Tommy Robinson quits the EDL
- Thread starter The Geezer
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Source?
"In a poll for the Daily Express" ... polls are never give true and accurate results. They will always be skewed in favour of whoever paid for it.
Who am I, policy director for EDL?
You asked how many Islamists were in the UK, I've no idea, so I gave you some stats for a few dodgy ideas of theirs. From what I can ttell the group most likely to become radicalised are the younger generation (which goes against previous patterns of immigration where the younger generations were the first to integrate)
That's nice, I was discussing Islamists, not one of the many political pressure groups that appeared overnight to confront them
The intentions of the Islamist groups are not a result of stupidity but one born out of their backward culture. I think the people they intend to kill and the culture they intend to destroy do care about their hate.
You type the words into google and that gives you the web pages they came from. You then check the polling organisations credibility, then confirm the sample size is statistically meaningful and on a par with other surveys. You can also correlate the findings with related results from other groups to see if anything is grossly misrepresented. Or you could just post about a mate and what he said.
The Centre for Social Cohesion
ICM opinion poll
Misleading question/conclusion - that's just about banning a culture's misogynist form of dress which is incompatible on many levels with our culture.
I'm sure 98% would also ban the mankini, manpanties and golfing attire if given the choice.
Misleading question/conclusion - that is for paedos, child abusers and police killers, not in the case of almost all muslim countries for homosexuals, apostates and for women who get raped.
Equally whatever system we might implement would be under UK law, not whatever some uneducated misogynist sand peasant holding the Quran decides.
Nobody is chastising an entire population, we are talking about a percentage of the population. However I don't think we are talking about a minority either.
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When you quote statistics it's good to provide the source in your post rather than just presenting them as fact.
Have you done any of this? As it's you presenting the statistic you should be able to justify its validity.
If you'd taken part in a few more debates you'd notice these are often quoted. I'm not writing a dissertation so if you wanted to dispute them then it's a few seconds work for you. I'm happy to defend any of my posts so I don't see why I need to provide sources for everything when I'm already happy to quote them.
Yes.
They came from The Centre for Social Cohesion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centre_for_Social_Cohesion
and ICM
http://www.icmresearch.com/category/media-centre/polls
seem legit to me, sample size seems OK too.
I note you scoffed at the Daily Express one without bothering to find out who they had commissioned to conduct their poll (newspapers don't do this themselves, some people don't appear to know this), in fact they were Harris, which doesn't seem that credible to me and again The Centre for Social Cohesion which seems OK.
However both results are similar to other surveys, which is why I've only disputed their format and the posters conclusions.
If you want something more left wing, the Guardian commissioned something similar
http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics_-_Shariah
(of 500 muslims) 61 per cent wanted Islamic courts - operating on sharia principles
(of 1003 muslims #Populus)
37% of 16 to 24-year-olds said they would prefer sharia law,
a third of 16 to 24-year-olds believed that those converting to another religion should be executed
These polls mostly tie up with each other and don't appear to be particularly biased
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As I understand it the UK has 2.7m Muslims according to the 2011 Census, so 500 being interviewed and we don't even know where or who seems a serious leap of faith to draw any conclusions especially a figure like 61%
On apostasy how many times in the last century has the punishment been carried out ?
I want to see a poll done nationwide to see how many Muslims support freedom of expression from other religions and for gays and apostates.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QlO9XY0YH8&feature=youtu.be
Considering that most Islamic rulings and thoughts come from muhammed's teachings and what he did during his life ( sura ) then how do people ever expect them to stop killing gays?
Even more disturbing is the rape laws under sharia.
http://www.aina.org/news/20081117111817.htm
This is what the UAF are supporting religous fascism.The Authoritarian structure that is so common with Fascism is met perfectly under Islam.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QlO9XY0YH8&feature=youtu.be
Considering that most Islamic rulings and thoughts come from muhammed's teachings and what he did during his life ( sura ) then how do people ever expect them to stop killing gays?
Even more disturbing is the rape laws under sharia.
http://www.aina.org/news/20081117111817.htm
This is what the UAF are supporting religous fascism.The Authoritarian structure that is so common with Fascism is met perfectly under Islam.
