Today's mass shooting in the US

mattx4 said:
I'd imagine it also correlates well lack of education, inequality and underfunded social services.

A lot of people would assume the worst states would be New York or Illinois but they are pretty far down and the top spots are taken by republican states with very little in the way of gun control

Stats of the States - Homicide Mortality

www.cdc.gov www.cdc.gov
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Oh so on one hand certain communities being so high on the homicide stats its due to "education, inequality and underfunded social services" and yet when you want to try and prove your point about firearms it's the republicans' fault and 'weaker' gun laws, which is it?
 
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C Kent said:
Oh so on one hand certain communities being so high on the homicide stats its due to "education, inequality and underfunded social services" and yet when you want to try and prove your point about gun laws it's the republicans' fault and 'weaker' gun laws, which is it?
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It's both Republican states rank the worst in education outcomes and have the highest poverty rates as well as the lowest gun controls
 
C Kent said:
Whenever there's a tragedy and a musician announces a 'benefit' concert, the proceeds go toward the victims of said tragedy. This crazy old bint has instead decided to donate the proceeds of her gig to the various trans organisations, a member of which killed 6 people. How would you have felt if the proceeds of the gig that was performed after the Manchester Arena bombings went to Islamic Terror oganisations, rather than families and victims of the bombing?
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I think you wanted to say muslim organisations but you thought that might sound a bit too racist I assume?

Trans people are hardly a terror group unless you are touched in the head.
 
C Kent said:
Whenever there's a tragedy and a musician announces a 'benefit' concert, the proceeds go toward the victims of said tragedy. This crazy old bint has instead decided to donate the proceeds of her gig to the various trans organisations, a member of which killed 6 people. How would you have felt if the proceeds of the gig that was performed after the Manchester Arena bombings went to Islamic Terror oganisations, rather than families and victims of the bombing?
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I'm not here to agree with her stance, it makes sense to give some money to the victims or to charities that deal with school shootings (if there are such things)

But your argument is in bad faith.

Giving money to "trans organisations" after a psycho trans person shoots up a school is definitely not the same as giving money to "Islamic terror organisations" after a psycho Islamic terrorists has bombed an arena.

By your own definition one is a terror group, the trans organisations are not. Why would you conflate the two?
 
VincentHanna said:
I'm not here to agree with her stance, it makes sense to give some money to the victims or to charities that deal with school shootings (if there are such things)

But your argument is in bad faith.

Giving money to "trans organisations" after a psycho trans person shoots up a school is definitely not the same as giving money to "Islamic terror organisations" after a psycho Islamic terrorists has bombed an arena.

By your own definition one is a terror group, the trans organisations are not. Why would you conflate the two?
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Hold the door this tour was announced on 22nd December 2022. Not after the shooting and was always a fund raiser for trans groups.
 
VincentHanna said:
I'm not here to agree with her stance, it makes sense to give some money to the victims or to charities that deal with school shootings (if there are such things)

But your argument is in bad faith.

Giving money to "trans organisations" after a psycho trans person shoots up a school is definitely not the same as giving money to "Islamic terror organisations" after a psycho Islamic terrorists has bombed an arena.

By your own definition one is a terror group, the trans organisations are not. Why would you conflate the two?
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Who said I'm conflating the 2? One prays on the young and vulnerable the other follows Islamic law.
Tony Edwards said:
Hold the door this tour was announced on 22nd December 2022. Not after the shooting and was always a fund raiser for trans groups.
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The extra date was announced after.....
 
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C Kent said:
The extra date was announced after.....
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Verbatim from her website:

With anti-LGBTQ+ legislation passing in Tennessee and other states, longtime social activist Madonna announced an additional stop on her The Celebration Tour in Nashville on December 22nd. A portion of proceeds from the show will go to trans rights organizations. In regard to the over 100 anti-LGBTQ+ bills currently before state legislatures, Madonna says “the oppression of the LGBTQ+ is not only unacceptable and inhumane; it’s creating an unsafe environment; it makes America a dangerous place for our most vulnerable citizens, especially trans women of color. Also, these so-called laws to protect our children are unfounded and pathetic. Anyone with half a brain knows not to **** with a drag queen. Bob and I will see you from the stage in Nashville where we will celebrate the beauty that is the queer community.”

