*** The Official E3 2013 Thread ***

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spoffle said:
No it doesn't...

Have you been living under a rock or something? DRM typically doesn't work, and the only people it causes problems for are those who are the legit buyers.

You've got to be joking, right?
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Another hilarious Spoffle comment.

You really believe DRM doesn't substantially reduce piracy? And it only causes problems for legit users??!!

Only because you hear of a few people complaining when their game doesn't work on here, doesn't mean DRM isn't massively effective as an anti-piracy method. :rolleyes:
 
pioneer2000 said:
Another hilarious Spoffle comment.

You really believe DRM doesn't substantially reduce piracy? And it only causes problems for legit users??!!

Only because you hear of a few people complaining when their game doesn't work on here, doesn't mean DRM isn't massively effective as an anti-piracy method. :rolleyes:
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I don't think you understand what hilarious means.

I also don't think you know what you're talking about in general.

Aside from that "DRM" doesn't really substantially reduce piracy any less than serial keys would.

It's not even about piracy, it's about control.

DRM is always broken, and those that want to copy games will do so.
 
spoffle said:
Shader clusters can't just be re-purposed like that to be used as cache.

The GDDR5 will also make a big difference, the PS4 has around 50% more memory bandwidth.

That's a big difference.
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I think I agree. The xbox does have a big on cpu die cache and suspect that will combat most of the bandwidth issues. Is 50% extra GPU power worth sacrificing for that tho?

It's an architectural decision I don't understand enough to make. Will 8GB of general purpose RAM plus the hot 10% of it being super quick outweigh 8GB of fast RAM that can be a bit laggy to access and 50% more computation?

I would suspect that the xbox cpu is slightly better for general purpose use but the ps4 cpu will blow it out of the water for clear graphics.
 
Suarez7 said:
Oh ok then, you obviously know more than the millions microsoft have probably spent researching.
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That's a logical fallacy. It's also an assumption that they've spent millions on researching "DRM".

In the real world DRM is about control above piracy.

That aside, it's been proven many times that it doesn't actually work as a viable means to prevent piracy.
 
kohlditz said:
The clock speeds won't differ much, and GDDR vs DDR is swings and roundabouts. Both consoles have basically the same graphics architecture, PS4 has used the excess transistors to introduce more shader cores, Xbox has used them to introduce a local cache on the DDR RAM. The memory architectures on both consoles are broadly similar, DDR3 has faster overall access times whereas GDDR5 has a much higher throughput at the expense of latency.

I'd expect the Xbox to have better memory performance, both in latency and access to the 256MB (or whatever it is) of commonly used stuff. The PS4 has 50% more computation to throw at graphics. I think the PS4 will be overall faster, especially as developers get to code to the underlying architecture and not via Hyper-V.
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GDDR5 actually has less latency measured in ns than ddr3, and the Xbox has only 32mb ESRAM as a cache for the 5gb usable memory, so whilst it will help it's not going to pull trees up.

Far from it.
 
I know Michael Pachter spouts rubbish at times but he reckons MS will drop the price of the Xbone by Easter 2014 when they see the PS4 outselling them by 100,000+ consoles each month.
 
kohlditz said:
I think I agree. The xbox does have a big on cpu die cache and suspect that will combat most of the bandwidth issues. Is 50% extra GPU power worth sacrificing for that tho?
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The PS4 has 50% more power, rather than the Xbox One being 50% of the PS4's GPU power. The Xbox One's GPU has 2/3 the shader clusters.

It's an architectural decision I don't understand enough to make. Will 8GB of general purpose RAM plus the hot 10% of it being super quick outweigh 8GB of fast RAM that can be a bit laggy to access and 50% more computation?
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I don't think that 10% cache sounds right, that'd be over 800MB of cache.

Aside from that though, any difference in latency will not be a patch on 50% more memory bandwidth.


I would suspect that the xbox cpu is slightly better for general purpose use but the ps4 cpu will blow it out of the water for clear graphics.
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They use the same CPUs, so with CPU tasks that aren't memory dependent, they'll be the same.
 
spoffle said:
I don't think you understand what hilarious means.

I also don't think you know what you're talking about in general.

Aside from that "DRM" doesn't really substantially reduce piracy any less than serial keys would.

It's not even about piracy, it's about control.

DRM is always broken, and those that want to copy games will do so.
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You do AMUSE me.

I'm not even wasting my time. DRM is a massive detterent to piracy.

You think you know better than most of the major organisations in the world. Daft.
 
spoffle said:
That's a logical fallacy. It's also an assumption that they've spent millions on researching "DRM".

In the real world DRM is about control above piracy.

That aside, it's been proven many times that it doesn't actually work as a viable means to prevent piracy.
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DRM is obviously having some effect, MS wouldn't have it if it did absolutely nothing. Your approach seems to be oh lets just let the pirates get on with it. I'd rather have DRM if it cuts piracy by even 1% than let people play any game they want for free while I pay £30 a game.
 
ic1male said:
I know Michael Pachter spouts rubbish at times but he reckons MS will drop the price of the Xbone by Easter 2014 when they see the PS4 outselling them by 100,000+ consoles each month.
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Some interesting things said by Patcher there, seems he thinks MS might get the XO sold as part subsidised deals with cable services (we already were aware of this possibility - he said most likely in US than Europe) but he also mentioned ISPs (due to the XOs requirement to be 'always online' matching their products).

Hell if Im sold a cheap XO via VM to keep to say a particular BB service/minimum contract it might be of interest to me. Its just the same as the mobile phone model just a slight but familiar twist...

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
Suarez7 said:
DRM is obviously having some effect, MS wouldn't have it if it did absolutely nothing. Your approach seems to be oh lets just let the pirates get on with it. I'd rather have DRM if it cuts piracy by even 1% than let people play any game they want for free while I pay £30 a game.
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Dude....

Seriously?
 
Suarez7 said:
DRM is obviously having some effect, MS wouldn't have it if it did absolutely nothing. Your approach seems to be oh lets just let the pirates get on with it. I'd rather have DRM if it cuts piracy by even 1% than let people play any game they want for free while I pay £30 a game.
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So you'd rather inconvenience millions of people because you're jealous of the fact pirates get games for free?
 
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