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I think its been asked before what are the EDL and likes doing for homosexual rights in orthodox catholic countries in Africa and South America ?
What are the apostasy figures in Islam ?
Im no expert i loosely follow them but why would the EDL have anything to do with homosexual rights? They are an anti islamic street movement?
What about the apostasy figures? I do not know them but 200 christians died in Syria last month at the hands if Islamists if that counts? And did you watch the video? And if so what are your views on that then? You seem to be on the UAF side here it seems.
Tell me then why are Islamic clerics calling for gays to be burned and killed? And why is it no one seems willing to comment on anything in my videos.All you can do is question what do the BNP do or what do the EDL do.Im guessing there are a bunch of closet gay bashers and gay haters hidden in this forum as has anyone noticed there has only been me and bitslice and another condemming Islam? Funny that i cannot remember the last time there was an Islamic street movement to condem gay killing and Sharia.Yet when an anti islamic street movement arises out of thier beliefs suddenly the streets are filled with UAF and Islamists.
Why are you defending this barbaric belief system? And have a look over the comments of gilly also.Notice how both these guys have refused to acknowledge the videos or even comment on how awful it is.The previous poster was right after all you just both failed the UAF test.
Hook line and sinker.
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Of course, we should interview all 2,700,000 muslims because professional polling companies really don't have a clue what they are doing despite all coming up with roughly the same answers. Do some research, what do most polling companies use as a sample size.
Well it's kicking off in Afghanistan at the moment because some bat**** MP wants all the Christian converts executed for it.
Does EDL even look like a political party to you?
What are Labour, Liberals or Conservatives (or anybody) doing for gays in Catholic countries, sweet FA or nothing?
At least they don't glue their anuses shut and feed them with laxatives like the religion of peace does.
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Check out the muslim brotherhoods murder of the Coptic community in Egypt.These Coptics were there before Islam, and in Arabia too.Now they are having thier churches burned and thier men killed and women raped.
Im not going to give out the youtube url here but you can guess what is available on youtube.To be honest mate im done with him, i said in my post above you give him something really barbaric in youtube video form and he ignores is and attacks the EDL.
They are UAF and so rabid and deluded in thier belief system that they are suporting everything they actually hate.But for some reason the EDL seems to trigger off something deep inside them that i for one just cannot explain.It is like a cat versus a dog, arch enemys until something else comes along and they both decide to kill it.Hell who burnt the wreath of Lee Rigby? UAF did and it is on youtube and the scumbag who did it as well.And the killer of Lee Rigby was a well known UAF member also.You can find this online that Adebolajo attended and spoke apparantly at UAF rallys.He was also well known to Choudary who said he was a "good muslim".
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I have no agenda but to live in peace and I call out bigotry wherever I see it.
You have a serious slant that you struggle to see beyond and I feel it is irrational, we live in the same society and you have taken particular view point regardless of the facts.
You hang on the words of some extreme scholars and then apply to that to the whole of Islam. The way I see it is people only hang on to their holy books to further their own agenda not for the good of everyone.
Homosexuals have existed ever since humans have existed and all religions have taken a particular hatred for them, Islam is no different and as I have stated before look at the African countries and they are as bad if not worse.
I prefer to look at the big picture rather than isolated events before I claim "they are all like that"
On apostasy - you clearly are struggling to find any recent examples or you don't know what it actually means
You have a serious slant that you struggle to see beyond and I feel it is irrational, we live in the same society and you have taken particular view point regardless of the facts.
You hang on the words of some extreme scholars and then apply to that to the whole of Islam. The way I see it is people only hang on to their holy books to further their own agenda not for the good of everyone.
Homosexuals have existed ever since humans have existed and all religions have taken a particular hatred for them, Islam is no different and as I have stated before look at the African countries and they are as bad if not worse.
I prefer to look at the big picture rather than isolated events before I claim "they are all like that"
On apostasy - you clearly are struggling to find any recent examples or you don't know what it actually means
Then how come you never called out anything i posted in my videos's? Your own posts prove otherwise when all you did was attack EDL and ask for facts and numbers.And you say that i am hanging on the words of an extreme scholar and apply it to the whole of Islam? Excuse me but they can issue Fatwa's and when you get one issues against you, then you can tell everyone about how only a minority of muslims follow it.You are seriously deluded and naive about Islam.And you have fallen hook line and sinker for what they want you to believe.Just go and ask them about homosexuals and free speech and you will find your moderates to be a minority, a quiet easily bullied minority who cannot even condem or rally over the murder of a british man on british streets.
