The F1 2014 season
- Thread starter Merlin5
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Newey is notorious for packing things tight in the car in order not to compromise aero. That's why RBR has had so many KERS overheating problems in the last few years.
It looks like he's cut things too fine this year given the long, enclosed exhaust, turbo, energy reclamation, etc.
If you look at the Maclaren, they've got specific structures above the bottle to help cool the car, just so that they can keep the back of the car as streamlined as possible lower down.
It looks like he's cut things too fine this year given the long, enclosed exhaust, turbo, energy reclamation, etc.
If you look at the Maclaren, they've got specific structures above the bottle to help cool the car, just so that they can keep the back of the car as streamlined as possible lower down.
The Lotus nose is stepped so it passes the crash test, i.e. one point of contact. Will be interesting to see if they run with it through all the tests.
I find people taking pleasure in RBR "struggling" a bit pathetic. Like I always say I doubt they said the same in the Ferrari days. Besides from what we have seen/head from the tests RBR problems are almost all down to Renault.
The Lotus has a staggered nose as the rules demand a single cross sectional area 50mm back from the end of the nose. The 2nd nose starts over 50mm back from the front to avoid creating another x-section in the measured zone. The actual crash test will involve both noses.
The RBR issues are a combination of those caused by the Renault power system and the extreme packaging demanded by Newey. After all, the Caterham was able to run once Renault had turned their systems down.
Previously there hasn't be a huge change in the rules. Now engines, tyres and aero are all different. The Renault powered cars are probably going to waste a couple of days at Bahrain just testing the reliability whilst the Merc and Fezza powered cars will be doing extensive aero testing.
I assume that the Mercedes and Ferrari engine guys can possibly increase the performance of their units before the start of the season too?
Maybe a bit early to speculate, but they seem pretty reliable already, so getting in a few extra horsepower now may be useful.
Maybe a bit early to speculate, but they seem pretty reliable already, so getting in a few extra horsepower now may be useful.
Man of Honour
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I am quite enjoying this. During the last rule change red bull had a large advantage and managed to stay ahead. Lets see how well they do now that others haven't been locked in a championship battle just before the rule change.
So what are people thinking about Lotus? If RBR turning up to the first test, but having problems is a pretty big concern for them, surely not turning up at all means Lotus are screwed?
If they spend the first Bahrain test simply getting the car going, they won't gave a hope in hell of being competitive in Australia.
Also, side thought, is the 107% rule still in for this season?
If they spend the first Bahrain test simply getting the car going, they won't gave a hope in hell of being competitive in Australia.
Also, side thought, is the 107% rule still in for this season?
Soldato
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The Jerez test was utterly pointless for Red Bull. Even stuck watching in Blighty, Lotus's cleaning staff can surely chop a few extra holes here and there and at least ensure that any car can run in Bahrain.
Toro Rosso and Caterham have had a bit more running, but even then, Lotus have hardly lost much to them. I'm not expecting anything from them this season though - they'll have a good chassis (that should follow from the previous couple of seasons), but surely they simply haven't had the money to throw at the new regulations - I was calling that last year, and the sustained hemorrhaging of staff can't help in any way.
Noooo Ross. 
Had a thought, if RBR are having troubles with the cooling at Jerez at 10-15C what's it going to be like at Bahrain with 30-40C? Or are the batteries etc. overheating to such a degree the ambient is irrelevant?
Had a thought, if RBR are having troubles with the cooling at Jerez at 10-15C what's it going to be like at Bahrain with 30-40C? Or are the batteries etc. overheating to such a degree the ambient is irrelevant?
Soldato
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Yeah, I think a 20C increase in ambient temperature is going to be largely irrelevant when you've got a 125k RPM turbo throwing out ~900C under the engine cover.
I disagree. If it's the lithium and the electronics that are the bits suffering, then they a big hike in ambient temperatures will have a sizeable effect. Even the NiMh packs on my hybrid get a lot hotter in British summer temps, let alone Bahrain. Those units aren't anywhere near the turbo.
Incidentally, the 5 engine limit. Does that extend to the lithium packs? So they have to last a number of races, or can they be swapped out for each race?
The thing is cooling has always been a problem, I remember the 2009 season there were a few teams struggling with cooling and having to redesign their car specifically for that race.... so it is irrelevant as to how hot the engines get - I'm sure the V8s were running hotter than say 70 deg 
It's the ambient temperature on the whole car that will cause issues, put it this way it would be easier to keep the car cool in Jerez on a January day than on a February day in Bahrain, so yeah, Renault and more to the point RBR have problems.
It's the ambient temperature on the whole car that will cause issues, put it this way it would be easier to keep the car cool in Jerez on a January day than on a February day in Bahrain, so yeah, Renault and more to the point RBR have problems.
Er... no.
You literally can't throw out ~900C; you're confusing temperature and heat. The air temperature is very important because it effects the rate at which the car can dissipate heat. Remember, as well, that air becomes less dense with increasing temperature so not only is there less ability to dump heat into the air per kg of air but there's actually a lower weight of air passing through the car.
I doubt thats strictly true, but I doubt they have gone to 100% either
(from my way of reading your post, apologies if this isnt what you meant, it sounds as if you think the engine and ERS have already been going at 100% - which I doubt is the case)
From what I have read, the drivers (although doing a lot more management at the wheel than they are used to) arent at 100% either
From what Ive understood in the past its all one combined "unit" so it doesnt matter if its the engine, ERS or the batteries which fail but that is one ****** unit and will need to be replaced.
Ive also understod that they cant also put together a good engine, a good ERS and a good set of batteries from broken units (to be honest I dont see at all whats wrong with this, and it could be argued its more budget and ecologically friendly to do this but hey ho)
This was picked up through last season from convos on here, but if anyone wants to correct me then fantastic
Thanks Duke, hadnt seen your post til just now (and thanks Skeeter for the followup about testing)
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The ES (energy store, aka batteries) is not part of the Power Unit, so isn't limited to 5 per season. The whole rest of the unit is limited as you say. So the V6, turbo, MGUK and MGUH, as they are computer controlled to work as one, unlike last year where the KERS was a bolt on push button addition.
So if one component fails, the whole unit goes into the bin. But given how integrated the bits are I doubt anything would fail in an isolated way that wouldn't affect the rest of the unit. I.e. a turbo failure at the speeds the engines will be working is going to munch other internals and put forces through the electric motors.
The issue will be if minor problems cause a component to stop working. A lose wire in 2013 could mean your KERS stopped working. In 2014 it could make your whole PU eat itself.
So if one component fails, the whole unit goes into the bin. But given how integrated the bits are I doubt anything would fail in an isolated way that wouldn't affect the rest of the unit. I.e. a turbo failure at the speeds the engines will be working is going to munch other internals and put forces through the electric motors.
The issue will be if minor problems cause a component to stop working. A lose wire in 2013 could mean your KERS stopped working. In 2014 it could make your whole PU eat itself.
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Scarbs has a good post on the Lotus twin tusk nose. It looks like it sticks to the letter of the law by having one tusk longer than the other and thus only one tip.
I'm trying to think of a time we've seen a team have a total test failure like Red Bull have done. I don't ever recall a top team doing quite so badly before, yet alone coming back from there to a position of strength in the season.
Not so much failures, but then we have had teams miss whole tests and then come out on top. They might have the issues sorted by the next test and it will be like it never happened. Who knows tbh.