The New European Super (borefest) League

fez said:
I for one welcome the idea of some sort of champions league reform that makes it more bloated and guarantees the biggest clubs a very good chance of getting in year in, year out regardless of league position. More games added to an already packed schedule is also a great idea. We should just think ourselves lucky that we didn't get the SL because that would have just been awful and this new CL is just great...

I'm sure this is purely for football fans though and not to try and make more money for the football governing bodies.
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The club's pushed for this...it's on them
 
Calpol said:
I think you are missing quite a fundamental point. The clubs basically wanted exclusivity over distribution rights so they could leverage much greater incomes from the global audience. That would have marginalised the other clubs who aspired to be in the Champions League and prevented any redistribution of income. It would have pooled income amongst the elite more than now and driven less competition in domestic leagues. The reason the EPL is so popular globally is because Sheff United can beat Man United. It's also likely that matches would be played around the world vs only in Europe depriving the local support of spectacle.
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The entire reason the Premier League was established was to maximise TV income/rights so it's nothing new, or are we saying that we should wind up the Premier League and go back to Football League Division One because greed is bad?

My point is a league of actual top teams sounds a lot better than the current Champion's League format where 75% of it is clearly one-sided games. If you have a European League with promotion/relegation it's still possible for teams to get there (though as unlikely as Sheff Utd winning the Premier League).
 
Super league has finally gotten super after these drop outs, now we can have what the fans have been waiting for, high class games every week with no dross:

Barcelona
Real Madrid
Juventus

Winner stays on, trophy presentation after every match. Perfect outcome.
 
mmj_uk said:
The entire reason the Premier League was established was to maximise TV income/rights so it's nothing new, or are we saying that we should wind up the Premier League and go back to Football League Division One because greed is bad?

My point is a league of actual top teams sounds a lot better than the current Champion's League format where 75% of it is clearly one-sided games. If you have a European League with promotion/relegation it's still possible for teams to get there (though as unlikely as Sheff Utd winning the Premier League).
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Nobody wants to see top teams playing the same top teams week in, week out.
 
Robert said:
Nobody wants to see top teams playing the same top teams week in, week out.
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Wasn't the proposed plans 2 games a season against each team, home and away? So the same as the current league formats? Who wouldn't want that? The issues with the ESL were integrity, not the fact there would be too many games.
 
Shamikebab said:
Wasn't the proposed plans 2 games a season against each team, home and away? So the same as the current league formats? Who wouldn't want that? The issues with the ESL were integrity, not the fact there would be too many games.
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People, like me, who go to the games?

This would have always replaced the PL. They can say it wouldnt but thats the end game.
 
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Shamikebab said:
Wasn't the proposed plans 2 games a season against each team, home and away? So the same as the current league formats? Who wouldn't want that? The issues with the ESL were integrity, not the fact there would be too many games.
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I think oversaturation was certainly part of the concern for the neutral viewer.

Watching an English club like Man Utd play Barcelona is all the more of an event for everyone because it hasn't happened often - I think a couple of years ago and then near enough a decade before that? It becomes something far less special if they're playing each other 2 or 3 times a season year in year out.

Similarly England vs Germany as an international would lose some of the 'omg we're playing Germany' factor if we were watching it routinely every year.
 
Kenai said:
I think oversaturation was certainly part of the concern for the neutral viewer.

Watching an English club like Man Utd play Barcelona is all the more of an event for everyone because it hasn't happened often - I think a couple of years ago and then near enough a decade before that? It becomes something far less special if they're playing each other 2 or 3 times a season year in year out.

Similarly England vs Germany as an international would lose some of the 'omg we're playing Germany' factor if we were watching it routinely every year.
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Nah just feed Dijon to Mbappe and Neymar week in week out.

Much more of a spectacle.

Out if curiosity has anyone tried to watch Scottish football or ligue 1?

What really makes zero sense is why Tottenham hotspur were involved in this project?
 
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Kenai said:
I think oversaturation was certainly part of the concern for the neutral viewer.

Watching an English club like Man Utd play Barcelona is all the more of an event for everyone because it hasn't happened often - I think a couple of years ago and then near enough a decade before that? It becomes something far less special if they're playing each other 2 or 3 times a season year in year out.