Why should i bother trawling apostasy when you clearly have only one agenda here and always seem to want your questions answered? Bit of a fallacy asking if i know what apostasy means on a forum when i could google it if i never knew the meaning.I have spent months looking into Islam, how much time have YOU?
Do u know what a Sura is? A Fatwa? A Hadith? You realise that Quran also adds into this toxic mix?
Incredible that you want to live in peace and without bigotry when Islam is the most bigoted and non peaceful religion the world has ever known.Go read some Hadiths please or perhaps go talk to people who have spoken out like Dawkins.You are aware they attacked Dawkins of all people and called him a racist? Are you aware of the Satanic Verses affair? What is happening now to Tommy Robinson is nothing new is happened on a world wide scale with the Rushdie Satanic verses event.Except instead of getting death threats, and rape threats against his wife he just had assasination and grenade attempts on his life for attempting to make humor of the prophet.
Imagine what would happen to me in public if i asked the rational question which is, If Islam condems fornication what are Martyr's doing in paradise with 28 virgins? Book reading sessions? Do they have one huge wedding for him to marry all 28 virgins to avoid fornication?
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I have no agenda either but personally I like to call out closet paedophilia wherever I see it.
See, the same cheap trick being used against you
Who? quote somebody so they can reply.
I'm not struggling with anything, don't pretend you are omniscient here. None of you have challeged anything in any of my posts (or Rofflays), you just chuck around words like bigot and racist as if that was an "argument", you are a joke.
No, I'm applying it to the people that say it and the people that follow it. Hence the polls
Actually I'm sick of this hiding behind "Extreme Scholars" BS, there are thousands of these nutjobs out there, so to me they look more like mainstream scholars.
If members of parliament call for the death of apostates, then they are mainstream too. To be extreme you have to be at the sidelines, not running the fracking country!!!
Christians look OK to me, it's all jam, cake and handing out blankets to the homeless. To be fair muslims hand out alms to Romanian beggars, which is why we can't get rid of them via deportation as they keeep coming back for more alms.
And when right wing Christians present their views they are also shot down in here.
Yes the death rate amongst Christians in Muslim African countries is appalling, hundreds every month I think.
Dream on, nobody is saying that.
here you go
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/28/youcef-nadarkhani-execution_n_986139.html
also Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Tasleema Nasreen and Sofia Allam
Necati Aydin and Uğur Yüksel
Abdul Rahman
Salman Rushdie
Hashem Aghajari and Hassan Youssefi Eshkevari
Mohammed Hegazy
Maher Ahmad El-Mo’otahssem Bellah El-Gohary
Farag Foda
Ghorban Tourani
Kamil Kiroglu
Unfortunately I don't have names for all those killed on the quiet by peasants under the guise of 'honour killings' or Iranian death squads, but as you see I'm not exactly struggling to find examples of muslims killing others in the name of their religion.
The Council of Ex-Muslims of Britain was set up in 2007 and represents former Muslims who fear for their lives because they have renounced Islam
In 2004, Prince Charles called a meeting of leading Muslims to discuss the issue. All the Muslim leaders at that meeting agreed that the penalty in sharia is death. The hope was that they would issue a public declaration repudiating that doctrine, but not one of them did.
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I ask for facts and numbers as they tell the real story rather than slanted interpretations by commentators who have an agenda. I can draw my own conclusions rather than be told what to think.
I am no scholar in Islam and as I understand there is no single entity to provide a universal interpretation of what is written in the Koran, hence why there are as many sects in Islam as there are in Christianity all with what they interpret. Like I said these interpretations are made by men who want to further something for themselves rather than the community.
If these fatwas are so binding then why is Salman still alive given there are 1 billion Muslims baying for his blood, this all kicked off in the 80's - like I said the facts speak for themselves.
