Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Sankari said:
I continue to be completely unamazed that the people who argue we should be magically achieving peace between Russia and Ukraine are utterly unable to explain how this should be achieved, and what the respective outcomes would be for both sides.
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No, they are very clear that they expect western nations to withdraw support for Ukraine and let Russia steam-roll them. That is their vision of peace, totally ignoring the destruction, pillage and rape that Russia would cause on their way through.

Peace for us / them, not peace for Ukraine.
 
Sankari said:
I continue to be completely unamazed that the people who argue we should be magically achieving peace between Russia and Ukraine are utterly unable to explain how this should be achieved, and what the respective outcomes would be for both sides.
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Surely the opposite is also unamazing. The continuation of blowing people up, till there's no one left?

Now I'm not sure what the outcome is either way, but also I don't know how extreme loss and destruction of a country is good for any of the host nation people.

I find it difficult to understand a good ending story if we continue blowing a country up.
 
Begbie said:
Surely the opposite is also unamazing. The continuation of blowing people up, till there's no one left?
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No. The pro-Ukraine side wants this war to end, and we continue to insist that since Putin is the aggressor, he can end it any time he wants. Which is true. But since he refuses to end it, Ukraine must fight on. That's a decision forced upon them by Putin, because the alternative is to lose their country.

Begbie said:
Now I'm not sure what the outcome is either way, but also I don't know how extreme loss and destruction of a country is good for any of the host nation people.
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Ask the Ukrainians why they are fighting, then. Ask them about the decades they spent under Soviet rule. Ask them why they want to retain their sovereignty. Ask them why they don't just give up and let Putin take everything he wants.

Begbie said:
I find it difficult to understand a good ending story if we continue blowing a country up.
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The only people blowing a country up are the Russians.
 
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Begbie said:
Surely the opposite is also unamazing. The continuation of blowing people up, till there's no one left?

Now I'm not sure what the outcome is either way, but also I don't know how extreme loss and destruction of a country is good for any of the host nation people.

I find it difficult to understand a good ending story if we continue blowing a country up.
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Well it's a good job it's not upto you then.

90% of Ukranians want to fight and it's up to them to stop so either Zelenskyy concedes territory and possibly gets lynched or they crack the Russian skunners.

There is proof that the Russians have been torturing civillians all over the place including Children. Ukraine are not going to be the ones that stop, even if Western support goes away.

Best case scenario it goes back to a state that it was between 2014-2021 but at a larger scale.
 
Begbie said:
Surely the opposite is also unamazing. The continuation of blowing people up, till there's no one left?

Now I'm not sure what the outcome is either way, but also I don't know how extreme loss and destruction of a country is good for any of the host nation people.

I find it difficult to understand a good ending story if we continue blowing a country up.
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Because it is not just Ukraine, heroic though they are. Putin will not stop there as Poland and the Baltic states, then possibly France, Germany, Britain know. Give Putin an inch and he will take a mile for Greater Russia the successor to the USSR.
 
The mind boggles how some posters come to the conclusion that European nations and the US, by equipping Ukraine, are to blame for the war. They've reactively equipped Ukraine, despite all the intelligence that Russia were amassing an invasion force, they didn't start supplying weapons until after the invasion started.
 
Mekrel said:
The mind boggles how some posters come to the conclusion that European nations and the US, by equipping Ukraine, are to blame for the war. They've reactively equipped Ukraine, despite all the intelligence that Russia were amassing an invasion force, they didn't start supplying weapons until after the invasion started.
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And Ukraine repelled Russia's initial invasion without western support in the first place.

Ukraine is going to fight for every inch of their land / country because they know what Russia will do to their women and children if they are allowed to win. Removing western support doesn't stop the bloodshed, it just means more Ukrainians will die.

Unfortunately I fear that Russia may eventually succeed, they clearly don't care how many of their men die in the meat grinder. However Ukraine (and the rest of the world) need to make sure that Russia pays a very high price for that victory to stop them doing it again to anyone else in this generation.
 
RevBillyG said:
Nice one South Africa :/

www.reuters.com

Russia's warship with hypersonic missiles arrives for drills with S.Africa, China

Russia's flagship frigate equipped with new generation hypersonic cruise missiles has arrived in the South African port of Richards Bay for exercises that will include China, Russia's RIA state news agency reported on Wednesday.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com
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So why South-Africa is doing military exercises with Russia, anyone?

They have bought military stuff from RU?
 
Africa in general is a bit of a minefield when it comes to sanctioning them because it's unlikely to work very well and it will just ensure they're under Beijing's thumb even more solidly. Not sure what we should do about South Africa but there has to be consequences.
 
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