Yes our society is the same as most other societies on the planet.
It has its problems.
That's not an excuse to allow the importing of other societies problems though which we are doing because we have no way of stopping it.
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Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (March Poll)
- Thread starter Burnsy2023
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Yes our society is the same as most other societies on the planet.
It has its problems.
That's not an excuse to allow the importing of other societies problems though which we are doing because we have no way of stopping it.
How is that a nimbyism
How is it not?
Out of work benefits are pathetic, no one is having a good life on the dole
Soldato
Lies, out of work benefits include 100GB interwebs, full skytv (including porn), anual holidays to the Bahamas and a daily mars bar.
sweeping statement after sweeping statement.
Soldato
Spoken like a true blue tory. The Welfare state has a purpose. Not everyone is a layabout. Most people would love an opportunity to work and have some dignity but the fact is there are not enough jobs for everyone when you consider lack of experience and low level education, and often suitable vacancies for unsuitable applicants who have simply not earned the correct skillset. People do work when they can and when they are afforded reasonable options. You can't tar all unemployed with the same brush.
Its not immigration and EU rule that are getting to me.
The EU has become a construct of no liability or judgment.
Its a very smoke and mirrors when it comes to the EU.
To many holes and wash over accounts for my liking.
The pro EU crowd need to pull the head out of the mobile phones and look around.
I know, its a strange conception to actually look AROUND at the world.
PRO EU IS.................................................
Waits for ban hammer!!
The EU has become a construct of no liability or judgment.
Its a very smoke and mirrors when it comes to the EU.
To many holes and wash over accounts for my liking.
The pro EU crowd need to pull the head out of the mobile phones and look around.
I know, its a strange conception to actually look AROUND at the world.
PRO EU IS.................................................
Waits for ban hammer!!
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Caporegime
And even when there are jobs available, the salaries for workers of that level of experience and education are so low, that they fall into the trap of being better off on benefits. And why are these salaries so low? Saturation of this particular sector with ever greater hordes of EU migrants.
Soldato
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Sigh, in their urge to have a scrap, people did miss the most important reference in that article:
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...pes-rely-on-high-level-of-net-migration-to-uk
http://budgetresponsibility.org.uk/
Yes, suppose we leave the EU, and suppose we somehow get a way to cut migration drastically on purely ideological grounds, magicking away Free Movement, and now there's yet another budgetary gap not covered in anyone's manifesto: Where would you cut? Whom would you tax and at what level? Would either measure be fair? Would you go after the disabled again? Force the dead and the dying back into insecure zero-hours labour?
The last time our economy shrank, jobs were shed; why is it worthwhile to risk this again? For a person on benefits now, how would it be possible to 'work harder', with a long history of unemployment, upon Brexit?
How would an uncertain economic outlook and wranglings over trade and migration help them in finding a job? Who would be creating jobs in such a climate, for that matter?
Now, as happened with the recent NHS u-turn, suppose the migration measures have to be relaxed for the levels to appreciate to a more sensible, market-driven value; and the silly 35K income clause is quietly buried: What was the point of leaving over economic migration, then?
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...pes-rely-on-high-level-of-net-migration-to-uk
http://budgetresponsibility.org.uk/
Yes, suppose we leave the EU, and suppose we somehow get a way to cut migration drastically on purely ideological grounds, magicking away Free Movement, and now there's yet another budgetary gap not covered in anyone's manifesto: Where would you cut? Whom would you tax and at what level? Would either measure be fair? Would you go after the disabled again? Force the dead and the dying back into insecure zero-hours labour?
The last time our economy shrank, jobs were shed; why is it worthwhile to risk this again? For a person on benefits now, how would it be possible to 'work harder', with a long history of unemployment, upon Brexit?
How would an uncertain economic outlook and wranglings over trade and migration help them in finding a job? Who would be creating jobs in such a climate, for that matter?
Now, as happened with the recent NHS u-turn, suppose the migration measures have to be relaxed for the levels to appreciate to a more sensible, market-driven value; and the silly 35K income clause is quietly buried: What was the point of leaving over economic migration, then?
Don
I know this. I was out of work for 18 months during the recession and due to ill health so have first-hand experience of what being out of work is like.
I was more referring to people like the chap who was in the cubicle next to me at the Job Centre the last time I signed on. I had gone there with my usual spreadsheet of jobs I'd applied for etc. I overheard his conversation that went much like this "So, what work related activity have you completed this week?" "I ain't done nuffin. Just sign my fing so I can get out of here".
So yeah, I appreciate that being on the dole is no picnic. However I made it to make a point that I would far rather have some eastern-Europeans here cleaning toilets for a fair day's pay than the person in my example above.
Just to be clear if we have a shortage of bog cleaners we would be able to get them from elsewhere.
Preferably without a criminal record and English speaking,but still.
That's the beauty of controlling immigration, you get what you need, not thousands of people who are skilled in stuff that you don't.
Caporegime
I hate these sort of people too. I find their attitude quite offensive to people with ill health who would give anything to be as healthy as they are and be able to work.
I've always wondered though. Surely the unemployed actually keep hundreds if not thousands in work, in Jobcentres, DWP and more.
What if a non-British cleaner can't reach the earnings threshold required to stay here. Would the job type become exempt from the threshold, would we lower the threshold for certain types of jobs (presumably either of these options would defeat the purpose of having a threshold), or would the position sit vacant in the hopes that a British citizen took it?
So you think EU immigrants already in the UK should have right to remain? Or that there should be a quick easy immigration policy for significant others (not necessarily married)? The latter isn't normal anywhere, because it's rife to abuse. Even with the removal of any earnings restraints it'll probably still take a year for immigration official to approve Rilots other half, even if she was married (that's a few months longer than a Brit moving to Canada, and close on a year longer than a Brit moving to OZ).
Unless we just create a rubber stamping exercise for spouses it will significantly affect Rilots family and cost significant sums of money. Unless of course we say all those people you're complaining about in past posts can stay.
The current system of spousal immigration is not great, but not far off many other western nations policies, especially from non western nations (those figures I mentioned earlier will probably double for someone trying to bring their spouse in from say Pakistan. Unfortunately the current system was brought in to appease anti immigration campaigners.
Edit: reading later posts it appears you are happy with all the people currently in the UK staying.
The points about length of time for spousal visas still stands though. Those people bringing their spouses in from outside Europe will find little will change, those bringing in their French or German spouses (or any other EU member) will suddenly find it significantly harder, longer and more expensive.
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