparatively subdued at present (and likely for a few years yet).
 
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Excellent read @toshj - by means of my job I know a few really good people working in that area, it's certainly a harsh mistress whilst you are building your contacts/network up - and one in particular has had a lot of legal issues (not only around non-compete, but other stuff as well) so it's definitely not for the faint-hearted.
 
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It's great to read all these success stories. I feel myself getting into it and feeling pleased with each successful progression.

Well done on the success and I hope those stories inspire others to chase their dreams.
 
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Thanks all :) Actually felt quite cathartic writing all that down. I used to be fixated on money in the first couple of years out of university, and became a real bore. When I broke down after my first job I realised money is far less important than many other factors - family, health, life balance, etc. - so have largely just let it take care of itself rather than actively pursue it. I also used to dislike headhunting and saw it as a necessary to finance myself. Now I see it as a challenge that I enjoy taking on. I hate missing out on placements that I should have made, and although I'm not the busiest of workers, I'm incredibly thorough and detailed. Drives my wife crazy.

The initial firm I joined was sold recently, and the charismatic owner walked away with many millions. Nice guy, very impressive, incredible work ethic. Would run to work every morning, be the first person in the office. Built the business from his bedroom to a ~600 person company, and has given me some great advice over the years.
 
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@Moses

Location: London
Hours: used to be bad, but not 90hrs a week bad (probably 60 ish on a bad week), currently 37.5 a week, which I do actually stick to.
 
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Well, the offer letter is signed and returned, my manager is happy for me and wishes me the best and will happily give a good reference. Start date is looking like the 2nd of July.

Chuffed and nervous, but I'm going in balls deep and will come out the other end swinging :cool:
 
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Glad to know your sex life is going well... I've always fancied trying a swingers party.

But I think this thread is about career development, unless I'm mistaken :p


Nah, once you learn the innuendos you'll soon realise that this is in fact the porn sub forum everyone's been banging on about for years, you just need to read between the lines :D
 

Sui

Sui

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Got my final (hopefully) ACCA exam on Wednesday, not as prepared as I'd like to be but will see how it goes. House buying turned out to big quite a large distraction! :p

If it goes well, I'll hopefully be able to find something to lead me on the path to 50k, but probably not straight off the bat.

Advanced Performance Management (P5) is the exam for those in the know.

P.S Congrats Diddums, good luck with it.
 
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Looking forward I have accepted that £50k is going to be way out of my reach but I would like to improve myself an enter a career of sorts but no idea where to go, I am sick of doing Admin.

I am below average intelligence and thing's don't come easily, I have a HND in IT and business and my target is still to earn £25k - £30k a year without working myself into the ground. On my current salary I need to work almost 60- 65 hours a week to make that kind of money which isn't a realistic approach.

Ugh, having no direction in life and not knowing what my calling is sucks. My brothers racking in a 6 figures at 24 and I can't even think about next week.
 
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Looking forward I have accepted that £50k is going to be way out of my reach but I would like to improve myself an enter a career of sorts but no idea where to go, I am sick of doing Admin.

I am below average intelligence and thing's don't come easily, I have a HND in IT and business and my target is still to earn £25k - £30k a year without working myself into the ground. On my current salary I need to work almost 60- 65 hours a week to make that kind of money which isn't a realistic approach.

Ugh, having no direction in life and not knowing what my calling is sucks. My brothers racking in a 6 figures at 24 and I can't even think about next week.


What @randomshenans said. Your whole attitude needs to change from "poor me" to "**** everyone, I got this!". You need to exude confidence. You're never "below average intelligence" to the point of not being able to be successful. Granted you may not be an Elon Musk but if idiots like Diane Abbott can get to her position then you need to wake the **** up and get on with it.

As for direct advice, go out, get a haircut, go to a barber and get the full monty, then go buy a suit and boost your confidence. Then update your CV and bling it up a bit, make a Linkedin profile, sort out your social stuff (as in make your Facebook page private, get rid of anything that might be seen in a poor light be any prospective employers) and then ring up some agencies and get the word out that you're looking for something.

You CAN be successful, you just need the right attitude. And don't be afraid to ask for advice in here, as you can see from this thread most of the guys in here are all helpful and very willing to help and that's a resource worth its weight in gold.
 
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