Interest rate aside, a £40k car depreciating to £20k should cost more than a £20k car depreciating to £10k.
I'd have to take an extended warranty if taking a 3 year old car on PCP as well, as Tr1p has done.
Thinking of getting an EV
- Thread starter danlightbulb
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Interest rate aside, a £40k car depreciating to £20k should cost more than a £20k car depreciating to £10k.
I'd have to take an extended warranty if taking a 3 year old car on PCP as well, as Tr1p has done.
You talk about residual value (rightly of course), but if I'm funding £20k depreciation whether on a contract lease or PCP or via a personal loan, then it's still lost money.
If that Skoda up above was £20k now and say £10k in 5 years time, half of my loan has just gone on depreciation. If the lease arrangement is similar then there could be no difference in total net cost, only that under the loan arrangement I have to buy the full value of the car upfront, whereas under PCP it's deferred.
Gross cost on my scheme is £905 and it's saying £15 bik, for 3 years and 12k miles a year.
After tax that is £666. But that is because I have input my salary after pension contribution so the residual is getting tax relief at basic rate. If I input my full salary then the after tax figure shows as £584 but oddly the gross cost has changed to £934.
Essentially my salary is only just over the 40% bracket so I get 40% tax relief on my pension OR the car, not both.
Presumably your scheme is all inclusive though like mine? Insurance maintenance tyres etc all included.
So £330 per month is for the car only, all the rest has to be added on.
And you're liable for any repairs over that period too.
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Well it depends, as I said, if you take the car first or the pension first. I could say the car is at 40% tax relief to make it sound cheaper. Then my pension will be at basic rate relief. Or I put it the other way around.
This is why I've been taking the gross figure out to my spreadsheet to calculate..
Dude this is just top-tier mental gymnastics. You aren't getting the benefit of the salary sacrifice. Life sucks. It is a system that benefits the "richest".
Take a loan -> buy an ICE. Save on insurance, double your MPG. Alternatively buy an EV. Lose on insurance, save on your fuel big time.
It's not mental gymnastics it's just the way the maths works. My gross salary is into the 40% band.
What ICE should I buy that saves on insurance and mpg and keeps my total cost under £500 a month with limited repair risk? It can't be done.
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Get it onto the VW Group ‘all-in’ plan when the warranty is up. Job done.
I don't know what that is.
But £22k for a diesel Skoda. Loan £400 a month and I save what £60 to £80 a month on fuel and maybe £50 on my repair buffer, and nothing else.
I can't afford that.
I can't get a decent size EV for £11k.
I don't need a boot that's just big on volume..I need one that's practically big, in length, width, height. I don't carry suitcases.
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Why do you have a 325 then?
I had no choice. My Mondeo MK4 estate failed at 115k miles (£3k vanished) and everything at the low end was crazy prices. My friend was selling this car which had 100k miles at the time and FSH. I didn't even consider EVs then, I never realised that home charging would be so cheap to run.
You could have another person with the same salary as me who only puts 5% into pension. You'd happily say they are benefiting at 40% tax relief on the car then would you? What if they get the car this year then next year put more into the pension, would you say they are then sacrificing their pension only at 20% because the car came first,?
I salary sacrifice my pension, and I could salary sac my car. What I allocate to each is a personal choice. I put 15% pension currently, way above normal, but I don't have to do that. I could put 6% then o could say the whole car is at 40%. I'm being honest with the maths and trade offs by not doing this.
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I bought a fridge for an ex girlfriend once, and picked it up from Currys in my Honda accord estate.
I moved house in.2022, and I did the whole move in a Mondeo estate. The fridge freezer went in, the washing machine went in. Furniture went in including a 3 seater sofa (dismantled).
I carry a mountain bike a couple times a year, sometimes two. I carry scuba gear a couple times a year, for two people. I carry a tent, outdoor gear and a BBQ, with a dog on the back seat. I go to Wickes and buy lengths of 2x4 or 10 bags of sand and cement. A couple months ago I bought 100 imperial bricks on Facebook and picked them up in my BMW. It's not my fault that other people do nothing and just take kids to school. I actually use my car.
I'm.44. I want to try and maximise my pension of course, for the future. Only just bought a house in 2022, pay child maintenance which takes a chunk out of my net salary too. Life is crap and my old car just adds to it.
size you want, how about something like this:
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A van as a second car would probably be a good idea for me tbh, but I'm not commuting 50 miles a day 3 days a week in a van as my main car.
My god it's like talking to a brick wall. Don't you understand that used car costs are stupidly high, and that if I buy a car like this I'm in for a £15-20k loan with no saving on fuel or likely maintenance costs? So +£300 a month on current costs.
