UEFA Euro 2024 Final Spain v England ** spoilers ** [Sunday 14th July 2024]

HangTime said:
England played Tunisia in the group stage (I remember because it was an early kickoff and I had an A-level exam that day, so was trying to avoid hearing the result but overheard cheers in town), there's no way we could've played them in the last16.

edit: Looking up who Romania faced, they met Croatia who were a good team at that point with Suker and finished 3rd in the whole tournament. Don't forget Croatia thrashed Germany 3-0 in the quarterfinal and also beat an elite Dutch team (who ignoring a loss on pens to Brazil were undefeated in every match except Croatia, they also beat Argentina thanks to Bergkamp)
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Vandle said:
We beat Tunisia in the group stage. Shearer scored.
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My bad, in my defence it was a long time ago!
 
SimonRigga said:
I'm no fan of Southgate, but does anyone on this forum know for certain that it's Southgate that is telling his players to play like that??

Or is it just the players themselves and their own fear of failure at this level?
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It is natural for a team losing 1-0 to "go for it", especially in knock out competitions.

It is natural for a team to be winning to sit back a little, even against Serbia.

I will give him the benefit of the doubt that players felt more natural to sit back a bit after they equalise.

But what was telling was when England has the momentum in games, then equalises. Especially in the final, he was bringing on Trippier and Gallagher. They were ready to be brought on. Trippier for Shaw....I'll give him that, not match fit, and played 80mins....fine. But Gallagher? Unless he planned to play Gallagher in a surprising No.9 role, that isn't a move you make to go on to win the game. That is a move you make to keep the score as is. It was like the 80th minute, just after we scored, just before Spain scored the winner.

What was Southgate's thinking at that point?

If you are the 11 players on the pitch and see that substitution being lined up, what would you think Southgate's plan would be, without him telling you "play like that". His substitutions would give the players signals how he wants to play, and that isn't "go on, go win this game now we have just equalised, I am sending Trippier and Gallagher to help!". Oh really?!

His signals clearly are "hold on until extra time, and don't lose this game."

Rather than "Go on, go and win this now we are on top."
 
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Raymond Lin said:
What was Southgate's thinking at that point?

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I don't disagree with anything you've said. Southgate is a defensive manager, and you can tell that from his starting 11 and his substitutions, but there are still 11 (apparently very good, some world class) players on the pitch. When you watch the very best sides, it's usually one or two players who set the tempo, and control where the team play on the pitch. Whereas with England and the whole "We have 11 captains" thing, i'm not sure we have what we need.

As far as I could tell the only player trying to get us further up the pitch was Pickford. (as sad as that is :( ).

Lets all hope a change of manager is all it's going to take, i'm just not 100% certain that it will be a fix for the mental side of things when playing for England.
 
omnomnom said:
Carragher himself said when England had an attacking throw in at 1-1 Southgate shouted to throw it backwards. Couple that with Gallacher and Trippier being readied when England equalised suggests that yes, its Southgate.
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That was the throwing we had near Spains corner flag, it was thrown back to a defender who passed back to Pickford who then booted it out of play, that passage of play basically sums up England under Southgate.

How many times in matches in the 8 years under Southgate have you thought wow what a performance?
 
Southgate is a manager from a different era, a bit like Mourinho. Played not to lose.

The problem for me isn't so much his tactics, but his tactics and the players at his disposals don't really match. He is trying to put square pegs into round holes. If the majority of English players play in teams that plays a similar system as Southgate week in week out, perhaps they would be used to it. But he is asking players to play differently, at least to me he is. The top teams in the PL don't play defensively anymore, they are possession teams, they are pressing teams. They are used to it.
 
Mixed opinions really. We've supposedly had world-class managers before him and none have ever made it as far or as often. So is it because of him, or because of the team.
 
A day of celebration for the footballing world, as SouthGate ball is no more.

No doubt he took us further than anyone before him and he deserves credit for that, but we must also never forget the atrocious football we've had to watch under him, and him bottling and losing every single game when it mattered against anyone half decent.

Now let's all hope he ends up at Man Utd next season. :cry:

x.com

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Great game, brilliant atmosphere, really enjoyed it. Walked back in the front door at 10pm last night!

I personally think a change of management isn't the way forward, and that we've had a pool of fantastic players for the last 20 years, but can't get over the final hurdle with whoever is in charge, and this is the closest that we've got.

Gareth has had a huge amount of criticism his way for someone who's taken us to 2 finals in 2 tournaments (Can't believe people are putting it down to luck), and I don't think people realise how good he was.

However, people are stubborn, and even when later on down the line, we're no closer to a trophy despite Graham Potter or Eddie Howe or "Big Sam" taking charge, I don't think that most will admit that Gareth was a great coach that changed the face of a frankly abysmally organised England side in to something people can get behind and support as a real prospect for tournament success.

Looking forward to the world cup anyway :)
 
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