The Mrs and I saw Richard Dawkins on his book tour for the God Complex a few years ago and he was equally disparaging about all religions but guess which narrative has hung around - I wonder why ?
I have no fear that Muslims will take over our society, as that will never happen they just don't have the numbers
I am no scholar in Islam and as I understand there is no single entity to provide a universal interpretation of what is written in the Koran, hence why there are as many sects in Islam as there are in Christianity all with what they interpret. Like I said these interpretations are made by men who want to further something for themselves rather than the community.
If these fatwas are so binding then why is Salman still alive given there are 1 billion Muslims baying for his blood, this all kicked off in the 80's - like I said the facts speak for themselves.
The Mrs and I saw Richard Dawkins on his book tour for the God Complex a few years ago and he was equally disparaging about all religions but guess which narrative has hung around - I wonder why ?
I have no fear that Muslims will take over our society, as that will never happen they just don't have the numbers
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It cannot be changed, that is why no one has ever really challanged anything in the Quran.The Quran and sharia to them is the perfect law.If the prophet wore two left shoes there would be a Sura and all muslims would be expected to wear two left shoes as well.
And they are all going against god anyways.If they really wanted to appease him, according to the prophets night journey to heaven upon a horse, he met god and god commanded him and his followers to pray to him no fewer than 25 times per day.
Muhammed left the room and told Gabriel and he was instructed to go back to god not once, but twice to get the number changed down to five.
Actually the sects come from disagreement over who the sucessor was to the prophet and not disagreement on any fatwa as the fatwa against rushdie came from Iran and was obeyed by all Muslims ironcially.Sunni believed that it should be the next male in the family and the Shia believed it should have been muhammed grandson i think.But the Sunni murdered the grandson and as such the shia believe there are now no further Imams until one day at the end of the world the last Iman will appear with Jesus or muhammed? All the Imam's are Sunni and i have no idea on how alawites work as most of it is unkown to outsiders.
And Rushdie was in goverment protection for years mate.The British goverment has to put him into some kind of protection scheme and as i said he narrowly escaped a grenade attack.This is why Islam is so dangerous, a rogue cleric can whip up a mob in no time and no one person has the authority to condem him and he will quote the book and the book is final.
And if you think there is no threat now mate all i can say is how long has it been? Ten years? Ten years and its gotten as far as street movements all over Europe? What about the french generation identity movement? The EU have no plans to stop immigration from Muslim nations.And how does a Muslim get benefits and a home in the UK? He claims that he is homosexual and instantly is given a home.There have been attempts by theresa may to try to get them to prove they are gay but this is about to be over ruled under the human rights act to privacy.Wait ten more years and lets see how Luton's demographics shape up.But i guarantee you it will not be pretty reading.
I considered myself a Liberal Athiest and was ignorant of Islam until it came to Britain in numbers.Now it has me frothing at the mouth to get rid of it.And i am not even homosexual i cannot imagine what a gay person in the middle east must go through on a daily basis.Yet why should we give them asylum? Should we take in every poor person on the planet until we ourselves are destitute and crowded on a tiny Island? They do not even participate in responsible breeding either like in the west.7 billion people on the planet and only 740 million in Europe due to knowing not to have children we can not afford.They blame lack of condoms, i blame lack of education and morals which we are now expected to take care off.
Who gave this generation who will only be here for 100 years the mandate to change Europe for the next thousand years? We should vote UKIP and deport Blair,Cameron,Merkel and all the EU traitors to the middle east they are so fond of bringing to Europe.
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You haven't so far acknowledged anything said to you, or when any of your points are disproved, you just change direction?
Something like 500 in Islam (can't find the source atm), maybe 30 in Christianity? (excluding cults), Islam is a disorganised mess with no intent other than assimilation.
Facts?
He has police protection.
Other people connected with the book, not so lucky..
Hitoshi Igarashi died
Ettore Capriolo stabbed
William Nygaard, shot
Aziz Nesin was in an arson attack (37 others died instead)
Last year the bounty on Rushde's head went up $500K to $3.3m
Are those facts OK for you?
Christians huffed and puffed a bit, but muslims are still killing people, which group do you think deserves more attention?
The woman holding a pot of jam or the muslim nutjob holding a bloody cleaver standing in a UK high street.
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