How much is your monthly motoring cost and what car do you have?
We glancing over 2x2 trips a year with bikes or BBQ gear and hauling some bricks once in 44 years as "using their car"? OK then,
Don't take the ****. You're a big DIYer you should appreciate the flexibility a big car provides. I do regularly use the space as I've said above.
A car I don't have to worry is too small to fit my bike in, my camping gear in, my scuba gear in, a bit of furniture or a kitchen appliance in when I need to. It's not complicated.
Do you think £400 a month isn't enough to run a reliable decent sized car these days?
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I don't think it's unreasonable to expect to save £160 a month in fuel, £150 a month in tax, and still not be able to get a new car? I'd give way if it was another ICE, obviously the car cost is on top of fuel then.
Who is affording aby of these cars if the net cost is still £700 a month? I have a good salary, how is anyone affording this on median salary?
Do you think£400 a month can't run a reasonable car these days? Is that the fundamental issue?
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So how is anyone affording cars on median salary then?
I'm sorry but that's impossible. Is the Tesla a company car, if so what would be the cost of ownership if it was funded by you? How did you get a discovery 5 including fuel for 450 a month unless you do zero miles.
I don't spend much on these things. All the equipment is already bought going back a number of years. Go camping a couple times a year, less than I used to since I bought the house. But still need the space for the gear.
Yes this was done on purpose so that I didn't pay any 40% tax. I thought that was a good thing to do, and by doing it I have self limited my pay increases and monthly budget. It has only been the past 3 years or so that I've crept into that band.
Yes unfortunately my marriage didn't work out, my ex wife was abusive and I no longer see my kids. Clearly wish I could turn the clock back but I can't. So this does take a considerable chunk out of my salary every month. It has taken many years to recover financially from this.
The reason I'm late in life to this is because of the above mentioned divorce.
There isn't much spare I'm afraid. The spending on the above activities really is minimal, I don't have much to cut back on already. I already do the switcheroo on various bills to keep them down etc. I've been spending a lot on working on the house I bought.
Yes I could do this. I'm a bit loathed to though because obviously it's a good thing to be putting more into my pension fund.
I think fundamentally I'm just shocked at the prices, new, lease, used, whatever. I don't see how people can afford them on normal salaries and so I assumed I must have been missing something.
Even a 10 year old car is £10k now, as we've discussed many times, and the used market is terribly overpriced. So that's £200 a month in loan, plus insurance servicing maintenance and all that. Then fuel on top. Even a 10 year old car, bought with a loan, plus all those other costs is going to be £600 a month expenditure.
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Because I thought the fuel saving from going EV, and the maintenance saving, and the sal sac saving - all would offset the cost. Those three things we're talking £400 worth of funding from! Isn't it crazy that even with those things contributing I still can't get even a mid range new car?
Whenever I've looked at switching cars before, getting a loan or even the salary sac scheme but for a petrol or diesel car, the fuel costs never changed so the car cost was always on top of. Obviously that's normal and I expected that. But this time with saving the fuel I thought it would be different.
I really don't like wasting money. The last car I bought with a loan was in 2006 a 3 years old Mondeo diesel hatchback which I then kept for 9 years. After that I only bought £1500-£3k cars.
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Thanks.
However, if you are right (which you are) then where are all the 3 year old £16k cars?
If I search on AT for estate, auto, newer than 2020, upto £17k, less than 40k miles. There are only 206 cars meeting that criteria.
There are 66 MG5 EVs in this!
The rest are pretty poor, small estates with no performance.
So whilst I agree with your points fully in principle, if you go to the market the cars aren't there.
£16k is the depreciation to you and was just an illustrative example. The company reselling the car will want to make some margin on that; they will have costs to collect, prepare, service, etc the car.
There are 124 Peugeot E2008's under £16k with less than 30k miles.
The estate body type isn't particular popular compared to saloons, crossovers or SUVs. However if I search up to 30k, less than £16k, and estate body type I am getting 365 results.
E.g.
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You are behaving like a bit of a lost cause tbh.
Only one of those cars is an automatic (the Corolla) and its an import.
Look at the rest. A 1.2 litre engine, and three 1.5's.
There is no way I would want to spend £14k on those cars. I wouldn't buy them new and I don't want to buy them used.
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So firstly you need to filter down much more. There is no point including Corsa's, Fiat 500's, Limo's or any number of other types of cars in the list.
Secondly lets say I buy something on 60k miles. In 3 years time its on 95k miles and when cars get to that age they start needing a lot of work. Suspension parts, timing belts, exhausts, clutches/DMFs. I think the 60-70k mile mark is a terrible point in a car's life to buy used.