Today's mass shooting in the US

Longbow said:
Ah, traded it in for knife to fit in with the locals? :p
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One of my notable memories of living in London was some guy staggering down the middle of the road shooting into the air with a shotgun.

He was pretty fortunate I think the police seemed to know him and what was going on (he'd had a bad break up with his missus and got very drunk apparently).
 
Just seen a video of police in the US arresting some guy when his 4 year old son gets hold of his gun and shoots at the cops... absolutely horrifying moment where they are trying to work out who is shooting, trying to make sure the other cops know it is a kid and try and find a solution which doesn't end up with them having to shoot a 4 year old.

Father has been convicted of child abuse amongst over the incident.
 
deuse said:
Why don't you tell the whole story?
Or even get it right?

"The incident began when the boy's father threatened restaurant employees with a gun in the drive-thru because his order was messed up. When officers arrived, they began detaining the man when his 4-year-old boy grabbed his gun and shot at officers. "
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Eh? where did I get something wrong?

The entire incident doesn't really matter in this case - the crazy bit was the officers having to deal with a situation where a 4 year old had got hold of a gun without it ending tragically one way or another.
 
VincentHanna said:
Because you didn't explicitly tell the forum that a man, who was being detained and whose 4 year old son decides it's a good idea to shoot at police officers, was a horrible person.

It's not like we could infer that from his sons actions....
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End of the day the only bit of the story I was trying to highlight was the horrificness of the part of the situation where police had to try and deal with a 4 year old with a gun without it ending tragically with either one of the police hurt or killed trying to disarm the kid and/or prevent someone else getting shot i.e. the people in the restaurant the gun was pointed towards or having to make a decision to shoot at a 4 year old to end the situation.

Which sadly happens far too often in the US one way or another.
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
according to him the rich are taking substances and getting surgeries to live forever and boost their cognitive abilities. Now I'm not body shaming here but the recent pics of Musk and the state of Trump show that these surgeries and substances available to them are as legit as the crap Jones sell on his channel.
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You should have seen Trump before the surgery/drugs :cry:

(Google Trump Baron Harkonnen).
 
Rai200 said:
It's more than the zero here.

Even adjusted for population it's 3x the total average firearm deaths in the UK, including murders, suicides etc. They've had over 3,000 firearm related deaths already, in 25 days.
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People in the UK who have access/own to firearms tend to have a much higher discipline while handling them than average in the US when it comes to handling them which kind of skews the stats a bit. A much higher proportion are things like museum curators/keepers, professional shooters for sports or pest control, etc. etc. though I'm not so sure with the farmers, etc. some around here seem a little lapse (I've more than once seen a pile of guns just tossed into the back of a Land Rover without being checked :( :( )
 
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Johno please? said:
I agree in principle, if you could click your fingers and remove all firearms from america, id do it.

Banning guns means law abiding people hand in their guns, but no one else will.
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End of the day it is their decision whether we agree with it or not.

Frustrating to see so many of these incidents though where even small tweaks to their firearms regulations would have prevented them.
 
Many of what are branded as "assault rifles" in the US aren't that different to what some people in the UK own - there are plenty of people, within those who own firearms in the UK, who have military stylised rifles in intermediate rifle calibres though mostly straight pull rather than semi-automatic and few in the US own fully automatic rifles of this nature. While we don't see anything like the same problem in the UK even when adjusting the figures like for like.
 
physichull said:
Also, how incredibly brave! They had assault rifles of their own but most just seemed like ordinary police with just sidearms and not a tremendous amount of protective equipment. Incredibly brave going door to door in the classrooms though.
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Something I find interesting watching law enforcement body cam in the US, probably similar in other countries as well but I think more extreme in the US. They used to be very uncoordinated, these days you have a smattering of officers with very high situational awareness and coordination skills but struggle with getting the message through, and must find it frustrating, with too many others who just don't listen/chaos as to who is in command, etc.

Same with the ASP guys when dealing with local PD at a scene - some exceptions aside they really know what they are doing but they really have to be pushy to make sure everyone is following safe procedures, etc.
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
I really dislike the meh attitude that because not all mass shooting are committed with weapons of war style guns that means nothing should be done about those guns. How many lives a year, a decade does it have to save before its worth doing something? I thought life was cheap in Zambia when I lived there but this attitude is little different tbh.
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It is almost a red herring at the end of the day though - there are far more identically lethal or more lethal for this kind of use firearms on sale in the US which aren't "assault style".

Although I'm not personally a fan of laws based on a strictly need/use justification one of the bigger differences in the UK is that these kind of weapons can, some exceptions aside, only be owned in straight pull/bolt action configuration and there is very little need for any civilian shooting for recreational use or even home defence to have semi-automatic let alone full automatic capability.
 
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Sankari said:
No, the issue is firearm deaths, no matter how they occur. That's because the common denominator in firearm deaths is access to firearms. Reduce access, and you reduce deaths. Every other Western nation does this successfully.

Cherry picking which firearm deaths to remove from the statistics is moronic at best, and dishonest at worst.



We don't need infinite resources. Every other Western nation outperforms the US when it comes to firearm deaths. Why do you think that is?
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Isn't just about firearms deaths though - other countries which have had or currently do have more relaxed firearms regulations don't see the same problems the US does - Australia for a chunk of its history had laws relatively close to the US without seeing the issues the US has - interestingly since the 1996 law changes firearms incidents in Australia have dropped significantly but firearms per capita has actually gone back up again, although that tends to be existing owners buying additional, or replacing their banned semi-automatics, rather than new owners. One of the difference being the types of gun though with semi-automatic rifles being replaced with bolt action or straight pull variants.

America has a problem and it goes far beyond firearms.
 
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Sankari said:
No it didn't. For a start, the US has the 2nd amendment. Australians have never enjoyed the right to bear arms, nor have we ever had laws that allowed us to own fully automatic weapons or other firearms Americans took for granted over many decades. Our laws have always been radically different from America's; far stricter in every way.
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Reason I put relatively in there - for a chunk of Australia's history it wasn't prohibitively difficult to own many common weapons found in the US - sure some places banned handguns after WW2, etc. but access to things like semi-automatic "assault style" rifles was only tightened up after 1996. The US has been quite restrictive on full-automatic firearms for awhile now. As per your post above even when ownership of the more problematic weapons was more widespread Australia never had the problems the US does (sure some mass shootings happened but it was a relatively rare thing).
 
Seems to be a lot of information missing. I know loads of people who go shooting with their kids, even in this country, without it turning into murder suicide - guns didn't make that kid go bad (or whatever was behind it - maybe she was abused for all we know), though the advisability of having access to firearms at that age and the level of supervision is another matter.
 
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Efour said:
She got more guns....
Yeah this is written by a child? There must be some more credible legible information somewhere.

apologies for daily mail. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12227155/Girl-12-shot-dad-murder-pact-pictured-time.html
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All the information I can find seems to be trying to flesh out the same bare bones information with very poor and sensationalised reporting - talk of her getting hold of more guns a day later - so where was her mother and other siblings and the authorities in this or was her dad lying there incapacitated for hours?

EDIT: The report most of the media are basing their article on says she purchased additional firearms a day later...
 
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