Similarly England vs Germany as an international would lose some of the 'omg we're playing Germany' factor if we were watching it routinely every year.
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This is such a bizarre argument, I've never heard it applied to any other forms of entertainment. "Oh this album has too many good songs, would be much better if they were spread out over ten albums with more filler" "It was a good 6 episode mini series but honestly I'd rather it was spread over 24 episodes instead"

If the anticipation of an event is more exciting for you than the event itself then that suggests the form of entertainment isn't very good.
 
Shamikebab said:
This is such a bizarre argument, I've never heard it applied to any other forms of entertainment. "Oh this album has too many good songs, would be much better if they were spread out over ten albums with more filler" "It was a good 6 episode mini series but honestly I'd rather it was spread over 24 episodes instead"

If the anticipation of an event is more exciting for you than the event itself then that suggests the form of entertainment isn't very good.
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I see it differently there and your analogies seem backwards - taking the album analogy, rolling out the big matches routinely would be like <insert favourite band here> releasing 2 albums a year without fail rather than an album every couple of years. Rather than the release of the album being something special worth looking forward to and a real highlight, something to savour the enjoyment of that won't come round again soon, it's just part of the routine and you know there'll be another one in a few months. The saturation devalues the spectacle.

As a neutral fan, there is a level of interest in watching City play PSG and Chelsea play Real Madrid, not just because they're SF games but as they're rare matchups as well. If those games were happening twice a year anyway, they hold little more interest to the neutral than watching City play Chelsea as things stand now.
 
I'm of the same opinion as you Kenai. It's like a song you listen to every now and then that raises the hairs but if you listen to it every day it does nothing.

Granted games will always play out differently but you're not going to get the Anfield night thrillers against Barcelona every time you play.
 
Teams could potentially meet 4 time a season if they match up in to knockout section (assuming they have home and away fixtures in this, apart from the final)
 
But again you're talking about excitement of the anticipation of the event rather than the event itself. If a band released two good albums a year then I'd be delighted. With the current system we instead get 2 albums a year but one of them is a **** match vs Burnley.

You're saying a neutral would prefer to watch one game of PSG vs City and one game of City vs Burnley instead of two of the former. I don't for a second believe that. I can buy smaller team supporters being against the 'lots of big games' aspect but for a neutral it's not really an argument imo.
 
Shamikebab said:
You're saying a neutral would prefer to watch one game of PSG vs City and one game of City vs Burnley instead of two of the former. I don't for a second believe that. I can buy smaller team supporters being against the 'lots of big games' aspect but for a neutral it's not really an argument imo.
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If people were only bothered about the neutrals there wouldn't have been so much outrage and coming together of the fans. It's pretty obvious that the general consensus towards it in this country was negative. I'm not really bothered if some lad in Qatar wanted to wear his full Barca kit one week and Man City the next while watching ESL games.
 
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Shamikebab said:
But again you're talking about excitement of the anticipation of the event rather than the event itself. If a band released two good albums a year then I'd be delighted. With the current system we instead get 2 albums a year but one of them is a **** match vs Burnley.

You're saying a neutral would prefer to watch one game of PSG vs City and one game of City vs Burnley instead of two of the former. I don't for a second believe that. I can buy smaller team supporters being against the 'lots of big games' aspect but for a neutral it's not really an argument imo.
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What i'm saying is that as a neutral, I wouldn't go out of my way to watch PSG vs City any more than I would to watch City vs Burnley if it was happening routinely - it doesn't matter if I miss it, I might put it on if i'm not doing anything else but it'll happen again in a few months anyway. It's value is lessened and it's not something i'd then worry about missing out on. It's not special, it's just another game of football between two teams I don't support that's happening over and over again. People like big rare events to enjoy in the moment and savour.

I'm also not saying this was any sort of major factor but I think it was a small part of the negative sentiment towards it.
 
Ayahuasca said:
If people were only bothered about the neutrals there wouldn't have been so much outrage and coming together of the fans. It's pretty obvious that the general consensus towards it in this country was negative. I'm not really bothered if some lad in Qatar wanted to wear his full Barca kit one week and Man City the next while watching ESL games.
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Right but that's because of the financial and lack of promotion/relegation aspect of it, not the idea of the best clubs in Europe playing more regularly.
 
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