Due to overwhelming demand, in addition to Nashville, Madonna has added seven new dates to her massive global The Celebration Tour, adding shows in Washington D.C., Philadelphia, Palm Springs, and Sacramento, along with a second show in Phoenix and a third show in San Francisco and Las Vegas. All new dates will take place between December 2023 and January 2024, and mark the final additional shows in North America where Madonna will perform some of her greatest hits from her unparalleled music catalogue.


NEWLY ADDED SHOWS:
Mon Dec 18 2023 / Washington, DC / Capital One Arena
Wed Dec 20 2023 / Philadelphia, PA / Wells Fargo Center
Fri Dec 22 2023 / Nashville, TN / Bridgestone Arena
Thu Jan 11 2024 / Palm Springs, CA / Acrisure Arena
Sat Jan 13 2024 / Sacramento, CA / Golden 1 Center
Mon Jan 15 2024 / San Francisco, CA / Chase Center
Thu Jan 18, 2024 / Las Vegas, NV / MGM Grand Garden Arena
Sat Jan 20, 2024 / Phoenix, AZ / Footprint Center
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The school shooting isn't even mentioned.
 
VincentHanna said:
Verbatim from her website:



The school shooting isn't even mentioned.
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And? Do you not think the better message would have been the extra Tennessee date announcement (which was after the shooting) and some sort of statement from her where she (and the various lgbt organisations she represents) stand with the victims showing that violence isn't welcome regardless of where you stand on lgbt issues? Then again the activists are more concerned with misgendering the shooter than the victims of her killing spree.
 
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mattx4 said:
It's both Republican states rank the worst in education outcomes and have the highest poverty rates as well as the lowest gun controls
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Except it isn't quite so simple as that, some states with weaker gun laws (that are republican controlled) rank lower for deaths than other states with stricter controls and being democrat controlled for example.
 
C Kent said:
Except it isn't quite so simple as that, some states with weaker gun laws (that are republican controlled) rank lower for deaths than other states with stricter controls and being democrat controlled for example.
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Nothing is ever that simple there always some exceptions, I'm not saying it's a correlation of 1 but there's a strong match and things like guns being easily available in the boarder states will have an impact as well as population density.

If all states accepted the strongest states gun controls and looked at the stats after 5 years maybe there would be a significant decrease maybe it wouldn't make a difference.

Seems like a better plan than the current we have tried nothing and we are all out of ideas approach
 
mattx4 said:
Nothing is ever that simple there always some exceptions, I'm not saying it's a correlation of 1 but there's a strong match and things like guns being easily available in the boarder states will have an impact as well as population density.

If all states accepted the strongest states gun controls and looked at the stats after 5 years maybe there would be a significant decrease maybe it wouldn't make a difference.

Seems like a better plan than the current we have tried nothing and we are all out of ideas approach
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I suppose it depends on where people sit regarding the stats about firearms being a deterrent will impact someone's view in the debate. As I mentioned above homicides are by in large on the downward trend in the US anyway and have been for 40 odd years, I believe they are about half of what they were in the early 90's for example.
 
C Kent said:
It's irrelevant, carrying an offensive weapon has been outlawed in the UK for what 70 odd years? Nor has it been one of the fundamental rights on which UK law is based on. Regardless firearm related homicides are on a downward trend in the US and have been for 40 odd years, whereas stabbings both fatal and non fatal are on the rise in the UK.
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How is that trend going down? Its quite the opposite.



FT_22.01.26_GunDeaths_2.png
 
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C Kent said:
Yeah the was a sharp increase that coincided with something that happened in 2020, just like there was a sharp increase with domestic violence that year, what was that again?
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Its been rising since 2013, a slight dip in 2017 and them a sharp rise in 2019. You were the one that said it was trending down and had been for 40 years, that clearly isn't the case.
 
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