Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Screeeech said:
Compared to Russia using endless convoys of trucks, how would Western forces do it differently?

I assume there would be a lot more air power involved? Chinooks and the like? establish forward bases then work backwards from there?
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For a starting point, our logisitics (and the US) were well tested during Iraq and Afganistan. We certainly laid out a large military force in those two countries without relying on road convoys throughout Europe
 
mid_gen said:
Seeing all these satellite photos of Russian positions, does make me wonder if they might use one of their anti-satellite weapons to take one out. Being a civilian rather than military target might make it palatable.
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Given all the lies and BS coming out of Russia, surely it could be twisted to be an "act of war against Western assets" or something and a nuclear reaction threatened? :D
 
redeye said:
Also what happened to being stuck in the mud, flat batteries, no fuel, no food, freezing weather for days and flat tyres? Press have been reporting it as if the whole convey was stuck for weeks and wouldn't move. Some were even saying vast areas had been flooded on purpose so no chance of that changing until mid spring.

So they've found a way out at least with some of the armour I assume. No good at all, there's a huge amount of it in that convoy. Can only hope updated Sat images help the Ukranian's target those. Clear they are a significant threat to Kiev.
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You've conflated a few events there (the flooding was somewhere else entirely). But they've done exactly what was expected to be required - reverse.
 
deuse said:
The EU being weak again.
Glad we're out...
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God your such a broken record

As has been stated before, UK reliance is very low around 5% gas and 8% oil, mainland europe is much much higher

Unless your a total idiot you cant expect supply chains that large and significant to be fixed over night
I guess we could freeze all the europeans to death instead, that would teach Russia right
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
God your such a broken record

As has been stated before, UK reliance is very low around 5% gas and 8% oil, mainland europe is much much higher

Unless your a total idiot you cant expect supply chains that large and significant to be fixed over night
I guess we could freeze all the europeans to death instead, that would teach Russia right
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So as normal some of the EU want's everyone to do something about russia. But not them.
They want cake-eat it-and extras.

I have come off gas and I'm about to get my gas metre took out.
 
Screeeech said:
Compared to Russia using endless convoys of trucks, how would Western forces do it differently?

I assume there would be a lot more air power involved? Chinooks and the like? establish forward bases then work backwards from there?
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As Werewolf touched on Russian tends to require a larger amount of consumables, but as much as anything as a generalisation the West has focussed on smaller, hard hitting forces making the most of the available man power and combined arms operations while Russia still leans towards using larger mechanised brigades to try and force through with cheaper hardware but more of it. Part of the reason Russia is likely losing a lot more men and equipment to make the same gains vs Ukraine who are fighting a more Western style.
 
deuse said:
So germany hasn't got any electricity?
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Affording it is the problem, but you know that considering you constantly blame Biden for the cost of petrol.

Anyway not going to derail the thread with that, i'll just say that it's hardly easy shifting policy when it requires years if not decades of infrastructure in place to do so.
 
StriderX said:
Affording it is the problem, but you know that considering you constantly blame Biden for the cost of petrol.
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The government can help easterly.
The germanys let over a million people in. So they must have the cash to do it.

Biden made 2 mistakes which both sides of the house agree with.
He stopped the keystone pipeline and gave the go ahead of nord 2.
 
Werewolf said:
I'm honestly not sure if the Russians have the capacity to keep the artillery supplied for sustained, large scale barrages.

They seem to be having issues with supplying food and fuel to their troops, and apparently their logistics corps is about half the size of the equivalent US/Western one, whilst a single barrage from one of their rocket vehicles uses a full truck load.
Their logistics setup from what I understand is designed to be working in conjunction with nearby railway resupply not advancing into another country and relying on the road network to keep units supplied, so they've got less vehicles dedicated to resupply than the US, whilst at the same time they're far more "consumable" heavy than the US due to their reliance on artillery, the end result is that it's much harder to keep their heavy/long distance stuff stocked up. That's before you consider that the vehicles carrying the supplies are basically unarmoured sitting ducks to anyone with a fairly light weapons, let alone people with stuff designed to take out armoured targets and you get a situation where every supply vehicle hit massively impacts the ability to carry on.
Apparently their fuel supply situation is even worse because they have even fewer bowsers in comparison to the US, again because their doctrine calls for laying things like fuel pipelines or rail supply to relatively near the front, so every time the Ukrainians take one out the effect on the Russians is amplified as it not only affects the front line fighting vehicles, but the ability to keep the supply vehicles running.

Apparently the Russians also do "push" logistics where the commanders at base decide what is needed according to the plan and send it forward, which is great if things are going to plan, but it means that if they're not, or even if it's going well but you use more of something than planned you can end up without it until command know, acknowledge and deal with it, the US (and much of the west) have much more flexibility with units requesting supplies and getting them as a high priority. It seems to be an offshoot of the way the western/Russian doctrine differs in things like artillery and air support requests where in the west it's often the case that someone right on the front line can call for it*, whilst in Russia it requires higher authority.

Basically from what I understand the Russians are in a bad place to maintain artillery barrages even if the Ukrainians only had light weapons, as they started out without enough of a supply train (in the area) to keep it up, and the Ukrainians seem to have been paying special attention to that supply chain.

The cynic in me suspects part of the reason they've been doing local "cease fires" the last few days is it gives them a few hours at least in which to move supplies up to the artillery, and for them to get ready for the next heavy barrage.

Also iirc Kiev was rebuilt after WW2 specifically to act as a fort/slow down invasions, with very large numbers of bunkers/reinforced hold outs which is very different to the sorts of areas the Russians have flattened in Chechnya and Syria, they might be able do massive damage and kill vast numbers of civilians who are caught out in the open, but potentially still have a lot of armed defenders left operating (and those would be armed defenders who have had access to enough anti tank weapons to take out armoured vehicles in the open, let alone in conditions that were designed to hostile to invading armour).



*They're trained to do so, and trusted to know where and when it's needed, and the risks if they're calling for it to be near them.
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Would be useful to just post the video where you got almost all of that from?
 
ci_newman said:
For a starting point, our logisitics (and the US) were well tested during Iraq and Afganistan. We certainly laid out a large military force in those two countries without relying on road convoys throughout Europe
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There were still plenty. My brother worked in Uzbekistan about 10years ago building motorways that were mostly used by US troops on route to Afghanistan.

https://www.reuters.com/article/idINIndia-38872520090403

Can't find any articles now but I remember large convoys leaving from EU through Ukraine and Russia on the way to Afghanistan. Think it was mainly weapons and ammunitions that were airlifted and most of other stuff went by rail or road.
 
dave28 said:
No they are not another N Korea,
Russia have top 2 or 3 military power in the world and are allied with a top 3 military in the world and are largest country in the world.
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No they do not.

They have lots of nukes and Ukraine has shown how useless the Russian airforce and military in general is, they wouldn't last longer than what Saddam's men did in the first gulf war.

They have numbers...that's it.
 
deuse said:
So as normal some of the EU want's everyone to do something about russia. But not them.
They want cake-eat it-and extras.

I have come off gas and I'm about to get my gas metre took out.
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So as normal your wrong

They are planning to massively reduce their reliance during 2022.
I suspect events may well overtake them, but that may or may not happen
As everyone knows its a weird relationship in regards Russian gas and oil

Nations have been trying to get OPEC to raise output so that its easier to switch supply

You have come off gas?
Good news, once its out of your system you may be able to think more clearly ;)
 
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