1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

** The AMD Navi Thread **

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by subbytna, Aug 20, 2017.

  1. Panos

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 10,226

    Location: Under the hot sun.

    They are the default settings. Similarly to Nvidia default settings.
    You cannot leave one vendor to default and the other you reduce the settings.

    Is like me going to Nvidia drivers and start setting everything to high for no reason. Yet they left the NV drivers to default except the power which is set to maximum performance from Balanced.
     
  2. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 27,403

    Location: Dormanstown.

    Driver optimisations have always been rejected for benchmark fairness.

    I will always remove them first thing from my own machine.
     
  3. Panos

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 10,226

    Location: Under the hot sun.

    For "fairness" then they have to crack up the settings on the NV cards also. Which they didn't except the power from Balanced to Performance mode.
     
  4. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 27,403

    Location: Dormanstown.

    Like I say, all driver optimisations should be rejected.
     
  5. shankly1985

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 25, 2011

    Posts: 18,916

    Location: The KOP

    Since when wasn't any hardware optimisation acceptable?

    All manufacturers optimisation the hardware for day to day tasks out of the box.

    What nvidia does out of the box is different to AMDs out of the box doesn't make either wrong.

    All settings should be left at the default settings the manufacturer see fit.

    That goes for anything you buy.
     
  6. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 27,403

    Location: Dormanstown.

    In the old benchmark threads here it was stipulated the driver optimisations were removed.

    They've always been considered "Cheating" by lowering IQ to give performance gains.
     
  7. Mauller

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 7, 2015

    Posts: 2,709

    Location: South West

    Yet all of the settings they changed have no discernible change in IQ but can cause a big performance hit.

    It is not as clear cut as saying "everything should be set to the same value in both"

    What is determined as high in one application is not necessarily the same as high in another.
     
  8. shankly1985

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 25, 2011

    Posts: 18,916

    Location: The KOP

    While most of the features nvidia have been releasing lately do just what you saying.
    DLSS, Adaptive shader.

    But amd have optimisation in driver like Nvidia now it's cheating?
    Keeping in mind these do not affect image quality.
     
  9. Poneros

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 18, 2015

    Posts: 2,958

    The idea is to disable all driver optimisations on BOTH vendors in order to get an as apples-to-apples comparison as possible. Whether it works that way in practice is not clear; after all, we don't know what the drivers really do in the background. So it's hard to say if it works as intended or not.

    Regardless, I have done tests myself with & without, on AMD GPUs, and the differences were more or less inconsequential. So I have no issues with trusting BabelTR's numbers.
     
  10. shankly1985

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 25, 2011

    Posts: 18,916

    Location: The KOP

    Only real setting that does change performance is tessellation.
     
  11. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 3,796

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

  12. Panos

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 10,226

    Location: Under the hot sun.

    You forget the obvious. These are the default settings AMD is operating, while he kept most of those things OFF on Nvidia cards.
    AMD tesselation optimization doesn't tank the performance (mainly) in Gimpworks games to boot and the Surface Format Optimization improves how the memory handles textures.
    Both these settings on Default they do not affect image quality. Yet this review changed the settings, including the texture Filtering quality to High. (which has around 1-2% impact)

    Yet the guy set to OFF almost everything Nvidia has on the drivers, and put the cards from the default "Balanced" power mode to "Performance" power mode. On top in AB crack up power limits, voltages and the thermal throttling cap.
    So basically he didn't run the Nvidia cards out of the box but overclocked (relying on Boost curve). The only thing did on the 5700XT was to set the card to 40% fan speed max as the default setting is very low.

    And this is obvious from the results. Look at The Division 2 performance at 2560x1440. The best review on 2070S shows 80fps (Hexus). All other reviews have the 2070S doing between 75-78. This review shows 85!
    With the same drivers and same setup (8700K @ 4.8Ghz - Hexus, TB or 9900K @ 5Ghz Anandtech, Legitreviews). Want me to start writing about the other games and reviews?

    He basically tried to run overclocked Nvidia cards against the 5700XT AE. (his 5700XT results are based on the 5700XT AE with -75mhz clock).
     
  13. HeX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jun 20, 2004

    Posts: 11,760

    Location: Huddersfield, UK

  14. Panos

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 10,226

    Location: Under the hot sun.

    Yeah and not that much more expensive than the other blocks (it includes the Nickel backplate).
    €20 over the Acetal + Nickel backplate or €16 over Plexi + Nickel backplate, or €28 over the cheapest option, Acetal + black backplate.

    However I am afraid that going to be the only GPU compatible with this. The core center is tiny, it won't cover bigger Navi chips like 5800 and 5900 :(
     
  15. Besty

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 3,066

    Well dammit I had to order that new SE block and cancel my old order. FOMO was guaranteed.
     
  16. Phate

    Caporegime

    Joined: Nov 1, 2003

    Posts: 34,642

    Location: Lisbon, Portugal

  17. Mark Poppin

    Associate

    Joined: Jan 4, 2018

    Posts: 5

    The review also set the texture filtering to high in the Nvidia control panel to match AMD settings. AMD tessellation settings are set to use application settings to match Nvidia's setting which does this by default.

    Besides reviews, BTR tracks Adrenalin driver performance monthly, and if Surface Format Optimization is used, the result are more variable.

    This editor has worked with AMD for over a decade benching their hardware and they accept the results.

     
  18. shankly1985

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 25, 2011

    Posts: 18,916

    Location: The KOP

    The issue here using Application Settings for tessellation. That does nothing but hurt AMD in titles when the tessellation is to much I.e most of the old Nvidia sponsored titles or a title with strong tessellation.
    AMD has gotten better but still lags behind Nvidia when it comes to tessellation power. I no VEGA massively improved not sure about navi!
     
  19. Besty

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 3,066

    Data starting to come through.

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Panos

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 10,226

    Location: Under the hot sun.

    I do not get how the lesser overclocked 7700K managed to get higher combined score :confused: