Toyota Yaris GR4 4x4 Rally going into production.....

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2021 at 10:50

@Gibbo how do you think this stacks up against the current hot hatch competition i.e. M135i, A35, Golf R, S3, CTR etc as this seems to be the most comparable class it is pitching at albeit comming in at the cheaper end?

I do appreciate the GR is somewhat unique like the Evo was.

Chris1712 · 3 Mar 2021 at 10:51

I think it's totally unique tbh, I wouldn't think twice about any of the cars on that list. It has an X factor the others don't.

Gibbo · 3 Mar 2021 at 11:06

Scrutinize said:
@Gibbo how do you think this stacks up against the current hot hatch competition i.e. M135i, A35, Golf R, S3, CTR etc as this seems to be the most comparable class it is pitching at albeit comming in at the cheaper end?

I do appreciate the GR is somewhat unique like the Evo was.

The GR is more akin to a Porsche GT product, but with a rubbish interior and hot hatch proportions, though the hips are pretty wide.

If you want to drift, M135/140i, if you want badge snobbery, pops and bangs and section 59's A35/A45, if you want drag strip winner and bank robbery car, Golf R, want similar to Golf R but more understeer and better noise, RS3. Want a track weapon for dry days, CTR. Want an all year round B road blaster that also works extremely well on track in all conditions, Yaris GR. The Yaris is a very special car, built by engineers, I think its closest rival is the CTR as they have a similar ethos of been drivers cars. The advantage the Yaris has though its a Yaris by name it is actually a totally bespoke car built from the ground up, whereas most of the other hot hatches are just regular models with bigger engines and some trick suspension.

Its a bit like the best convertibles are those built as convertibles from day one, compared to a coupe with the roof chopped off. The GR Yaris was built to be special from day one with a clear plan to go and win rallying, if Toyota do limit the numbers it will be one very special car and values in the future could explode, if they keep on producing them then the values will no doubt get hit just like any other hot/hyper hatch.

Like Chris says, it has the X factor as to speak and the fact you can move the power around changes the driving experience somewhat.

Nasher · 3 Mar 2021 at 11:45

If you want to drift a GT86 is made for that from the factory. It's really easy to control in a slide.

Simon · 3 Mar 2021 at 12:11

Nasher said:
If you want to drift a GT86 is made for that from the factory. It's really easy to control in a slide.

Prius tyres help with that

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2021 at 12:15

Gibbo said:
The GR is more akin to a Porsche GT product, but with a rubbish interior and hot hatch proportions, though the hips are pretty wide.............Like Chris says, it has the X factor as to speak and the fact you can move the power around changes the driving experience somewhat.

Thanks that's a helpful insight. Definitely sittingly uniquely in it's own market segment then.

I have been considering a GR for a while but I suspect in reality it won't be suitable and as much as I would love to own one, I need a balance of practicality with performance being a secondary trait.

Nasher · 3 Mar 2021 at 12:32

Simon said:
Prius tyres help with that

But also actual decent engineering on the suspension and chassis. Not just a different body slapped on top of a generic platform like certain alternatives.

Gibbo · 3 Mar 2021 at 12:41

Scrutinize said:
Thanks that's a helpful insight. Definitely sittingly uniquely in it's own market segment then.

I have been considering a GR for a while but I suspect in reality it won't be suitable and as much as I would love to own one, I need a balance of practicality with performance being a secondary trait.

Yeah it is not too practical, it has back seats but any adult in back won't be comfortable, ok for smaller people. Boot is also tiny, but seats do fold down giving a larger boot. Interior quality is poor.

Just took it out for a lunch time blast to grab some food via the long route, the brakes, OH MY the brakes, think this car has the best stoppers of any car I have owned, beats the 458 and even my 911/M3 just so powerful but the modulation/feel is amazing, bit annoying that when you do brake hard the hazards flash but there again its probably for the best.

The cars ability to change direction is uncanny.

Made me smile though on my little run out, had a Skoda estate tailing me for a while and he pulled along side and wound his window down and was like wow that thing is stunning, this was coming from a 50+ man and he even said it sounded good which because it sounds amazing on the inside, but on the outside I thought it was silent but it must make a bit of noise when your accelerating. The best bit was when he asked what it was followed by what engine is in it and I said a 1.6l 3cyl, the look of utter shock on his face.

Then heading back towards office another guy hanging is head out of his car at a set of lights with a big thumbs up and wow stunning car.

It seems very well liked by the public, even though so far they don't know what it is but whenever I park it I do look back at it. Upto 250 miles now.

Yaayuh! · 3 Mar 2021 at 13:59

Gibbo said:
Yeah it is not too practical, it has back seats but any adult in back won't be comfortable, ok for smaller people. Boot is also tiny, but seats do fold down giving a larger boot. Interior quality is poor.

Remove the rear seats, lighten the car up some more and have a bigger boot, win-win.

Gibbo · 3 Mar 2021 at 14:09

Yaayuh! said:
Remove the rear seats, lighten the car up some more and have a bigger boot, win-win.

Yeah maybe, not sure what they weigh but for now gonna leave them put.

I'd say though for those who want to drop weight:
- Lithium Battery - 15-20kg
- Rear seat delete - 5-10kg
- Toolkit if it has one, I've not looked to be honest.
- Titanium full exhaust system - 15kg or so

So its probably possible to drop nearly 50kg or so without dramatically spoiling the car, then I guess your looking out front bucket seats, further interior deleting, but this car is so akin to a Porsche GT product that Toyota already did most of the work for you, so now its just a case of enjoying it.

Frozennova · 3 Mar 2021 at 15:31

Gibbo said:
The GR is more akin to a Porsche GT product, but with a rubbish interior and hot hatch proportions, though the hips are pretty wide.

If you want to drift, M135/140i,

Not anymore. M135 is on a FWD platform

Nasher · 3 Mar 2021 at 15:40

Yea, they ruined that. You'd have to be mad to buy a new one over the old one. It has nothing going for it at all, not even good looking. Just a trumped up shopping cart :/

Frozennova · 3 Mar 2021 at 15:48

Nasher said:
Yea, they ruined that. You'd have to be mad to buy a new one over the old one. It has nothing going for it at all, not even good looking. Just a trumped up shopping cart :/

Not really, it's still Haldex 4WD with a proper mechanical diff up front. They've pitted it against the Golf R and reviews speak very favourably of it

Nasher · 3 Mar 2021 at 15:51

Frozennova said:
Not really, it's still Haldex 4WD with a proper mechanical diff up front. They've pitted it against the Golf R and reviews speak very favourably of it

I'd still rather have the Golf though, because I'd have to wear a bag over my head to drive a modern BMW.

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2021 at 16:05

Nasher said:
Yea, they ruined that. You'd have to be mad to buy a new one over the old one. It has nothing going for it at all, not even good looking. Just a trumped up shopping cart :/

I mean this isn't true really is it? There is loads going for it - the interior is an enormous improvement on the previous model for a start.

Jonnycoupe · 3 Mar 2021 at 16:11

Nasher said:
I'd still rather have the Golf though, because I'd have to wear a bag over my head to drive a modern BMW.

Sock in your mouth would suffice

Simon · 3 Mar 2021 at 16:40

Nasher said:
But also actual decent engineering on the suspension and chassis. Not just a different body slapped on top of a generic platform like certain alternatives.

What happened to the reference to a TT? I though it was odd you mentioned that when no one was even talking about a TT in this thread, seems you did too - hence the edit.

Everyone got a hard on for the GT86, the fact is Honda did much better with the S2000, 15yrs before it was launched. The GT86 was so underpowered they even had to stick Prius tyres on it to make it 'fun'.

I think the GR4 seems to have some real credentials but why the comparison was made between the GT86 and GR4 was due to Toyotas recent cars and hype. The GR4 seems to be living up to it much better. No idea why TT and now BMWs are coming into it?

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2021 at 16:43

Gibbo said:
Yeah it is not too practical, it has back seats but any adult in back won't be comfortable, ok for smaller people. Boot is also tiny, but seats do fold down giving a larger boot. Interior quality is poor.

Thanks, this is the honest opinion I have been looking for. It certainly doesn't detract from the car but shows it's definitely not the right one for me.

It's been hard to establish this from the online reviews /vids.

Frozennova said:
Not anymore. M135 is on a FWD platform

Nasher said:
Yea, they ruined that. You'd have to be mad to buy a new one over the old one. It has nothing going for it at all, not even good looking. Just a trumped up shopping cart :/

Frozennova said:
Not really, it's still Haldex 4WD with a proper mechanical diff up front. They've pitted it against the Golf R and reviews speak very favourably of it

[TW]Fox said:
I mean this isn't true really is it? There is loads going for it - the interior is an enormous improvement on the previous model for a start.

I feel bad for even mentioning the M135i xDrive now and in the Yaris GR thread but following on from Gibbo's comments, in reality this ticks all the right boxes for me, leaving the Yaris as a pipedream. The 128ti on front wheel drive looks to be a current pricing sweetspot but that's competing against the Golf GTI and equivalents.

Given the state of our roads and weather, I do feel a 4WD system in a hot hatch is almost essential for real world daily enjoyment.

Nasher · 3 Mar 2021 at 17:31

[TW]Fox said:
I mean this isn't true really is it? There is loads going for it - the interior is an enormous improvement on the previous model for a start.

The interior is the last thing I care about on a performance car.

Gibbo · 3 Mar 2021 at 17:36

Scrutinize said:
Thanks, this is the honest opinion I have been looking for. It certainly doesn't detract from the car but shows it's definitely not the right one for me.

It's been hard to establish this from the online reviews /vids.

I feel bad for even mentioning the M135i xDrive now and in the Yaris GR thread but following on from Gibbo's comments, in reality this ticks all the right boxes for me, leaving the Yaris as a pipedream. The 128ti on front wheel drive looks to be a current pricing sweetspot but that's competing against the Golf GTI and equivalents.

Given the state of our roads and weather, I do feel a 4WD system in a hot hatch is almost essential for real world daily enjoyment.

If it was not for my Mrs I'd have forgotten about the GR in all honesty, been more interested in sorting house recently and searching for a classic car. But I re-checked about them and thought OK this does look serious, the first wave of youtube videos came out and it seem to good to be true, so I put my order in.

Got the car now and its epic, its fine as a daily but its far from perfect, cheap interior (seats are great though), fuel consumption to me is great, but as Simon allured too its nothing special also but its probably not much worse than other hot hatches.

M135i X-Drive will be far more practical due to more interior space and a far superior interior quality. Its a BMW and it should still be a nice car to drive.

But if looking at brand new M135i X-Drives, maybe also look at some used approved BMW's at a similar budget see what else you can maybe get, F80 M3, M340i maybe, no idea if they are a similar budget but if they are I'd be hunting down an F80 M3 in fire orange or one of the other bright colours, a lot of car for the money now they've done some depreciation and BMW approved used will still come with a warranty.

If / when I sell the M5 and if I still want another 4 door saloon type car the F80 M3 / Alfa Quadrifoglio will be high on the list but as the M5 just cost me a bit of money to sort out I am keeping it for a while to enjoy.